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Update For The Clueless (Giuliani, Socialism, and FR)
self | 26 April 2007 | self

Posted on 04/26/2007 11:34:18 AM PDT by batter

I thought I would put up this vanity for the benefit of those (myself included) who missed the recent 'dust up' over Giuliani.

Obviously, there have been strong feelings over the Republican candidates with te various sides knocking each other around on the issues and, unfortunately, on meaningless personal items.

Things came to a head about a week ago with Jim Robinson's post regarding Giuliani and FR's principles (the post has since turned into an undead/bugzapper thread). Ultimately, several Freepers (of various 'ages' - some old, some new) had their accounts terminated by request, opus, or zot (click here if you didn't understand the last couple of words).

I tried to wade through the thousands of posts in an attempt to determine where the 'line' was for getting booted from FR, given the fact that no strict Giuliani supporter 'purge' really occurred.

The best I can come up with is that it is fine to support Giuliani so long as it is not to come here to push liberal values of abortion, gun control, etc (see Jim's post) shared by the former NY Mayor, which directly conflict with the mission of FR. Those topics can, certainly, be promoted on other sites who's mission is to do so.

Basically, I think you can go ahead and support Rudy, but don't come here and try to convince FR to do a 180 on its mission and turn it into just another liberal or mushy middle site. The focus of FR has always been the opposite - convince others and refine the concervative message. Whey you visit someone's home, you abide by their rules, the same applies here. Its the same reason going to DUmmieland or Kos and trying to push conservative values (such as Zell Miller's) won't give you a long life expectancy on their sites.


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: giuliani; update
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I hope my interpretation is correct.

I would appreciated it if those involved would clarify this (I'm thik skinned let me know if I'm way off).

Again, this is for my own, selfish, benefit as well as others who missed this episode.

I respectfully also ask that folks please refrain from hijacking this thread with anit-Rudy/Romney/McCain/Hunter/Thompson... rants.

Note: I'm in the middle of break in training I'm attending. I can't respond immediately, but will check back tonight. Again, I thought it would be worthwhile to clarify things for those 'out of the loop' on this.

Finally, my disclaimer (things I'll probably get asked):


1 posted on 04/26/2007 11:34:21 AM PDT by batter
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To: batter

Yep. That’s what Jim said. But why do we need a new thread?


2 posted on 04/26/2007 11:35:40 AM PDT by ElkGroveDan (When toilet paper is a luxury, you have achieved communism.)
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To: ElkGroveDan
But why do we need a new thread?

Uh huh...good question.

3 posted on 04/26/2007 11:37:48 AM PDT by rhombus
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To: Jim Robinson; EternalVigilance; avacado; Peach; Howlin; Spiff; potlatch; GovernmentShrinker

If y’all have a moment. Did I get it right or no?


4 posted on 04/26/2007 11:38:22 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: batter
Wonder if he will pull a Bush with Rudy. Was 100% opposed to Bush, said he would be a disaster for America. And worse. But then put in place a no Bush bashing policy and praised Bush to the high heavens.

As big a flip flop as Kerry could ever pull.

5 posted on 04/26/2007 11:38:40 AM PDT by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: ElkGroveDan

I know what you mean - I just wanted to put something up that could concisely (I hope) answer the inevitable questions of what happened to [insert FReeper]? and What’s all this about the Giulianibots? etc etc.


6 posted on 04/26/2007 11:39:58 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: batter

thik = thick...doh!


7 posted on 04/26/2007 11:41:29 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: batter

“Did I get it right or no?”

*smoochie* *smoochie* *smoochie*


8 posted on 04/26/2007 11:41:36 AM PDT by leadpenny
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To: batter

Rudy has caused a schism that both sides can see I think.


9 posted on 04/26/2007 11:43:12 AM PDT by kinoxi
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To: leadpenny

Not trying to smooch, I think I included a reasonable subset of those involved on the thread, or ‘in the know’ of the finer details of FR. If not, please ping anyone else who knows if I got it right or completely missed it.


10 posted on 04/26/2007 11:44:23 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: batter
Did I get it right or no? - You title your piece for the CLUELESS and then ask if it is right? I appreciate your thoughts but disagree with you assessment of those of us that read it.
11 posted on 04/26/2007 11:44:26 AM PDT by SF Republican
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To: batter
Wow, that purge list is huge now!

All those old freepers pushed abortion and gun control?

I’ll have to go back and look, had no idea.

BTW, what candidate is FR supporting for 08?

12 posted on 04/26/2007 11:44:42 AM PDT by roses of sharon
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To: SF Republican

I think your reading too much into the title. I’m not calling FReepers clueless. I hoped that would be understood, but I guess not.


13 posted on 04/26/2007 11:47:08 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: kinoxi

Yup!


14 posted on 04/26/2007 11:48:33 AM PDT by batter ("Always take the offensive...Never Dig in." - Gen Patton)
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To: batter
I think the Zell Miller parallel makes sense. Just as liberals reject Zell Miller’s (more conservative) principles and ideologies it’s, therefore, asinine to expect conservatives to embrace Giuliani’s liberal principles and ideologies.
15 posted on 04/26/2007 11:50:58 AM PDT by jdm
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To: batter; ElkGroveDan; rhombus

I don’t have a dog in this fight . . yet, but I am wondering why you haven’t replied to 2 and 3?


16 posted on 04/26/2007 11:51:26 AM PDT by leadpenny
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To: batter
From my reading, the threshold is:

  1. Do not attempt to redefine conservative concepts such as "pro-life" to justify support of Guiliani (or any other liberal or liberal-leaning candidate)
  2. Do not tear down good conservatives in an attempt to make non-conservative candidates look better by comparison; by extension this also applies to trashing the reputation of conservative icons like Reagan.

Regardless of how arguable the actual opinion is, I doubt anyone will get banned for saying something like one of the following:

  1. "I support Guiliani because I think he will do the best job in the WOT."
  2. "I support Guiliani because I think he'll appoint good judges."
  3. "I support Guiliani because he'll stand up to the Democrats."

17 posted on 04/26/2007 11:52:40 AM PDT by kevkrom
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To: ElkGroveDan
"Why do we need a new thread?"

Hey, it's Free Republic. That's what we do!!

18 posted on 04/26/2007 11:52:49 AM PDT by LS (CNN is the Amtrak of News)
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To: batter; jveritas
It looks good to me. But I am not a Rudy supporter and wasn’t involved at all in the Jim thread. My only point has been that if the presidential election comes down to Rudy vs. any Democrat, that I will not stay home or vote third party. I refuse to allow a Democrat to become Commander in Chief of this great country. I also refuse to make the job harder for my very conservative Congressman, John Culberson, from District 7 of Houston, TX — Bush 41’s old district.

I don’t take my ball and go home. I’m in it for real and deal with what is dealt. There is no lesson to be taught by having a Democrat for President in these very pressing times.

Just look at the House and Senate and the Iraq War bill that they just passed. Sorry, but I am not laughing at some “lesson” being taught with the House and Senate in full power to undermine this great country — and they are doing that right NOW! As we learn our “lesson.”

JMHO

19 posted on 04/26/2007 11:53:27 AM PDT by avacado
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To: roses of sharon
what candidate is FR supporting for 08?

At the moment, I think it's simply "not Guiliani".

20 posted on 04/26/2007 11:54:51 AM PDT by kevkrom
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