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Rudy Bumpo - Should Giuliani go hunting? How about asking the hunters?
National Review Online ^ | April 03, 2007 | Geoffrey Norman

Posted on 04/03/2007 8:19:26 AM PDT by neverdem







Rudy Bumpo
Should Giuliani go hunting? How about asking the hunters?

By Geoffrey Norman

Rudolph Giuliani has a problem with guns. Seems that when he was cleaning up New York, Sheriff Giuliani took a hard line on hoglegs. His constituents didn’t have a problem with this, or just about anything else Giuliani did to fight crime, since New York, in those days, resembled Deadwood on a slow night. As part of his campaign to make the streets safe, Giuliani’s administration sued 30 American arms manufacturers, and his police commissioner proposed a nationwide system of registration under which citizens would be required to demonstrate good moral character and a reason for owning a gun. (Interesting to imagine how the same government that can lose track of 600,000 people under deportation orders would handle that one.) Now that Giuliani is among the frontrunners for the Republican presidential nomination, the question is: Will his antigun record be a deal-breaker, especially with the kind of people who tend to vote in primaries.

There are, evidently, a lot of otherwise pro-gun people who hope not. They believe Giuliani could win, that he’d make a good president, and that it would be a shame if he were denied the nomination for the sin of coming down on the wrong side of the NRA. One novel idea for how Giuliani might overcome the antigun stigma came from the John Derbyshire, who is pro-gun and pro-Giuliani. Derbyshire, one of the more engaging, idiosyncratic writers around, suggested on “The Corner” that it might be a good idea for Giuliani to go on a hunting trip and come back making the right noises about the experience.

Recent presidents and presidential candidates have allowed themselves to be photographed in hunting garb. Bill Clinton posed in camouflage while holding a dead duck. John Kerry went him one better in a news photo that showed the candidate coming out of a cornfield wearing a camouflage parka and holding a dead goose.

On the Republican side, there was George W. Bush, campaigning to be governor of Texas, allowing himself to be filmed while taking part in a dove shoot.  Unfortunately, the camera caught him shooting a killdeer, a protected bird, which he had mistaken for a dove. Bush paid a fine. There was also the quail-hunting episode involving Vice President Dick Cheney. The less said about that, the better.

Still, it must be good politics to be seen as a hunter. Otherwise, politicians wouldn’t do it. They’d keep their gun collections as secret as their mistresses. (Sorry…that may not be the best analogy in the case of Giuliani.) So let’s consider this idea of sending presidential candidates (not just Giuliani) on a hunting trip somewhere to buff up their pro-gun credentials.

For years now, some friends and I have paddled into the Adirondacks in early October to hunt deer during the muzzleloader season. Everyone in our group hunts with flintlocks — no caps — so we are purists. The rifles we use would have been antiques by the time of the American Civil War but they shoot as straight now as they did when Revolutionaries used them to unhorse arrogant, red-coated British officers at places like Saratoga and made America possible. When you are teaching a kid about guns, the place to start is with a BB-gun. With an adult like Giuliani, loading and firing a flintlock is probably the way to be introduced to the mysteries of firearms and to learn why so many people feel what they do for guns.

So let’s run down the list of announced candidates. Would we want any of them, including Giuliani, to come into the woods with us for a week in the hope that they might learn something about guns and people who care about them?

Hillary Clinton? You gotta be kidding. Likewise John Edwards. He may be from a rural state and humble beginnings, but he is a trial lawyer through and through. Obama? Nah. Sensitive city kid. Of the other Democrats, only Bill Richardson is a possible. Seems like he doesn’t take himself too seriously.

Of the Republicans, I’m pretty sure Mitt Romney would be blackballed from our group for the simple reason that he waited until last year to join the NRA and then signed up for a lifetime membership. We might be for sale, but we don’t get bought that cheap.

McCain? By all means. Even if he didn’t like the guns or the hunting, he would make a superb companion, and you know he could tell some stories around the fire. And, then, there is Rudolph Giuliani, who now tells interviewers that he appreciates the hunting tradition, honors the Second Amendment, and appreciates why rural people feel the way they do about guns.

Tough call.

On the one hand, you know that in many ways, even though he is a city boy and will never be Rudy Bumpo, he is “one of us.” That he doesn’t feel the kind of sneering, condescending contempt for us that the people whose city he rescued — and who despised him for it — feel. We are not unworthy, uncivilized primitives in his eyes. And, of course, we admire his toughness and guts and the way he handled himself when he was mayor. Especially in the time after the towers came down.

Still … the man is a prosecutor. A remorseless prosecutor like the Jack McCoy character on Law and Order who, once he has someone in his sights, will find a law he broke or figure out a way to convince a jury of it, anyway he can. That, or scare him into making a deal. There is something intimidating and chilling to ordinary citizens about this kind of prosecutor. You get Patrick Fitzgeralds throwing journalists in jail and relentlessly pursuing the conviction of someone for lying to investigators about something that was not a crime. Prosecutors like that routinely stretch existing laws about guns into all sorts of grotesque shapes.

These guys play by Kafka’s rules. They aren’t the kind of people you feel comfortable with, standing around a campfire, passing a bottle of bourbon, and telling lies. Giuliani would probably be as relieved to get out of the woods and away from us as we would be to see him go.

Would any of us vote for him?

Hard to say. If he changed his views on gun control once, what is to keep him from changing them again? Either the law is clear or it isn’t. When something is a “right,” it should not be contingent on one man’s shifting political ambitions and jurisdictions. That kind of “right” isn’t much of one at all, and people who believe in the right to bear arms think of it as a whole lot more substantial and fundamental than that.

Rudy Bumpo could kill a buck, eat its liver, and have his face painted with the animal’s blood, and there would probably still be a lot of people who wouldn’t buy it.

— Geoffrey Norman is editor of vermonttiger.com.



TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Editorial; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: banglist; giuliani; hunting; rudy; rudygiuliani; rudyonguns
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1 posted on 04/03/2007 8:19:27 AM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem

If you arent a hunter dont pretend to be one. And never say “can I get me a huntin licesne here”?


2 posted on 04/03/2007 8:21:22 AM PDT by DogBarkTree (The United States failure to act against Iran will be seen as weakness throughout the Muslim world.)
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To: neverdem

I thought Kerry’s hunting shtick in ‘04 would close the book on that political stunt.


3 posted on 04/03/2007 8:22:17 AM PDT by AU72
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To: neverdem
Should Giuliani go hunting?

Should Fred Thompson go to the ballet?

4 posted on 04/03/2007 8:25:12 AM PDT by ElkGroveDan (When toilet paper is a luxury, you have achieved communism.)
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To: neverdem
"Will his antigun record be a deal-breaker, ..."

Not for me. For me, the deal-breaker is his ability to rationalize his violation of constitutionally-protected freedoms. That should be the deal-breaker for even marginally-conservative voters.
5 posted on 04/03/2007 8:25:29 AM PDT by LIConFem (Thompson 2008. Lifetime ACU Rating: 86 -- Hunter 2008 (VP) Lifetime ACU Rating: 92)
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To: neverdem

Send him out bird hunting with the VP....it won’t fool anyone any more than Kerry did.


6 posted on 04/03/2007 8:25:51 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly.)
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To: DogBarkTree

Make that, “Can ah git me a huntin’ license he-ah?”


7 posted on 04/03/2007 8:28:13 AM PDT by LiveFree99
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To: neverdem
LOL... Rudy Bumpo
8 posted on 04/03/2007 8:29:02 AM PDT by johnny7 ("Issue in Doubt." -Col. David Monroe Shoup, USMC 1943)
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To: neverdem

Rudy would never do it. Publicity stunts are for the Democrat candidates like Gore and Kerry.


9 posted on 04/03/2007 8:29:37 AM PDT by areafiftyone (RUDY GIULIANI 2008 - STRENGTH AND LEADERSHIP)
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To: neverdem

Actually, this sounds like exactly the sort of thing that an “I’m-smarter-than-the-rubes-in-flyover-country” Northeasterner would think might work (as John Derbyshire, the originator of the idea, is, living on Long Island). Hey, maybe if Rudy gets into a red pickup truck, the hicks and hillbillies will mistake him for Fred Thompson and vote for him, too!


10 posted on 04/03/2007 8:30:05 AM PDT by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (A member of the Frederalist Party)
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To: neverdem
I think all the candidates should ALL go huntin' with....either Ted Nugent or Jim Zumbo....and use an AR-15 for the press AND kill game with it. PHOTO-OP!
11 posted on 04/03/2007 8:32:02 AM PDT by ExSoldier (Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.)
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To: neverdem
Rudy Bumpo could kill a buck, eat its liver, and have his face painted with the animal’s blood, and there would probably still be a lot of people who wouldn’t buy it.

No kidding.

Giuliani's problem on this one is similar to Kerry's. As an effete New Yorker with such unabashed, zealous anti-gun track record, anything he does along these lines will come across as a silly fabrication.

12 posted on 04/03/2007 8:32:12 AM PDT by Alberta's Child (Can money pay for all the days I lived awake but half asleep?)
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To: neverdem
Rudy Bumpo could kill a buck, eat its liver, and have his face painted with the animal’s blood, and there would probably still be a lot of people who wouldn’t buy it

As has been pointed out innumerable times here and elsewhere, the Second Amendment is not about guaranteeing the right to own hunting weapons; it has to do with guarding against tyranny. Rudy could appear in public carrying a Barret .50 in one hand and a full-auto M4 carbine and I still wouldn't trust him.

13 posted on 04/03/2007 8:32:14 AM PDT by LiveFree99
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To: AU72

How do you ask a goose in Ohio to be the last to die for a failed presidential campaign?


14 posted on 04/03/2007 8:33:49 AM PDT by LiveFree99
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To: LiveFree99
I also find it odd that someone like Derbyshire would expect this kind of idiotic campaign to work well when he's talking about a guy who has probably never even owned any denim clothing.

(Seriously -- do a Google image search and see how hard it is to find any such thing on him.)

15 posted on 04/03/2007 8:35:32 AM PDT by Alberta's Child (Can money pay for all the days I lived awake but half asleep?)
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To: neverdem

send him out hunting the way he’d like to see people be required to keep they’re arms.
give him a lever action gun. trigger lock it, and put it in a locked safe. ammo has to be put in a seperately locked case.
take him out hunting for bear.


16 posted on 04/03/2007 8:36:29 AM PDT by absolootezer0 (stop repeat offenders - don't re-elect them!)
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To: Alberta's Child

I sure it’s MUCH easier to find pictures of Rudy in a dress or pantyhose than it is to find ones of him wearing denim or camo BDU’s.


17 posted on 04/03/2007 8:37:43 AM PDT by LiveFree99
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To: neverdem

Seen hunting in genteel country gentleman’s attire a la Kerry won’t fool me; seen gutting his freshly bagged buck might sway me.


18 posted on 04/03/2007 8:38:18 AM PDT by randog (What the...?!)
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To: neverdem
Should Giuliani go hunting?

With Cheney.

19 posted on 04/03/2007 8:39:56 AM PDT by Fierce Allegiance (One fish, two fish, I want to go catch bluefish.)
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To: Smokin' Joe
He is an anti second amendment gun grabber. He spent a lot of the “Peoples” money suing gun manufactures to remove legal firearms from citizens hands. He set himself up as part of those in power to whom a person had to justify that they had sufficient reason to own a handgun.
Rudy had no deal from the start, He has only been occupying space until the conservatives find a candidate that shares their beliefs.
No Republican can win without the gun vote. Unless the GOP becomes highly fragmented no Democrat will win by opposing firearms either.
The NRA has been very loudly “Silent” on the candidates this year. That silence should be screaming in Rudy’s ear that they will never back him again because of his past litigation and statements against the gun industry.
How would the public deal with Rudy if he came out and said that he will allow they their first amendment rights only after they had justified to the state that they needed that right?
How about if he said that there were way too many times that the first amendment was available to bad people and that the framers of the constitution should have taken this into account when determining who should have first amendment rights?
Could he get away with saying that way too many people have 4th amendment rights and we are going to have to curtail a good many of those rights?
It’s all really stupid when you line it up and bring it into the light. It’s not only stupid it is anti constitutional. Rudy is a nice guy and was a good mayor when we needed him but he is very liberal and that is not what the GOP and the conservatives of this country will vote for.
20 posted on 04/03/2007 8:40:40 AM PDT by oldenuff2no
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