Posted on 02/23/2007 7:05:51 PM PST by FairOpinion
I've never voted for Rudy Giuliani in my life. But I'm thinking hard about it now.
In both cases, I surprise myself.
The rest of America may know Rudy as "America's Mayor" for his ceremonial performance post-9/11, but for New Yorkers who lived through the Dinkins years, Rudy Giuliani is more than a guy who stands tall when the skyscrapers fall. By the late '90s, people were beginning to say that New York City was ungovernable: Remember the court-driven interest group spending, the disorder, the bums taking over the parks and the playgrounds and the street corners, spiraling welfare costs, the crime, the small business disaster, the high taxes, rent control, the South Bronx? New York was a disaster area, a poster child for what liberalism hath wrought.
The glittering cosmopolitan New York City we now live in, the one seemingly every college student in America dreams about moving to, is largely Rudy's gift, forged in the face of intense, daily, nasty invective from those who at the time insisted that to demand order and civility in a large city was to be a fascist.
Even Rudy's 9/11 performance tends to be misdescribed. It was not that he "stood tall" or didn't emotionally collapse. George Bush came to New York City and made graceful speeches about how we will rebuild the hole in the ground that still remains. What stood out for us in that dark time was not that the mayor of New York insisted we would triumph over this adversity, but that he didn't try to spin us about how unimaginably bad this sort of adversity was. He didn't try to soft-pedal the uncertainty, the chaos, the suffering the city was going through, and that gave us the confidence to believe that reality, terrible as it was, could in fact be faced.
I never voted for Rudy when I lived in New York City for one simple reason: abortion. I don't look for purity in politicians, just for some small pro-life reason to vote for a guy: Medicaid funding, parental notification, partial birth abortion. Throw me the slightest lifeline, otherwise I assume he just doesn't want the vote of people like me. Rudy never did. So I never gave him my vote. And of course it doesn't help now to recall the way Rudy treated his second wife, nor do I particularly want to imagine the third Mrs. Giuliani as Laura Bush's successor.
So I could have sworn, even a few months ago, that I'd never vote for Rudy Giuliani, in spite of my deep respect for his considerable achievements as mayor. So why would I even think of changing my mind? Two things: national security, and Hillary Clinton's Supreme Court appointments.
When I ask myself, who of all the candidates in both parties do I most trust to keep me and my children safe? The answer is instantaneous, deeper than the level any particular policy debate can go: Rudy Giuliani. And when I look ahead on social issues like gay marriage, the greatest threat I see is that the Supreme Court with two or more appointments from Hillary Clinton, will decide that our Founding Fathers, in their wisdom, created a national constitutional right to whatever social liberals have decided is the latest civil rights battle. It's hard to see a state that George Bush won in which Rudy Giuliani will not beat Hillary Clinton. And he will put a whole slew of new blue states into play: Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, to name just three. (The latest Quinnipiac poll shows Giuliani in a dead heat with Clinton in Connecticut.) Which puts people like me, who care very deeply about marriage and life issues, in the position of thinking hard about Rudy.
"If Rudy can beat Hillary, he can beat any of the other Dems too."
BTW, part of my point is that I dont think Rudy can beat Hillary! Your entire premise is false! She'll be "Mrs Slickster" to you after her goons dish the dirt on Rudy's divorces and affairs, and her phony 'genuflections' to moral piety will be enough to fool muddled but morally inclined.
By the end of the day, Rudy in this poll will slowly crawl close to his typical FR one-third cut, but fall a bit short. JimRob's jihad against Rudy has had some impact, but not much, maybe 5% of FR opinion.
And I guara-damn-tee-you that IF Rudy is the nominee, Mark Levin, as a patriot, WILL support him in the General Election.
Will you?
Character 'assassination' should be verboten at all times. aka 11th commandment.
But we should judge candidates on character, competence and vision, and raise factual points on all 3 areas.
Here are my standards:
http://travismonitor.blogspot.com/2007/02/who-should-be-our-next-president.html
It is a phony argument to say the 'only' standard is 'who will beat a Democrat'. We dont know who can best beat the Democrat, but Rudy has never been tested in a serious campaign outside the mayor's race, so its hard to assume he's best equipped for it.
Of course, I will support whoever is the nominee. But I will refuse to have a coronoation of a non-conservative without a discussion of conservative ideas and values in the election. WE NEED THAT DISCUSSION TO ADVANCE OR AGENDA, OR NO MATTER WHO GETS ELECTED, THE AGENDA BECOMES A LIBERAL ONE.
b. Enthusiastically support whoever the GOP nominates to take on 'das Beast' in November 2008.
Not this Republican voter for the past 37 years. Not for a Northeast gun grabbing liberal. Doesn't matter if said NE liberal is an R or a D. I'll vote 3rd party. Or write in.
You need to stop confusing your opinion with reality.
You're right - this is shaping up as another 1952-type race (except that the Rats don't have an Ike, thank God!!) - we have an uber-unpopular president, in time of war, and his party will get their butts whipped unless we can "think outside the box".
And if you do that there is only ONE name - RUDY.
A) What's "mainstream" about Ginsburg?
B) If you actually explain the unConstitutional nature of some of these rulings you might win people over to what we are trying to do to get courts back in shape.
"And I guara-damn-tee-you that IF Rudy is the nominee, Mark Levin, as a patriot, WILL support him in the General Election.
Will you?"
Sure.
If Tom Tancredo or Duncan Hunter is the nominee will you wholeheartedly support him and tell all your friends to vote for that fine American leader?
Elections are about WINNING
YES YES YES!! Your post about Reagan & the radical conservatives should be required reading for all FReepers before posting on this topic!
NAIL.
MEET.
HAMMER.
Recent poll shows Rudy with 52% -- over half is always significant, to 43% of Hillary in a matchup between the two.
"A) What's "mainstream" about Ginsburg?"
I didn't call Ginsburg mainstream. I said calling for her impeachment for making decisions we disagree with is not a good way to win over mainstream and middle America. That was pretty obvious from my post.
Rudy won't be the nominee becaue Republicans who have a clue won't vote for him.
There are at least 20 million + Conservatives who won't vote for him and several million moderates who don't like his stand on certain issues & won't vote for him.
Mitt is the real non starter.
Hillary won't be the nominee for the Dems.
She is already crashing & burning.
Bomama boy's training wheels will wear out & he will be back to Ill.
What is important is not what you think but why you think it to be true. That is: explain, provide data, etc. to illustrate your point.
Otherwise, yer just full of it...
BTW when you speak about a FReeper you need to address to them also
Italian - Americans in the NE vote Democrat.
In 2008 virtually EVERY SINGLE ONE will vote for RUDY (Remember that even Mario Cuomo warned the 'Rats to lay off Scalia in 1986!!!)
That's worth a point or two in the NE right there...
Well, I'd try arguments based on traditional core American moral principles, but that isn't likely to work on Giuliani supporters. So, once again I'll point out the pragmatic fact that, if nominated, Rudolph Giuliani will split the Republican Party and almost certainly guarantee wins by Democrats for the foreseeable future.
For as long as it takes for conservatives, the most coherent political coalition in America, to reassemble itself under other branding, that is.
That, sir, may not take as long as you might think. Read up on the Whigs.
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