It would appear that this man....
....has more in common with these two liberal men.......
..... then he ever had in common with this conservative man.....
And Happy 96th Birthday Anniversary, Mister President!
Posted on 02/06/2007 10:43:27 AM PST by ElkGroveDan
“Murder and graffiti are two vastly different crimes,” Rudy Giuliani once said. “But they are part of the same continuum, and a climate that tolerates one is more likely to tolerate the other.”
Good point, Rudy.
Now, what about a climate — not to mention a Republican presidential candidate — that not only tolerates, but allows unelected judges to legalize the practice of delivering a child until only its head remains within its mothers womb so the child can be killed by sucking out its brains?
What about a climate where same-sex couples are given the same legal status as married couples, whether the resulting arrangements are candidly called “same-sex marriages,” or are semantically papered-over with terms such as “civil unions” or “domestic partnerships”?
Apply the Giuliani Continuum to fundamental issues such as marriage and the right to life, and where does it lead?
Not where conservatives want America to be.
Rudy Giuliani’s observation about the “continuum” running from graffiti to murder was quoted in a piece in the winter edition of City Journal by Steven Malanga. The title of Malanga’s piece neatly encapsulates his argument: “Yes, Rudy is a Conservative — and an electable one at that.”
I believe Malanga is wrong on both counts. Rudy is neither conservative, nor electable — at least, not as a Republican presidential candidate.
As Malanga seems to define it, a politician dedicated to good police work and free-market economics qualifies as a conservative. “Far from being a liberal,” Malanga writes of Giuliani, “he ran New York with a conservative’s priorities: government exists above all to keep people safe in their homes and in the streets, he said, not to redistribute income, run a welfare state, or perform social engineering. The private economy, not government, creates opportunity, he argued; government should just deliver basic services well and then get out of the private sector’s way.”
But that’s not enough. While advocating law and order, self-reliance, and capitalism is laudable, it does not entitle a politician to a free pass for advocating other causes that are deeply destructive of American society.
While it is always wrong to take an innocent human life — whether on a New York sidewalk or in a mother’s womb — Giuliani is highly selective in applying this principle. In 1999, when he was pondering a run for the U.S. Senate, he was asked whether he supported banning partial-birth abortion. “No, I have not supported that,” he said, “and I don’t see my position on that changing.”
“I'm pro-gay rights,” he also said. Indeed, his position is so radical in this area that as New York City mayor he promoted a city ordinance that removed the distinctions in municipal law between married and unmarried couples, regardless of their gender.
“What it really is doing is preventing discrimination against people who have different sexual orientations, or make different preferences in which they want to lead their lives,” Giuliani said, explaining the ordinance to the New York Times. “Domestic partnerships not only affect gays and lesbians, but they also affect heterosexuals who choose to lead their lives in different ways.”
In other words, preserving a legal order that prefers traditional marriage and traditional families is “discrimination.”
Giuliani’s positions on abortion and marriage disqualify him as a conservative because they annihilate the link between the natural law and man-made laws. Indeed, they use man-made law to promote and protect acts that violate the natural law.
Given his argument that there is a “continuum” between graffiti and murder, you would think that Giuliani would understand the importance of the link between the natural law and the laws of New York City, let alone the laws of the United States. At the heart of Rudy’s “continuum” argument, is the realization that when society refuses to enforce a just law it teaches people to disrespect the moral principles underlying just laws.
The late Russell Kirk argued in The Conservative Mind that the first canon of conservatism is “[b]elief in a transcendent order, or body of natural law, which rules society as well as conscience. Political problems, at bottom, are religious and moral problems. … True politics is the art of apprehending and applying the Justice which ought to prevail in a community of souls.”
It is simply not justice to take the life of an unborn child. Nor is it justice to codify same-sex relationships so that, by design of the state itself, a child can be denied a mother or a father from birth, which is one thing legalized same-sex unions would do.
By advocating abortion on demand and same-sex unions, Rudy is doing something far more egregious than, say, defacing a New York subway train. He is defacing the institution that forms the foundation of human civilization.
That is not conservative.
Rudy will not win the Republican nomination because enough of the people who vote in Republican caucuses and primaries still respect life and marriage, and are not ready to give up on them — or on the Republican party as an agent for protecting them.
As much as I like the guy, I do not plan to support him in the primary for just the reasons this article lists.
I'm praying someone good will emerge and win the nomination.
God Bless poor Pat Robertson!! He is getting old. Jesus does not support Rudy!!! Ask me how I know ? I asked him and he clearly told me ,"No Rudy"
"In fact, an exit poll question from Pew in 2004 revealed that only 3% of voters named abortion as their top voting issue, 2% named religiosity, and 2% named gay marriage."
It matters more than you suggest.
According to USA Today, "barely one in five Republicans knew that he supports abortion rights and civil unions for same-sex couples." Most Republicans did not know that he was pro-choice.
When they were told about his stance on those issues, his support wavered. One in five Republicans said his views would "rule him out as a candidate" they could support. That included one-third of those who attend church every week, an important base of the GOP that makes up a third of party loyalists. Another 25% of Republicans said his views made them less likely to support him.
Yep, and they are all saying the same thing the CA RINOs did 4 years ago.
Wow, that's some long term thinking there.
Let's burn the house down with everybody in it... Then we won't have anyone that doesn't support the rights of the unborn.
No, and no.
I didn't realize that Rudy was for Partial Birth Abortion. There are alot of people are not for having the abortion itself under restricted circumstances, but aren't for PBA. Is this person just jumping the gun and labeling something on him? Is National Review becoming a clone of the MSM in it's skewing of the truth?
shhhh, don't mention that inconvenient fact to them.
Remember the mantra? "Vote for (R)nold because he can win, and the democrat would be worse!"
Now look what it did for california!
Everytime you post that misleading out of context made up unconfirmed home made chart.....I am more determined to get all my friends and family to vote for Rudi.
Not bad at all. I match you in the general election and in the primary, mine won in 80, 84, 88, 92, 00, and 04.
Of course he is going to say that.
It has nothing to do about "teaching a lesson", it's about living and voting my own conscience. The lesser of two evils is still evil. You vote for Rudy if you want and I'll use my right to vote as I want.
It would appear that this man....
....has more in common with these two liberal men.......
..... then he ever had in common with this conservative man.....
And Happy 96th Birthday Anniversary, Mister President!
---Rudy: "Marriage should be between a man and a woman. here is exactly the position I've always had."---
LIAR!
New York Daily News,
March 8, 2004
Rudy opposes gay nups ban:
http://www.usc.edu/schools/annenberg/asc/projects/soin/liveIssues/newyorkmarriage.html
""I certainly wouldn't support [a ban] at this time," added Giuliani, who lived with a gay Manhattan couple when he moved out of Gracie Mansion during his nasty divorce.
Giuliani took his gay rights stance just as speculation hits a fever pitch that he's in line to replace Cheney on Bush's ticket...
...Giuliani conceded he's "out of sync" with his party's conservative base, but likened himself to other moderate GOP stars like Gov. Pataki and Calif. Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger.
Even Rudy says Rudy isn't a Conservative. And even Rudy says Rudy thinks there should be gay marriage. So take Rudy's word for it: he's NO Conservative (calls himself a moderate), and he supports gay marriage (unless he's lying for votes).
"Second, I like him. I can't help it. I just do."
Nothing wrong with liking Rudy, but it isn't a valid reason to vote for him. We need to put our feelings aside and think of the long term consequences of having a liberal president, especially at a time when we have liberals controlling congress.
I no longer believe that an insufficiently anti-gay stance will hurt a candidate in the general election. The American people have softened considerably in their attitudes towards gays, if opinion polls are accurate. The primaries are another matter, however.
Personally, I'm more concerned about abortion and immigration.
I stopped reading here. We can debate how conservative Rudy is, I'm fine with that, and because of his position on abortion, I'm not supporting him at this time, although I could see myself changing my mind.
That said, saying Rudy is unelectable is an insult to my intelligence. No reasonable person thinks this, and there is no evidence to suggest this other then the way someone feeeeeelllllsss, and I don't really care how he feels. If anybody wants to prove to me Rudy is the wrong man, which I already am sympathetic to, do so with things that make sense, not obvious hyperbole to mask what you are really saying.
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