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Knowing the right question to ask your doctor
St. Paul Pioneer Press ^ | Jan. 30, 2007 | SAM ALLIS

Posted on 01/30/2007 10:05:04 AM PST by Caleb1411

Fact: A doctor in this country interrupts a patient, on average, in the first 18 seconds of a visit.

A prominent surgeon waited about a minute and a half before issuing his diagnosis to Jerome Groopman on his damaged hand. "He was dead wrong," says Groopman, who got four diagnoses from six surgeons. "And these are big names."

Fact: More than 15 percent — some say more than 20 percent — of medical diagnoses are wrong. At least half result in serious injury or death.

Groopman tells of a woman who saw close to 30 doctors for a constellation of ailments that gradually sapped the life out of her. She endured excruciating pain and was down to 85 pounds. Her immune system was failing and she had developed severe osteoporosis. All of them missed what was ailing her.

Finally, a fresh doctor asked a fresh set of questions. He listened to her and found that she suffered from a gluten allergy that prevented her from receiving the nutrients in the food she ate. After years of agony, she quickly recovered.

Fact: More than a quarter of all radiological tests, including CAT scans and MRIs, are misread. "Misdiagnoses are not rare at all," says Groopman, the noted oncologist and chief of experimental medicine at the Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, who assembled this data.

While the patient safety movement has led to major improvements in protocols to avoid systems errors, he points out, nothing has been done to address a more profound issue: how doctors think. And bad thinking is what causes countless mistakes. "No one talks about this stuff," Groopman says.

He is struck by the lack of independent thinking among the residents he leads on hospital rounds. "These are really smart people, and when asked for a diagnosis they download cookbook recipes on their computers," he explains. "If it's not that, they look blankly. How do I teach them how to think? I realized I didn't know how I think. No one ever taught me how to think."

Groopman addresses this touchy subject in a book, "How Doctors Think," due out this spring. In it are examples of bad thinking, including plenty of his own, that produced harrowing results. None of this is news to patients. Most of us know someone who has endured a misdiagnosis or have done so ourselves. My friend Barbara went through a year of agony because of one.

Groopman's first child developed a persistent low-grade fever and stomach pain at nine months. A doctor said not to worry, it's just a virus. The child's condition deteriorated, but the doctor remained unmoved. Eventually, Groopman and his wife rushed their son to an emergency room, where they learned the child had an intestinal obstruction that would have killed him had it gone untreated.

What went wrong here? The doctor sized up Groopman and his wife as neurotic first-time parents and built his diagnosis around that premise. At work, says Groopman, were two suspects common in these nightmares.

The first is what he calls anchoring — where a doctor interrupts you, seizes on a symptom or complaint, and declares, "It's this." This snap judgment anchors all ensuing thinking. The second he calls attribution, to which women are particularly vulnerable, where assumptions about a patient are attributed to bad data.

Groopman tells of a woman with a newborn child and two young children who complained about constant nausea and diarrhea. "The doctor looked at her and decided it was stress, that she was neurotic," Groopman said. "So he attributes all of her complaints to the stereotype he has in his mind. I saw her a few months ago. She had been diagnosed with a tumor in her intestine but had been taking Zoloft for a year and a half."

Time is an insidious agent in all this. "In today's medical environment, the clinic is a factory," he says. "It's a world of eight-minute visits. The mistakes are made in the moment. Doctors draw immediate diagnoses rather than listen and pursue leads. And when complaints persist, they all too often cling to their first thought and even discount contradictory evidence.

"It's impossible to figure out a difficult problem in eight minutes," he said. "A doctor has one eye on the clock and one eye on a computer screen as he types notes. The truth is, you can't think well in haste.

"There is no generic best treatment to a serious problem," he says: "We delude ourselves to think the answer is the systems solution — 'We'll give you an algorithm: if it's A then B then C.' You're got to know what A is in the first place."

Many in the medical community will bristle at Groopman's findings. Others will recognize the truth in what he says and, with luck, a few of the bean counters controlling medicine today as well. They can't dismiss the book. It is meticulously researched and written by a physician of stature.

"My argument is the solution for misdiagnosis is a patient or family member who knows how doctors think," Groopman said.

So what should we be asking our doctors, over and over?

"What else could it be?"


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; US: Minnesota
KEYWORDS: health; healthcare; misdiagnoses; misdiagnosis
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To: Caleb1411

Doctors - sometimes wrong, but never in doubt.


41 posted on 01/30/2007 12:07:58 PM PST by glorgau
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To: David

Some professors want to weed out medical students who don't believe in the theory of evolution. Seems a rather bizarre criteria to me.


42 posted on 01/30/2007 1:02:20 PM PST by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Williams
Well if the insurance companies, patients and the government will pay me for 30 minutes of care in the office I would gladly give that to my patients. They won't. Plus I would leave a whole lot of sick patients unseen. I have no doubt some diagnosis are wrong. Such as does the patient really just have a viral infection or is it bacterial and do they need antibiotics or are they going to demand antibiotics or come back in 2 days or call and demand antibiotics or go to the ER or another physicians who will give them antibiotics and then I will be forever known as the quack who did not give them antibiotics. Major misdiagnosis of major illness that is life threatening is much more rare. I do not know of an instance that I have done that. Could I do it? Of coarse, I am not perfect or even close and Medicine is definately not a concrete perfect science.
43 posted on 01/30/2007 1:13:37 PM PST by therut
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To: USMCWife6869

"I haven't found one doctor that will listen to me."

You unfortunately get to enjoy the socialized medicine now that we will all have some time in the near future.

You need to come to your senses, dig into your pocket book and go see as many civilian doctors as it takes to solve the problem.

I did that when I was in the military. I would not allow my pregnant wife to be seen by military doctors - you simply don't know what you are going to get.

As a kid and a military brat I remember being attended to by a vet one time at the military emergency room. That's a veteranarian, not a veteran.


44 posted on 01/30/2007 1:15:12 PM PST by RFEngineer
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To: David

Balderdash.


45 posted on 01/30/2007 1:15:57 PM PST by Pharmboy ([She turned me into a] Newt! in '08)
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To: Spok

Rich????????????

I just put in a prosthesis that took 4 hours surgery time. My fee is regulated at just under $1500. This fee includes my preoperative evaluation, the surgery and 90 days of follow up visits. Oh yeah I also went through premed, med and post med training.

The salesman( a 20 something pleasant chap) for the prosthesis drove off after the procedure making $5k for his morning "work".


46 posted on 01/30/2007 1:16:11 PM PST by Cyman
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To: anonsquared

Well I would tell you to find another physicians and you are fired. We are not sitting around drinking cokes. There are babies being born and emergencies that have to be taken care of. Plus there is the problem of not knowing how much time a certain patient is going to take. We have no idea MOST of the time. We try to ask why they need the appointment when it is made. This makes alot of people angry and they refuse to give a reason or they lie. There is also the patients who bring in one child who had a appointment then askes for the other 2 to be seen since they are there. Really I know it is irritating but I would just not have time for your complaining where others are more considerate.


47 posted on 01/30/2007 1:20:40 PM PST by therut
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To: Caleb1411

good reading
dont agree 100% but well worth the time spent reading:

http://www.amazon.com/Last-Well-Person-Despite-Health-care/dp/0773527958

http://www.discover.com/issues/jun-05/departments/discover-dialogue/


48 posted on 01/30/2007 1:22:10 PM PST by nascarnation
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To: USMCWife6869
Not one test, not one full exam even. They say she is just constipated, but these pains cause her to double over and she has days when she flat out can't walk from them. But it's all about the laxatives for them.

I had the same problem as a child . It was ...... constipation. I drank too much milk. Of course, the doctors never figured it out.

49 posted on 01/30/2007 1:26:28 PM PST by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: Cyman

$1500??? That doesn'r cover the malpractice.

I had a CINT for $250. Now that is a racket. I should have gone into that line of work. No blockage but the doctor says I have "old arteries". Great. I find out tomorrow what the damage is going to be. Looks like I picked a bad week to start eating steak.


50 posted on 01/30/2007 1:30:55 PM PST by AppyPappy (If you aren't part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: mesoman7

Because you can up and leave your car...


51 posted on 01/30/2007 1:42:45 PM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Cyman

Sorry. My comment was mostly tongue in cheek.

I remember when Hillary was trying to socialize health care, she testified in Congress that the average surgeon was making a shocking $180,000 a year. I felt that was actually low, especially since the same year Michael Jackson made 60 million.


52 posted on 01/31/2007 5:39:35 AM PST by Spok
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Self bump to read later


53 posted on 02/04/2007 11:55:17 AM PST by Clinging Bitterly (Oregon - a pro-militia and firearms state that looks just like Afghanistan .)
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