God has a plan for the Church and a plan for Israel and both plans will be worked out in His time.
I have a dear friend who I love who is an Orthodox rabbi- and a couple of weeks ago I asked him if he believed that he has an eternal soul and he said to me, "to be honest- I don't really know". I pray for this rabbi every day- that the blindness that is upon the Jewish people right now will be removed and that he will come to know that he needs his Messiah- Jesus Christ. But never do I try to "evangelize" him. I let him see Christ through me- and we have long conversations about things and I give him my point of view through the prism of knowing Christ- but I will not bring Christ up unless he initiates it. And I will never deny to him (or anyone) that I know Christ as my Savior.
Anyway, I believe that God will save my friend- but in His time and in His way. I believe that through my prayers God will see my friend and his family through the Tribulation and I believe that my friend will be saved at Jesus' Second Coming, just like God promised.
God has a special love for His chosen people- He has never abandoned them and He never will.
The following is a post by Freeper 'Stingray' (don't know if he's still around)from 5-6 years ago,for some reason he couldn't get it to post and mailed it to me to post for him.I kept it and am posting it again for the discussion in it's entirety.
God bless
Posted by Stingray...5/11/2001
For some reason, I can't get FR to accept this post. Could you please post it for me? Thanks... Sorry, but just one more post on the link between Revelation and it's significance to "end-time" Jews... Note the following:
"...I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last..." |
"To the angel of the church in Ephesus write: These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands:" |
I did a search of the O.T. to see if there had ever been any mention of the "seven stars" there. Not only did I find a passage, but it's in the book of Amos! Look!
"Seek the Lord and live, lest he break out like fire in the house of Joseph, and it devour, with none to quench it for Bethel, O you who turn justice to wormwood, and cast down righteousness to the earth! |
Now look at this:
Pleiades , in astronomy, famous open star cluster in the constellation Taurus; Six stars are easily visible to the naked eyeAlcyone (the brightest), Electra, Celaeno, Sterope, Maia, and Taygete. Known as the Seven Sisters, this group was named by the Greeks for the seven daughters of Atlas and Pleione; the seventh Pleiad was, according to legend, lost or in hiding. Many faint stars associated with the other six are visible with the telescope; one of these stars may have been much brighter and visible to the naked eye in ancient times, thus accounting for the many early references to seven stars. |
And again, from Strong's:
Strong's Ref. # 3598 |
The more I dig into the parallel passages and imagery between Revelation and the Old Testament prophets, the more thoroughly convinced I am that the message in the Book of Revelation is not for Gentile Christians, but for "End-time" Jews. Read the whole chapter of Amos 5! It's all about the prophet telling the children of Israel to straighten up their act, or terrible judgement would be visited upon them. Look at the message to some of those same "churches" in Revelation 2 & 3! It's the same message! Finally, look at this, from Revelation 1:
"I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. |
"Woe to you who long for the day of the LORD! Why do you long for the day of the LORD? That day will be darkness, not light."It will be as though a man fled from a lion only to meet a bear, as though he entered his house and rested his hand on the wall only to have a snake bite him."Will not the day of the LORD be darkness, not light-- pitch-dark, without a ray of brightness?"Amos 5:18-20 |
Again, I am convinced (but not yet dogmatically so) that the message in the Book of Revelation is not for Gentile Christians (we will be taken out of harm's way) but for Great Tribulation Jews. And the message is clear:
"Here, within these pages, is your Messiah, and He will save you from the impending 'day of the Lord' if you repent and believe." |
In truth, Revelation is a book that every Jew ought to be reading now, before it's too late. I welcome comments and critiques of these views. I really would like to know what y'all are thinking. Click on the link in post 140 or 149 for more on this topic. Later...
End Stingray's post.
I'll add something myself here to the discussion,to do with the church not being mentioned after the first few chapters of The Revelation.
Rev 4:6 "And before the throne [there was] a sea of glass like unto crystal..."
A 'sea' of glass before the throne?A sea sometimes represents a vast multitude of people,and a sea of 'glass' could just mean a calm multitude but one 'like unto crystal' sounds like something else.A sea that is crystal clear.ie: unable to conceal impurities.
I'm not dogmatic about this either,but that sea before the throne could be the church.
Psa 27:5 "For in the time of trouble he shall hide me in his pavilion: in the secret of his tabernacle shall he hide me; he shall set me up upon a rock."
I do believe in the pre-trib rapture scenario but I'm certainly not beyond being convinced otherwise.Just one more point though.It's often stated that this is a new doctrine,as though it can't be right because it's too recent.
Dan 12:9 "And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words [are] closed up and sealed till the time of the end."
Therefore the fact that the rapture may be a 'recent' teaching doesn't necessarily negate it.
Again,great discussion from all.
God bless