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[Paul8148]

Because the GOP, and America, need Rudy now.

More than ever.

by DaveG @ 5:40 pm. Filed

[Dolphy]

Wow, Wombat. That was the equivalent of a marathon...and you placed first. (Though I do take issue with a few points :)

[TitansAFC]

---"You want the powers that be to zot Rudy supporters? He's a REPUBLICAN, he's probably going to enter the GOP primaries and you want his supporters banned? Figures.........."---

Nope. You and Wombat are the ones getting all excited about the days when the dissenters are banned. I don't want Rudy backers banned, or third-party Conservatives banned. My point was, I couldn't see how someone could be banned for supporting a more Conservative candidate than Rudy Giuliani.

I do seem to see Rudy's appeal to you, though. I guess some folks would really like to have all dissenters silenced. Perhaps you'll get your day, but I hope not.

[fieldmarshaldj]

"LOL!!! That's funny. Well, we know how much people cared about those issues when Clinton was President and when he won reelection."

I'd say they did care. Remember, Clinton never received a majority of the vote either time.

"Of course we should strive for better, but in the end the electorate chooses the president."

But it's the Republican electorate that chooses the nominee. Fortunately, this is still a Conservative party, and hopefully it will stay that way... especially if it ever hopes to recover a majority again.

"As for asking for a conservative, it seems the country is less enamored with conservatives than it was a few years ago."

I vigorously disagree here. If the country is so unenamored of Conservatives, why did the Democrats run so many candidates pandering in that direction ? I think the country has become less enamored of Republicans, but that has nothing to do with Conservatism, and more to do with too many of our candidates and elected officials failing to embrace it and enact its agenda. Plus, when you start lurching leftward, it turns off the base. Why move that direction when the Democrats already occupy it and stand for that failed ideology ? That kind of movement is why we've lost the Northeast and the West Coast. Liberalism only works for the 'Rats, not for the GOP, and not for the country.

[TitansAFC]

See my response on your eagerness to ban dissenters, which I oppose (#262).

You have just witnessed the first indication of what I like to call the "Wraparound Conservative"; someone who has gone so far to the right that they begin to sound, and act, like leftists.

Nice try. No banning from me - can't say the same about you.

You'll obviously never have the problem of going so far to the right, or right at all for that matter.

[Wombat101]

"Insults, personal attacks, and get-the-hell-out-of-my-partyism. Add in a dash of "Conservative social/moral/cultural issues are for losers," and "God, Guns and Gays coalition" - an actual Howard Dean line."

Well, Titans if the shoe fits, then wear it.

If you found it insulting then I can only imagine that I have summed up your existance and you have now found it wanting.

I never said "social/moral/cultural" issues were losers. I happen to favor an end to abortion, myself. That line related to those who believe that government is the solution to a problem which is based in human nature, which is beyond the ability of the government to regulate (and if did regulate it, it would be at gunpoint). You want to stop smutty movies; COngress can't do it because of the First Amendment. Want to stop abrotion? The SUpreme COurt won't do it because the prestige and aura of infallibility of the court is wrapped up in Roe v. Wade.

You want clean entertainment, let the marketplace do it's work. You want an end to abortion, go out and win hearts and minds, which is what religion traditionally does much better than government. Go to the grassroots, not the Capitol. I don't disagree with many of your issues, Titans, but I do disagree with your methods.

" "God, Guns and Gays coalition" - an actual Howard Dean line."

Actually, I made that one up myself (I think I did anyway). Why the truth should be denigrated is beyond me, but that is the GOP "base" you keep talking about; religious bigots who seek to be well-armed for one of two reasons; a) to start the second revoilution when they finally lose all political power (ala the Sunnis in Iraq), and b) to start the second revolution in order to bring about the End of Days and the Rapture (ala David Koresh).

"Truly, Rosie O'Donnell Republican is befitting."

Well, I've already been called a RINO, a Rocky-Repub, a fag-lover, a closet democrat, a socialist, and a whole host of names which I will not repeat here. It's a genetic defect built in to the sanctimonious idiot who hangs around these sorts of threads. Seems to me you're the one with the name calling problem, Titans. I gave you generalities and you chose to take them personally.

Guilty conscience, perhaps?

Oh, as for the "get-the-hell-out-of-my-partyism" routine; seems to me you've been doing the same thing. WHy is it okat for you and not for me? Did someone die and make you Supreme Leader (and if they did, could we ask for a recount)?

[Wombat101]

I over-generalized, but it seems to sum it up. What exactly did you have an issue with?

[Dolphy]

I do seem to see Rudy's appeal to you, though. I guess some folks would really like to have all dissenters silenced

You know, almost every Rudy supporter I see here says they will ultimately support the Republican candidate. Yet I read post after post from the "dissenters" promising not only to not vote for Rudy (should he get the nomination) but support a third party candidate.

[Dolphy]

I'll let you know when I have more time. I'm off to bed :)

[TitansAFC]

---"Seems to me you're the one with the name calling problem, Titans. I gave you generalities and you chose to take them personally."---

Really?

---"When we win, it will be disappointing to you because the day after Inauguration, the concentrations camps will still be empty. The problem with folks like you is that you are never happy. Never will be. It must have been popor toilet training or perhaps Momma stoped breast feeding early, but it has resulted in an arrested, narrow, 15th century, superstitous mindset which the rest of us find extremely distasteful, to say the least, and often hysterical, at best."---

I'm all for honest debate, but you lack the honest part.

---"Oh, as for the "get-the-hell-out-of-my-partyism" routine; seems to me you've been doing the same thing."---

If you can ever find a post where I ever suggested the party would do better to purge RINOs (I was a vocal Lincoln Chaffee supporter in the RI race, after all), you let me know. I am a "big-tent" coalition guy, and always have been. Without the big tent, there is only minority status. But I will never support a Liberal Executive, period. What you want is a small tent celibate of any "controversial" issues.

Seriously, you're against the religious right, guns, Pro-Life activism, among other things.....why are you even a Freeper? The site clearly advertises its stance on many of these issues.

[bonfire]

Can you hear me applauding?? Well said!!

[TitansAFC]

So what's your concern?

I though it was the position of Rudy-ophiles that you didn't need us anyway?

[nopardons]

I've seen that attitude here for years and a lot of the people who shared it, are no longer here, but I am. :-)

[nopardons]

Welcome to that club!

We all need some time away from FR; this is a good time to stay off this site. Then, come back refreshed.

MERRY CHRISTMAS to you and yours.

[nopardons]

We are and have always been in complete accord, on this thread; even though you mistook what I wrote, a bit earlier. LOL

Now THAT's a great word for it...."wrap around Conservative"! I always have called them the so far right, that their lefties, or over the cliffers. I much prefer your term! :-)

A few more oldies, but goodies....UNAPPEASEABLES, DOGS IN THE MANGER, and the old reliable, CUT OFF YOUR NOSE TO SPITE YOUR FACERS.

[nopardons]

Do try to reread what I posted to you earlier. You appear to have NOT understood it at all and you need to understand it! I was attempting to be kind and to warn you; however, since you don't appear to care, I'm done trying to help you....you WILL find out the hard way.

[nopardons]

Sweetums, just for kicks, look at my sign-up date. :-)

Then look up others, with whom you are having problems.

[Wombat101]

"I am a "big-tent" coalition guy, and always have been"

Except when the Big Tent has to accomodate a guy who enforced gun control laws passed by legally constituted legislatures at the state and federal level. Oh, sorry, no room in the tent for you, Rudy!.

Except when the Big Tent has to accomodate a guy who is more conservative on fiscal and governmental management issues than anybody since Goldwater. Oh, sorry, No room in the tent for you, Rudy!

Except for when the Big Tent has to accomodate someone who's personal life doesn't measure up to your exacting standards. Oh, Sorry, no room in the the tent for you Rudy!

We won't even get into the dress....

The claim to have been a suppporter of Lincoln Chaffee and a Cultural Conservative, is hillarious. To then turn around and say "I wouldn't support someone who's more conservative than Chaffee" is outright hypocrisy. If I had to guess (easy enough since you've only mentioned it 80 times), this is all about your precious guns. If I had to guess, your manhood is probably psychologically wrapped up in that weapon.

Well, Titans, I still live in NYC (born and raised, lived there for the first 37 years of my life) about half the year. I own four weapons (two pistols). Only one is technically "illegal" in New York State (and it was grandfathered in the ridiculous "Assault Weapons Ban", which was three lies for the price of one). And get this: I actually walk the streets without them all the time! Rudy Guiliani locked the criminals up, you see, a novel idea at the time, and THEY STILL DO IT! Go figure!

Rudy Guiliani never grabbed my guns. Mario Cuomo tried to, though. None has ever tried to take them away, or make it more difficult to renew my licenses and permits (it was still as big a pain in the ass in Rudy's day as it was in David Dinkins day. Or Ed Koch's day).

Rudy Guiliani lowered my taxes and left his successor (the incompetent Mayor Bloomberg) with a $6 billion surplus, which promtply disappeared into union coffers, and required an 18% property tax raise to make up.

Rudy Guiliani almost single-handedly wiped out the Mafia in this City. How many mobsters did Duncan Hunter put away? Or Mike Pence? How about Tom Tancredo?

Rudy Guiliani was here, on the spot, with dedicated police and fire departments when this city need him and them the most. And they performed admirably, many making the ultimate sacrifice. I can sure as hell tell you that 300+ firefighters would probably NOT have rushed into a burning skyscraper in David Dinkins day, and the cops never even got out of their patrol cars in the dark days of Beame-through-Dinkins.

[nopardons]

Spot on!

[Wombat101]

Thanks!

[nopardons]

That's it.........beat 'em over the head with facts! Don't be shy...be brutal!

I have posted the facts about Rudy, warts and all, repeatedly here, only to be called names, vilified, libeled, and flamed. Most of the yahoos just HATE New York and New Yorkers, so it stands to reason, that they don't know facts and refuse to accept any, when force fed them.