Posted on 12/15/2006 7:13:58 PM PST by Heartofsong83
T.O. judge orders Christmas tree out of lobby Updated Thu. Dec. 14 2006 5:31 PM ET
toronto.ctv.ca
A Toronto judge has ordered a Christmas tree out of a downtown provincial courthouse lobby, saying it's not an appropriate symbol to non-Christians.
The move by Justice Marion Cohen has upset staff, some of whom call the decision stupid and insulting.
Cohen says she understands the small tree has stood in the lobby at 311 Jarvis St. for years during the Christmas season, but in a letter to employees says non-Christians are "confronted" with the artificial decoration, which makes them feel "they are not part of this institution.''
The judge, who oversees administration at the courthouse, said it's inappropriate that a Christian symbol is the first thing visitors see when they enter the building.
A number of Christmas trees are on full display inside other public institutions, including at the Ontario legislature, Toronto City Hall and at Nathan Phillips Square. There are also trees inside the Old City Hall courts.
Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty on Thursday slammed the judge's order.
"I think that's unfortunate,'' McGuinty said. "I think it represents a misunderstanding of what we are working so hard to build here in Ontario.'
"We enjoy the wonderful privilege of building a pluralistic and multicultural society.''
The premier said it's unfair to ask people to abandon their traditions, and noted it's important for everybody to learn about and share in each other's celebrations.
"At Queen's Park we celebrated Diwali a few weeks ago, as well at Queen's Park we celebrated Eid. Next week I believe I'm participating in a lighting of the menorah celebration,'' McGuinty said.
"What we're saying is, let's share in those opportunities, let's better understand those celebrations.''
Staff at the Jarvis Street courthouse were unwilling to comment on camera, but told CTV's Janice Golding they are disheartened. One man, who said the tree has been a Christmas tradition for decades, was infuriated when he learned of the decision.
Lawyers who work in the building were also upset and couldn't understand the reasoning.
"There's no reason why a Christmas tree can't be put wherever people want it to be. It's by no means an offense, I believe, to any religion," said Cynthia Mancia.
"I don't know that it falls upon judges to make decisions of that sort anymore than upon any other member of the public," added John Lamont.
There is currently no court or ministry policy that addresses this particular situation. Attorney General Michael Bryant said he'll be speaking to the chief of the Ontario Court of Justice about creating one.
Cohen would not comment on camera.
The tree has since been moved to an administrative corridor off to the side.
The story has triggered a flurry of angry responses from CTV viewers and readers.
Another Christmas incident in 2002 sparked backlash from the public when city hall officials put out a news release calling its giant tree at Nathan Phillips Square a "holiday tree."
Then-mayor Mel Lastman, who is Jewish, ordered staff to call it a Christmas tree. He then introduced a bylaw that prohibits the tree from being given any other name.
With a report from CTV's Janice Golding
Just more evidence that Satan is alive and well in the world today!!
What a bunch of crap! Christmas trees are NOT a Christian symbol, no more than Santa Claus. Almost everyone celebrates this national holiday in one way or another, buying gifts for loved ones, etc. It's all horse puckey.
Moving a symbol that has nothing to do with Christianity is Satanic?
Christmas has to do with Christianity, and this is more evidence that people are trying to wipe out Christmas from the public places where traditionally it's always been...that's the connection.
We don't have Christmas trees at Easter or Halloween. We have Christmas trees at Christmas, a Christian holiday. You cannot separate the two, even though a Christmas tree may not have a religious connotation.
Thank God that here in the United States we have a Bill of Rights, and the First Amendment says: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...."
And so here in the United States, if some scumbag liberal Democrat judge tried to do what this Canadian judge did, everybody would laugh and say to the scumbag judge, "Go play in the street, you p.o.s."
"a Christmas tree may not have a religious connotation."
So moving one needn't be Satanic. Thanks for clearing that up.
Never said moving one was 'satanic'--I said Satan is alive and well and walking around this planet trying to wipe Christianity and anything that portrays that religion off the face of the planet. That's all. :-)
"-I said Satan is alive and well and walking around this planet"
I'm checking out before this gets any weirder.
Oh, ye of little faith. :-)
Does it mean that if we find ourselves in front of the Canadian judge have to worry about his/her religious affiliation?
Ms. Cohen should be forced to resign.
I can only hope this Marion Cohen gets bitch slapped and is forced to yield.
DOWN WITH BLACK ROBBED TYRANTS!
I agree, but that is almost impossible.
You two miss the point. It would shame me to have to explain this on this Forum.
Absolutely. This woman has a problem. It's pure judicial tyranny. Callous too.
Kudos to "then-mayor Lastman" for his constructive response to a similar outrage.
Civil disobedience. Amen.
Decorated trees are nice. Wouldn't mind seeing them all winter long. I like the lights they string up here in Edinburgh.
I always found the nativity scene creepy and strange. Don't see why it needs to be in a public place.
Can you show me where in the bible it says anything about Christmas trees?
Now, where did Christmas trees come from and what is their connection to Christianity? And as long as we're discussing things that cannot be seperated, surely one could not think of Christmas with out thinking about Saint Nicholas and his reindeer. The guy's a saint and apparently magic. Where does it say anything about him or reindeer in the bible?
Reindeer... Hmmmm... Now where do reindeer live? I wonder if any of the tradition for what we call Christmas might have originated where reindeer live? Hmmm... What an interesting thought. I wonder if the tree might've come from the same culture? Wow, maybe the tree has nothing whatsoever to do with Christmas or Christ and it just got co-opted into Christianity when it was realised people wouldn't let go of winter festival celebrations?
Hmmmm. Has Christ always had a part in winter festival or has he been merely a secondary player in it? I think the latter is more likely. Trees, reindeer, decorated eggs and bunnies... Goblins and ghouls on Halloween. What have any of these to do with Christianity or the birth/death of Christ?
Do you not find it profane to Christianity to tie the birth of Christ to paganism and pagan symbols?
Ah... the eunuchs of Canada speak!!!
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