Posted on 11/24/2006 6:46:08 PM PST by kristinn
I'm reading an astonishing number of comments on Free Republic these days by posters who have joined the ranks of the anti-American left in calling for an immediate withdrawal from Iraq. Some claim to have military experience, some claim to be patriotic Americans and some claim to be smarter than the rest.
These posters are joining the Murtha-Rangel-McDermott treason caucus. Oh, they say they love the troops, but their decision to abandon them in the field speaks otherwise.
Three years ago, the United States led an international coalition to rid the world of one of the worst regimes on the planet. Saddam Hussein was an international terrorist: He financed terrorism, he trained terrorists and he harbored terrorists. He waged war on Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Israel. He waged war on the people of Iraq, including genocidal campaigns against the Kurds in the north and the marsh Arabs in the south.
Saddam successfully subverted the Oil-for-Food program and was wearing down support for continuing the sanctions keeping him in check.
He had numerous contacts with al Qaeda over the years. He tried to assassinate a former U.S. president. He maintained research capabilities to implement nuclear, chemical and biological weapons as soon as the sanctions were lifted. There is evidence that some of these programs would have been operational within a year even with the sanctions in place.
The decision to remove Saddam and his regime as part of the Global War on Terror was correct.
Three-and-a-half years after Iraq and the world were liberated from Saddam and his terrorist regime, there are those on Free Republic who are clamoring to give up, surrender, cut and run, stab the troops in the back, betray the Iraqis, betray our allies in the GWOT, spit on the graves of our fallen heroes and join Cindy Sheehan, Medea Benjamin and Ramsey Clark in bringing about America's defeat in the GWOT.
It's only been three-and-a-half years--only six months since the freely elected government in Iraq was formed. In that time, what has been called a mini-Marshall Plan of construction and reconstruction has come to fruition. The Iraqis have held three national elections, they have held numerous local elections, fourteen out of eighteen Iraq provinces are relatively peaceful and stable.
Six months ago, when the Iraqi government was formed, the experts said the war would be taken to Baghdad because our enemies in the region could not abide the example of a free, democratic society in the Middle East. For once, the experts were right. The battle of Baghdad has been a prolonged Tet Offensive style operation of headline-grabbing attacks intended to sap the morale of Americans and Iraqis alike.
From what I've been reading on Free Republic lately, a lot of Freepers have fallen for the enemy's ploy and are howling like barking moonbats for our immediate withdrawal from Iraq. Some of that talk is couched in talk of 'we're fighting a PC war like Vietnam!' The soldiers I met in Iraq recently told Debra Argel Bastian to pass on a message to the Vietnam vets criticizing the war: With all due respect to your service, this is not Vietnam. It is not being fought like Vietnam. Please let us finish our mission.
But our enemy is playing the Vietnam ploy to great benefit. They know they can count on the American and world media to broadcast their propaganda. They work with leftist Americans to sabotage the war effort at home. They know these leftist Americans have allies in the Democratic party. They know they do not need a military victory--only political and psychological victories are needed to defeat America.
You guys are playing right in to their hands. Congratulations.
There are those who argue that murder and dictatorship is the mindset of the Middle East and that will not be changed by our actions. Funny how those who smugly denigrate the Arab peoples' capacity for freedom forget the wholesale slaughter of millions of Westerners by Westerners at the hands of Western dictatorships just a few generations past.
I hear complaints that the Iraqis aren't standing up. Yet, to use one common example, when police recruits are slaughtered in bombings, Iraqis line up the next day at the same recruiting center. The insurgency is small in number, but they are able to do enough damage on a daily basis to stretch out the time it will take to secure the whole of Iraq.
At this time of our testing, the American people are starting to go wobbly. Sadly, many Freepers are too. Our troops and their Commander-in-Chief are not, thank God. It's only been three-and-a-half years. The progress made has been phenomonal. Throw in the towel now, and you'll just have the terrorists follow us home. Everyone knows that, including you. I'm not willing to pay that price, not now, not ever, but you are.
Let me close by offering similar sentiments recently offered by two men 'in the know' on the situation in Iraq who are not giving up. First, Kurdish Regional Government Prime Minister Barzani: "When I was in the United States recently and read the negative news in the Washington Post, New York Times and in the network TV broadcasts, I even wondered if things had gotten so bad since I had left that I shouldn't return."
Next, Gen. Abizaid: "When I come to Washington, I feel despair. When I'm in Iraq with my commanders, when I talk to our soldiers, when I talk to the Iraqi leadership, they are not despairing."
I think you are ignoring the goal of the enemy.
Oh I know. I see them bragging when I lurk over there, which I can only do for a few minutes at a time. "I've been a freeper for years" then the next day they slip up and get the zot.
I didn't call you names either. You didn't post the thread.
If you would like to respond to what I said, by all means.
You said, "The Iraqi's themselves should resolve their own internal civil differences. That is the plan."
I have my doubts as to whether the plan can work at this point. I think perhaps (and I know hindsight is 20/20) we expected too much from a country with no history of self-government and factions such as the Sunnis & Shia who've hated each other for years in the very beginning.
What we've done is sort of like trying to teach someone to swim by throwing them in the river - either they swim or they drown, but you're not really sure which outcome you'll get.
You also said, "The politician CIC is responsible for the plan, not "politicians" plural, and not the military."
I don't think the President is totally responsible for all the decisions that have been made, but maybe he was.
I think several of the decisions that have been made have undercut the military's strength, clout, and morale. As stated somewhere upthread, the decision to pull back instead of taking Fallujah the first time was one of these.
We will let the WOT vets sort this out.
They aren't as dumb as Kerri and his hate GW Buddies on FR think they are.
Exactly so.
There's one over there called Islamic_Cincinatti who's always bragging about going to FR and "mocking the neocons" claiming to be the parent of a veteran.
Makes me sick!
CUTANDRUNFLEEPERS
You weren't here for Elian, Terri Schaivo, and half a dozen others?
I agree that discussion is a good thing. I just don't think this thread was written to facilitate discussion. Even the title is written as a insult.
You may choose to call it a lie. It was a direct quote from Lugar. The neocons pushed so hard to stay in Iraq after the mission was accomplished, that now there will be talks with Iran and Syria. Gee, I wonder why this is not Front Page News here in the US? Those that demand to "stay the course" are advocating that We The People negotiate peaceful terms with Shiite Hezbullah. Think about that for a while. It amounts to a surrender.
That's just low...but read my tagline.
can we believe this kind of account ? remember the Baghdad school invasion of several months ago? The fact that Iraqi "stringers" are doing a lot of the eye-witness reporting, etc. If you need me to,and haven't seen the rather prominent threads on these themes, I can look them up.
It also kept us from going into Fallujah the first time. The government has been thwarting our policies for a couple of years now.
LOL...
Maybe you've left by now, owf, but my comment to you is that most, not all, but most of the ones who badmouth the Iraq war here are on the same track against the Commander in Chief. If you made a list going back a ways and track them side by side, most, not all, would be found badmouthing the President before they've now been found badmouthing the Iraq War.
First, the MSM and Dems tore him down non-stop, then were joined by Buchananites or Libertarians or Constitutionalists (Party) or Tancredoites or you name their slot. Successfully tearing him down, they are now going after the War in Iraq. Claiming they worry about the troops and casualities and political correctness and the impossibility of Democracy in Islam, etc. is a bit of slight of hand. The concerns are legitimate points of questioning and debate, but when you dig down deep you find deep antipathy to George W Bush for a host of reasons, followed by, now, a stated deep antipathy to the Iraq War.
Oh, they say they don't mean that, really, they're just against the way things have been going and they don't like future prospects. But the end is the same, they track with the trash Bush, trash the war Left. Are they ALL, trolls? Absolutely not. Just FReepers who for the most part strongly dislike and disrespect the President.
I have no current family in the military, unlike you, mystery and others. My dad served in WWII, stateside, in a specialty that was narrow and hard to fill, at an AirCorps training facility. My uncle served in the Pacific and his ship was hit by a Kamikazi Pilot, though it and he survived. I have second cousins who were Navy Seabees. A great Uncle who served in WWI in Europe under Gen. Pershing. A dear, dear friend who flew in Vietnam, who died in '03 of heart failure. I understand how you thrived on the support here for the War and the troops, and how let down you feel about continuing here.
I hope we outlast 'em, ohio. But that's just me.
It's only been three-and-a-half years--only six months since the freely elected government in Iraq was formed. In that time, what has been called a mini-Marshall Plan of construction and reconstruction has come to fruition. The Iraqis have held three national elections, they have held numerous local elections, fourteen out of eighteen Iraq provinces are relatively peaceful and stable.
Bears repeating. The whole article bears repeating.
I'm SO SICK of armchair generals and surrender monkeys telling me I don't know what I'm talking about because they'd rather believe the media than someone who is right here.
Thank you for posting this and thank you for your clear, unfiltered observations!
If the hostility toward the mission in Iraq is merely the emotional puffing up of the chests of Bush haters here on FR (emboldened by the RAT victory in November), mixed with well placed trolls, then it will most likely pass.
If there has been a sea change and there is widespread lack of support of the military (i.e. the mission that THEY believe in), then I don't think I can stick around.
But as I said........wait and see.
Lugar did not say that President Bush would have the talks personally. "I am among those who advocates talks between our government, Damascus and Tehran after a certain point," is what Lugar said. President Bush is the Chief Executive of our government, so therefore draw your own conclusion.
Let me slow it down a little more for you. My perception is what it is. It's based on your words, not something made up out of whole cloth. As usual, you duck, cover, weave, bob and do anything and everything to dodge the questions put to you. YOU have no credibility. Leave you alone? So you think you should be able to post unmolested, no matter how bizzare your claim, and not be called out to prove it. When someone/anyone dare question you on it, you want to be left alone. Kinda hard to do when you post on a open forum. I'm attracted to liberal ranters, what can I say? Blackbird.
No I understand the enemies goal very well. You need to convince Bush and our other leaders. You see our enemy understands what they Bush and others do not. They understand absolutes of war and fight accordingly then some. Thus through the ignorance of our elected leaders they are winning world wide.
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