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Elderly Woman Killed; 3 APD Officers Wounded In Shootout
WSB-TV (Atlanta) ^ | 11/21/06 | WSB-TV Staff

Posted on 11/22/2006 7:06:38 AM PST by elkfersupper

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To: elkfersupper

Plainclothes guys breaking down doors sounds like a recipe for disaster, regardless of the presence or not of drugs. I'd think that uniforms would be helpful.


41 posted on 11/22/2006 7:52:48 AM PST by Sam Cree (don't mix alcopops and ufo's - absolute reality)
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To: Dan Evans

Would a letter sent in advance do?


42 posted on 11/22/2006 7:53:42 AM PST by AxelPaulsenJr (Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.)
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To: Southerngl
From the article:

"They kicked her door down talking about drugs, there's no drugs in that house. And they realize now, they've got the wrong house,"

43 posted on 11/22/2006 7:55:59 AM PST by elkfersupper
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To: Southerngl
There are little old lady drug dealers all around Atlanta.

As an addendum -- in the not too distant future, the US will have 92-year-old ladies who were at Woodstock, banging Jimi Hendrix.

Age does not equal innocence.

44 posted on 11/22/2006 7:56:06 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (The broken wall, the burning roof and tower. And Agamemnon dead.)
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To: elkfersupper

Aren't you quoting the lady's niece?


45 posted on 11/22/2006 7:58:21 AM PST by AxelPaulsenJr (Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.)
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To: AxelPaulsenJr
Would a letter sent in advance do?

Yes, that would nice.

Incredible the number of people on "Free" Republic who are so frightened they believe we should just bend over and grab our ankles so state thugs can their way with us.

46 posted on 11/22/2006 8:04:09 AM PST by Dan Evans
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To: AxelPaulsenJr
Aren't you quoting the lady's niece?

Yes, I am.

47 posted on 11/22/2006 8:06:01 AM PST by elkfersupper
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To: elkfersupper

Maybe you should be more specific instead of throwing around sweeping generalizations about police work. If you're a cop and that is how it is done at your shop, fine, but I work in Financial Crimes, we serve our own warrants without the SWAT team thank you. Unless we have information on weapons in the house. That is a rarity. In my 6 years in this unit, I've served dozens of search warrants, always got the right address (because I do my homework) and only once did the SWAT team execute the warrant for me.

How it's done in your town isn't necessarily how it's done everywhere else so you might want to get out a finer brush before you paint all departments.

Best Regards,


48 posted on 11/22/2006 8:09:07 AM PST by Crapgame
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To: elkfersupper
Have the standards for warrants sank so low as to render the Forth Amendment meaningless? Can I call in a tip and get cops to bust down anyone's door?

I have friends in a pretty nice neighborhood whose neighbor across the street fell off the wagon, and is using and selling drugs out of his house. Pretty nasty characters coming and leaving by bicycle, walking in with nothing and leaving with brown paper bags, activity that picks up after a delivery is made, etc. He had a wife and twin little girls, fortunately the wife got them out and left him. Anyway, several people have called the police describing the suspicious activity over the last 6 months and nothing has been done. Honestly, what is the standard? It seems the police are either useless when needed, or dangerously incompetent when they do take action.

49 posted on 11/22/2006 8:14:01 AM PST by JTHomes
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To: ClearCase_guy
Yes. In many places the use of civilian clothing is standard with a "Raid Jacket" or some sort clearly marked external cover identifying the raiding official as a law enforcement official, i.e. POLICE, AGENT, INVESTIGATOR, etc.

Undercover may not be the exact term to be used in this particular case. Acting in an undercover capacity I have had numerous occasions to join raid parties, but not always. Full law enforcement uniform was more of a rarity.
However except in rare and certain cases it is required to announce the agency and it's intended purpose. "No Knock" execution of Search Warrants is NOT usual and infrequent, and governed closely by the Court (Judge) issuing the Warrant. If it is abused it is exactly that. An abuse and not a sanctioned or even legal event.
50 posted on 11/22/2006 8:16:46 AM PST by Gideon Reader ("The quiet gentleman sitting in the corner sipping Kenya AA and enjoying his Stan Getz CD's".)
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To: nonliberal

Gee and I thought I got this job by working out, testing and wanting to make a positive difference. Now I know that all I really had to do was get bullied in high school. What a load of garbage. Maybe you should go on a ride along and see the things we put up with in a night. In my unit, I've got 2 veterans, one from Vietnam, the other a Special Forces graduate, one officer decorated for a gunfight he survived after being seriously wounded and still managed to arrest the shooter. One guy is a SWAT officer as well and then me and the other mope. All we've got going for us is that we're college graduates who've played some sports in our high school days and survived gunfights on the job.

Yeah we got into a few brawls in high school, but none of us became cops so we could carry a badge and settle our grudges with the world. What's your grudge against cops? Or aren't the statutes of limitations up yet...

Regards,


51 posted on 11/22/2006 8:17:51 AM PST by Crapgame
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To: elkfersupper

Ridiculous.


52 posted on 11/22/2006 8:18:23 AM PST by the OlLine Rebel (Common sense is an uncommon virtue.)
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To: ryan71
Maybe the cops can do a better job of determining who lives in the house and who they might confront. If they had known a 92 year old lady was there alone, I think they'd have acted differently.

This isn't at all hard to do. All they had to do was go to the Register of Deeds office to determine who held title to the property. Then they should have checked their own records to see if any unusual activity had been reported at the property by persons other than their informant. That would have given them a good reading on who was likely in the house and what it was being used for. If, for example, the neighbors had repeatedly complained about strangers constantly visiting the house, there would have been a good reason to believe their informant. If not, they should have taken more time to check out what was really going on.

When it comes to no knock, or nearly no-knock raids like this one, great caution ought always to be exercised. Many people, myself included, keep loaded weapons to deal with potential home invaders. If a gang of thugs in civilian clothes try to break down my front door and identify themselves as police, I'm likely to shoot at them. If there's any reasonable doubt, the cops should properly knock and identify themselves; otherwise, tragedies like this are sure to happen again and again.

53 posted on 11/22/2006 8:29:07 AM PST by libstripper (!!)
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To: AxelPaulsenJr
Considering she managed to shoot three cops, she was quick to grab the gun in that "half second".

We'll see who shot whom when they yank the bullets out of them.

54 posted on 11/22/2006 8:29:35 AM PST by TankerKC (I'm already visualizing the duct tape over your mouth!)
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To: elkfersupper

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1742500/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1742448/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1742449/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1742624/posts


55 posted on 11/22/2006 8:34:49 AM PST by absolootezer0 ("My God, why have you forsaken us.. no wait, its the liberals that have forsaken you... my bad")
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To: TankerKC
We'll see who shot whom when they yank the bullets out of them.

Ding! We have a winner!

56 posted on 11/22/2006 8:36:11 AM PST by Wormwood (deeply religious non-believer)
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To: Crapgame
How do you deal with the fact that a very large percentage of homeowners legally and legitimately keep loaded weapons in their homes to defend against possible home invasions? I keep a loaded Beretta .40 by my bedside and would be inclined to start shooting if somebody tried to smash my door down at 1:00 a.m. It strikes me that you need to do a very good job of identifying your target before conducting a search like this one, something that apparently wasn't done here. If the police wanted to enter my house and interview me, I'd be glad to cooperate as long as I knew they were the police.
57 posted on 11/22/2006 8:37:07 AM PST by libstripper (!!)
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To: Wormwood

"We'll see who shot whom when they yank the bullets out of them."

"Ding! We have a winner!"

How likely is a conspiracy theory, that this evidence could be tampered with or suppressed?


58 posted on 11/22/2006 8:38:33 AM PST by mutley
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To: JTHomes

The situation you describe, with plenty of corrororating evidence and clear identification of the perp, is the kind where an aggressive no-knock search, IMHO, would be appropriate.


59 posted on 11/22/2006 8:39:49 AM PST by libstripper (!!)
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To: elkfersupper
Authorities say they received a tip of drug activity taking place at the home and officers were headed to the house with a search warrant.

Can't help but wonder if somebody wanted to buy the house. Is gentrification occurring nearby?

60 posted on 11/22/2006 8:40:58 AM PST by Valpal1 (Big Media is like Barney Fife with a gun.)
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