Posted on 11/19/2006 10:30:36 AM PST by Brilliant
A senior House Democrat said Sunday he will introduce legislation to reinstate the military draft, asserting that current troop levels are insufficient to sustain possible challenges against Iran, North Korea and Iraq.
"There's no question in my mind that this president and this administration would never have invaded Iraq, especially on the flimsy evidence that was presented to the Congress, if indeed we had a draft and members of Congress and the administration thought that their kids from their communities would be placed in harm's way," said Rep. Charles Rangel (news, bio, voting record), D-N.Y.
Rangel, a veteran of the Korean War who has unsuccessfully sponsored legislation on conscription in the past, said he will propose the measure early next year.
At a time when some lawmakers are urging the military to send more troops to Iraq, "I don't see how anyone can support the war and not support the draft," he said.
Sen. Lindsey Graham (news, bio, voting record), a South Carolina Republican who is a colonel in the U.S. Air Force Standby Reserve, said he agreed that the U.S. does not have enough people in the military.
"I think we can do this with an all-voluntary service, all-voluntary Army, Air Force, Marine Corps and Navy. And if we can't, then we'll look for some other option," said Graham, who is assigned as a reserve judge to the Air Force Court of Criminal Appeals.
Rangel, incoming chairman of the tax-writing House Ways and Means Committee, said he worried the military was being strained by its overseas commitments.
"If we're going to challenge Iran and challenge North Korea and then, as some people have asked, to send more troops to Iraq, we can't do that without a draft," Rangel said.
He said having a draft would not necessarily mean everyone called to duty would have to serve. Instead, "young people (would) commit themselves to a couple of years in service to this great republic, whether it's our seaports, our airports, in schools, in hospitals," with a promise of educational benefits at the end of service.
Graham said he believes the all-voluntary military "represents the country pretty well in terms of ethnic makeup, economic background."
Repeated polls have shown that about seven in 10 Americans oppose reinstatement of the draft and officials say they do not expect to restart conscription.
Outgoing Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld told Congress in June 2005 that "there isn't a chance in the world that the draft will be brought back."
Yet the prospect of the long global fight against terrorism and the continuing U.S. commitment to stabilizing Iraq have kept the idea in the public's mind.
The military drafted conscripts during the Civil War, both world wars and between 1948 and 1973. An agency independent of the Defense Department, the Selective Service System trains, keeps an updated registry of men age 18-25 — now about 16 million — from which to supply untrained draftees that would supplement the professional all-volunteer armed forces.
Rangel and Graham appeared on "Face the Nation" on CBS.
WTF is wrong with their existing choices when it's time for them to GET A JOB?
He got his brain shot off in the war.
ROFL!
(But, seriously, that raises Reason #739 why this is a stupid idea -- what do you do about all the guys who suddenly "discover" that they're gay?)
No I have not. But I do think it wouldn't hurt young people to do something for their country. Many do as volunteer firemen/women etc. Not everyone earns their living honestly anymore either. Many work off the books . So I am a socialist am I?. Well thats got to be the best laugh I have gotten so far today. Thanks I needed one. Have a nice day!
Acually, working "off the books" (to avoid taxes and/or to avoid being busted as an illegal alien) is a separate issue from earning an honest living (by providing the goods and services as advertised for the agreed price).
So I am a socialist am I?
No, but I stand by my opinion that you have been bamboozled by a socialist fallacy.
To equate militia service, which was very limited in duration (typicaly 90 days) and location (usually within the state), and under discipline far different from a professional military (e.g. elected officers) with a draft which obliges citizens to spend years in uniform wherever the military chooses and under the same discipline as professional soldiers is simply absurd. Conscription, then, has really been used only in the later part of the Civil War (where there were draft riots), WWI (when it was intended to keep the burden spread rather than have only the 'best and brightest' sign up), WWII (when it passed by 1 vote) and thereafter until it was abolished in the early 1970's. I served with both draftees and volunteers, and I'll take the volunteers any day.
Roman service was indeed limited to property-owning citizens, but [per Wikipedia and consistent with my memories of reading Mommsen's History of Rome some 30 years ago] the early Republic had no standing army. When war threatened the consuls of the day would be charged with the duty of recruiting an army from the eligible citizenry of the Republic. As a rule one of the consuls would lead this mainly volunteer army into battle. Much closer to our militia type system.
We could argue all day about why Sparta fell. Not worth it.
It's not that I disagree with you, per se, it's just that I don't understand your point at all. How would a draft "undo?"
Maybe my point is muddled. All I'm trying to say is that there were substantial growing pains from the advent of the all volunteer force. The fruits of those labors resulted in our military successes over the past 20 years. To return to a draft would, IMHO, negatively impact the effectiveness of our military.
As a society, we are too far removed from WW2, and the sacrifices that were necessary to defeat the Axis powers. There are other threats today, to be sure, but they are nowhere near the scope of 65 years ago.
Specifically referring to the current rotations in this long hard slog.
what do they do with the today volunteers that pretend to be gay so they won't be sent into battle.
The females have an out, they get pregnant.
By the grace of God, they all came home and remained very close for the rest of their lives.
And a REMF I'm sure. "In the rear with the gear" Rangel
Can he be deployed?
Yeah, but I think they could afford to lose 7 votes nationwide.
Rangel feelin' a draft
But Harlem voters deride renewed push by Dem big
BY MICHAEL McAULIFF
DAILY NEWS WASHINGTON BUREAU
Sen. Charles Rangel got chilly reception to his plan for draft bill.
WASHINGTON - Rep. Charles Rangel plans to resurrect a bill to reinstate the draft when Democrats take power in January, but the idea got a chilly reception yesterday in the heart of his Harlem district.
"There's no question in my mind that this President and this administration would never have invaded Iraq ... if, indeed, we had a draft and members of Congress and the administration thought that their kids from their communities would be placed in harm's way," Rangel said yesterday.
Rangel floated the same idea in Congress two years ago, but ended up voting against his own bill, along with 401 other Congress members, when the measure came up just before the presidential election.
At the time, he accused Republicans of rushing it out as a stunt against Democrats instead of giving it a legitimate hearing.
But the soon-to-be powerful chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee said yesterday a draft bill will be no stunt this time, insisting he's very serious about it.
"You bet your life; underscore serious," Rangel said on CBS' "Face the Nation" yesterday.
Along 125th St. yesterday, Rangel's draft plan was met mostly with derision.
"What, he was smoking pot or something?" said 58-year-old James Brown.
"He doesn't represent the people of Harlem if he's for the draft," Neil Davis, 48, said.
The White House and the military also oppose the idea.
"America has the best military in the world," said Lt. Col. Jeremy Martin, a Defense Department spokesman. "The all-volunteer force has served the American people well for over 30 years and will continue to do so."
But Rangel insisted that with rising threats around the world, and the huge drain Iraq puts on U.S. forces, a draft is crucial.
"If we're going to challenge Iran and challenge North Korea and then, as some people have asked, to send more troops to Iraq, we can't do that without a draft," he said.
Rangel said, though, that the draft shouldn't be all about the military and war, and that it can be a way to beef up national security forces at "seaports, our airports, in schools, in hospitals" while giving draftees some education in return.
"I will be introducing that bill as soon as we start the new session," said Rangel, a Korean War veteran. "I don't see how anyone can support the war and not support the draft. I think to do so is hypocritical."
http://www.nydailynews.com/11-20-2006/news/politics/story/473027p-398023c.html
Quite right. But the bulk of the troops used by the Unitesd Stagtes in the Revolution were militia. They fought in all the battles. they won Saratoga. So the argument that the Revolution was won by a professional army is incorrect.
And what medication are you on at the moment?
Tell that to all the draft dodgers and deserters from as far back as the Korean War who, as far as I can tell, either died of natural causes, or are still walking around.
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A reinstatement of the military draft, being pushed by a senior Democrat, will not be slated for consideration in the House of Representatives, the chamber's newly elected top leaders said on Monday.
"We did not include that" in legislative plans for early next year, said Democratic Rep. Steny Hoyer of Maryland, who will be House majority leader when the new Congress convenes in January under Democratic control for the first time in 12 years.
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