Operation Comeback. How to Save the Neocons

American Enterprise Institute ^ | 11/1/06 | Joshua Muravchik

[Just mythoughts]

This bunch might try and search out some credibility for themselves. I am quite tired of their whining and I will not forget Kristol and McCain's campaign before the election of 2004 of attempting to oust Rummy.

Further alllll this about how wonderful Lieberman is borders on complete deception. Lieberman was the vice presidential candidate whose attempt to win was an attempt to refuse to count military votes. AND Lieberman was one of those 19 NAY voters for the House Border Security bill the night before Conservatives were Foleyized the next day. Somehow Lieberman is allowed the widest of berths in what national security of this nation actually means.

[d-back]

Recruit Joe Lieberman for 2008. . . . Sen. John McCain and former New York City mayor Rudy Giuliani both look like the kind of leaders who could prosecute the war on terror vigorously and with the kind of innovative thought that realists hate and our country needs. As for vice presidential candidates, how about Condoleezza Rice or even Joe Lieberman? . . . In 2008, he deserves another chance--this time with a worthier running mate than Al Gore.

This is all you need to know about the Neocons, and their spurious claim to be conservative: They want to install the anti-gun, pro-baby killing, tax-and-spend senior Senator from Connecticut, with a lifetime American Conservative Union rating of 17, as Vice President, next to Condi Rice, McCain or Guiliani. Anyone with an ounce of conservative sense should feel their skin crawling right now.

With a rating only marginally better than Diane Feinstein (ACU rating of 11), Lieberman is way, way more liberal than detestable RINOs Lincoln Chafee (ACU rating of 37), Arlen Specter (ACU rating of 45) and Jumpin' Jim Jeffords (ACU rating of 24).

Let's put aside disagreements over whether the Iraqi War was wisdom or folly: If you want Joe Lieberman as Vice President, you may be a lot of things, but one thing's for certain: You are NOT a conservative.

[MaxFlint]

Something I've noticed over the years here, so many (fine) freepers seem to think that if you don't agree 200% with what I do, you completely wrong on everthing. Sources on "don't care about domestic economic freedom"?

Their actions speak for them. Big government conservatism. The Medicare drug benefit. Rapidly increasing domestic spending.

They aren't wrong on everything. They favor tax cuts.

So they were wrong on how we should've responded after 9-11? How were they wrong?

They were doing well until they invaded Iraq. In terms of direct damage to terrorists that wasn't going to provide enough bang for the buck even if it had worked out as they had hoped. I never believed the Democracy Domino Theory, and I'm skeptical about the kind of political parties that will probably win in open elections in that part of the world.

The alternative? A containment strategy.

[richardtavor]

The comment is not directed at you, but at people who invent labels for people that they do not like or understand--I still am not sure about the necessity of inventing the word Neocon--either you are conservative or not. I do agree, with others, that it seems to be a code word for Jews (because most Jews used to be Liberal, and are becoming more conservative.) That offends me (not your comments.)

[A. Pole]

I do agree, with others, that it seems to be a code word for Jews (because most Jews used to be Liberal, and are becoming more conservative.) That offends me (not your comments.)

Inventing a new word, just to protect your sensitivity is pointless. Why? Because the new name in addition to creating a lot of confusion it will be susceptible to the same attack.

We better stick to the already established words and protect their proper meaning. "Neocon", "nonconservative" will have to stay.

[Kewlhand`tek]

BRING BACK THE GOLDWATER-CONS!

[Sam Cree]

OK, I was wondering, thanks.

I believe it possible, from reading an essay once by Midge Dektor, that the neocons may have invented the term for themselves, or at least adopted it.

I do think that the word "conservative" means a lot of different things to a lot of different people. I suppose the this week's debacle at the polls is a good enough illustration of that.

[Alberta's Child]

Recruit Joe Lieberman for 2008.

LOL.

Further proof -- if ever any was really needed -- that "neo-conservatives" are conservative at all.

The Bush administration made a colossal blunder by allowing any of these @ssholes into his administration in the first place. The GOP got away with it in 2002 and 2004, but they paid for it in spades in 2006.

[Valin]

They were doing well until they invaded Iraq.

Do you understand why we went into Iraq? And the timeline we are looking at? Because in reading your reply, I don't think you do. You'll recall that right after 9-11 the usual suspects started screaming "Root Causes..Root Causes..we must address the root causes". Well that's what we are doing addressing (one of) the root causes...lack of freedom. And yes it's already paying benefits, if in no other ways than Lybia giving up their nuke program, Syria leaving Lebanon, a debate being held in the Arab world over just is happening. Syria understands how important Iraq is, Iran understand just how important Iraq is, OBL unerstands just how important Iraq is, the question is why don't you (no flame intended)

The alternative? A containment strategy.

You do of course know that when we invaded Saddam was 6 months away from getting rid of the sanctions. as for containment...three words Oil For Food.

Were mistakes made..sure. Name me one war where mistakes were not made.
tha battle for Iraq is not a movie where the jhero saves the day in 2 1/2 hours and rides off into the sunset. This is real life, and big time historic stuff.
Think Cold war and it's 1953, that's the timeline we are looking at.

[goldstategop]

I'm a neo-con. There's no shortage of practical ideas there. There's the intellectual firepower in the conservative movement.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." -Manuel II Paleologus

[Valin]

No NO No! We're doomed DOOMED I say.

This statement has received the seal of approval of the American Sarcastic Society

[goldstategop]

Name me ONE Democratic intellectual who gets noticed.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." -Manuel II Paleologus

[maineman]

NEOCON BUMP

[Cacique]

btt 4 l8r

[George W. Bush]

If you want Joe Lieberman as Vice President, you may be a lot of things, but one thing's for certain: You are NOT a conservative.

Big bump. These people should be ejected from Republican councils and their writings disregarded. They're treacherous, have no loyalty, won't run and can't win office. But they act like they're the Second Coming and demand their policies be implemented.

They're far more useful to the Dims than to us. These liberal mandarins are bad for the GOP.

[Eighth Square]

My kind of cynicism! I just can't help it, I look around and ask why can't these people open their frigg'n eyes - look what we have become. We are, and have been for some time, in deep 'do do'. We dicker around wondering if the world is upset with us; we don't fight wars to win; we won't even protect our boarders (if the truth were known we probably, at any given time, don't have a clue who is in the country); we teach our kids to be sooooo tolerant of the non achievers, in fact it would be better to be more like them; WalMart is currently under the gun for taking disciplinary action against workers who don't show up on time, wow! we can't have that; What have we become? more to the point, "where the hell are we going"?

[Fraulein]

Operation Comeback. How to Save the Paleocons

There. That sounds better.

[A. Pole]

Were mistakes made..sure. Name me one war where mistakes were not made.

Yes, but one mistake was HUGE. Dissolving of Iraqi army and ruling party. It should have been reformed and purged instead. The analogy would be if USA dissolved German and Japanese police, and administration after WWII and tried to create it from the scratch by young soldiers who do not know German or Japanese and by trigger happy contractors.

The key illusion was that Iraq is a blank page on which the perfect new society can be painted according to the millenarian Puritan dream. This supposed blankness was a projection of ignorance.

[A. Pole]

There's the intellectual firepower in the conservative movement.

Not every fire is good. It might just an inflammation of the brain.

Long exposure to the Trotsky ideology followed by Ayn Rand infection might do it to you.

OF THE PHRENITIS OR INFLAMMATION OF THE BRAIN.

THIS is sometimes a primary disease, but oftener only a symptom of some other malady; as the inflammatory, eruptive, or spotted fever, &c. It is very common however as a primary disease in warm climates, and is most incident to persons about the prime or vigour of life. The passionate, the studious, and those whose nervous system is irritable in a high degree, are most liable to it.

CAUSES. - This disease is often occasioned by night-watching, especially when joined with hard study: It may likewise proceed from hard drinking, anger, grief, or anxiety. It is often occasioned by the stoppage of usual evacuations; as the bleeding piles in men, the customary discharges of women, &c. Such as imprudently expose themselves to the heat of the sun, especially by sleeping without doors in a hot season with their heads uncovered, are often suddenly seized with an inflammation of the brain, so as to awake quite delirious. When repellents are imprudently used in an erysipelas, an inflammation of the brain is sometimes the consequence. It may likewise be occasioned by external injuries, as blows or bruises upon the head, &c.

[...]

[Valin]

but one mistake was HUGE. Dissolving of Iraqi army and ruling party

As far as I can tell, by the time we got to Baghdad there was no Iraqi army to keep. They just went home, except for those that became the "insurgency".

The key illusion was that Iraq is a blank page on which the perfect new society

Now there you could make an argument, that we were operating from ignorance.