[Motherhood IS a career]

Well then you agree with me that it's not an endorsement against material achievement or wealth in an of itself, but rather a warning that a camel has a better chance of getting through the eye of a needle than someone who would TRADE his soul for riches. And you DO agree that virtue and wealth are not mutually exclusive. AND that the key point in that section of Scripture is that "With God all things are possible" rather than wealth being some sort of automatic barrier from heaven.

In either case, the writing is not about Christianity and its appeals, but about islam and its appeal to people of a certain mindset. The way I see it, people with a rather large chip on their shoulder and a compulsion to blame others for their misery and/or "get even" are good candidates for islam, as opposed to any other religion. For one thing, islam actually condones violence to non-muslims.

I also don't think that success, as in "winners v. losers" is all about financial success. It is about success in life, and that is something I would measure in terms of happiness and joy for living. Again, this is just my perception, but Christians to me seem like a generally joyful lot, whereas the only joy I've ever seen among muslims was the dancing and celebrating they did in the streets around the world upon hearing that the World Trade Center towers had fallen and thousands were dead.

[HitmanLV]

Yes, I think so. And your observations about Islam are accurate, I agree with them 100%.

I was just pointing out that if someone goes to the trouble of noting what Islam brings to the table for losers, it's only fair to point out that Christianity brings a lot to the table for losers, too.

[tcostell]

That was how I actually meant "winners/Losers. In every conflict between people there is a winner. Sometimes, conflicts can be resolved in a way that everyone wins. This would be the ideal solution to problems under Christian morality. But under Islamic morality, very often the moral outcome is simply to chop off someone's head. That would mean that there is at least 1 "loser" involved in the solution.

In the west we've built a society that is largely optimized to have as many people be winners as possible, but the Muslim world has not. That's how I meant the comparison. And I think it's curious that the people who have characteristics which leave them frequently on the losing side of conflict resolution in the west are drawn to Islam in such large numbers.

[-YYZ-]

"And you DO agree that virtue and wealth are not mutually exclusive."

They're not mutually exclusive, but looking around I can't help but think they're not often well-acquainted, either.