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Islam: A religion for Losers
http://www.freerepublic.com/ ^ | 10-21-2006 | Me

Posted on 10/21/2006 8:07:20 AM PDT by tcostell

You would think that a belief system where the most lauded members are those who blow themselves up would have some serious marketing problems.  I mean how exactly do you get rational post-secular westerners to buy into an idea like that?  But Islam is the world’s fastest growing religion none the less.  And much of it's growth is owed to its rapid conversion of certain segments of western society.


  At a glance it defies all logic, but it's true.  It's a commonly held view that when a person stops believing in organized religion they don't then believe in nothing, but begin to believe in anything.  This describes the state of many in the post-secular west.  And for people in that mental and emotional state, divorced from their society without any common emotional ground to bind them to their family and community, Islam apparently has some intrinsic appeal.  But this then begs the question "Who are these people?”  Who would be willing to give up so much of the promise of the 21st century west for the cold restricted structure of 15th century Islam?  Who would be prepared to trade the "We hope you believe but it's really up to you" optimism of western theology for the choice between unyielding submission to the political hierarchy of the faith, or the business end of the faithful's sword?


  Well in a word... its losers.  Islam is growing in the western world by picking the low hanging fruit of society.   Those most lacking in the skills it takes to succeed in the west, are irresistibly drawn to Islam.  In a single stroke, Islam provides not only the craved for structure of a rigid life and a ready political apparatus which blames others for their hardships, but provides the promise of eternal reward in heaven for the very characteristics which have brought them only failure in the west.  In short, it's a religion which rewards the loser for the very things which make them a loser, and encourages them to use violence to bring the rest of society down to their level.  This is why it's becomes such a popular faith in the US prison systems, and why it's growing so rapidly among the discontented portions of western society.  Whatever your personal failure, Islam has an explanation that makes it clear that someone else is responsible. 


  In the history of man, no society has so successfully provided each individual with opportunity like the United States.  In the US, the circumstances of your birth don't matter, nor does your race, nor your gender, or anything else other than your own personal initiative.  In America, both men and women from every religious, racial, ethnic, and economic subgroup have continually reached the pinnacle of success in their chosen fields.  And the world over it's widely regarded as fact that if you are truly extraordinary at something, then America is where you will receive the greatest reward for it.  America loves a winner, and our society rewards them well.  We recruit them in every slice of life, from athletes, to engineers, to writers to educators, and everything else.  If there is a greatest ditch digger on the planet, then the odds would be that he's digging a ditch somewhere in the US.  And it's the very idea “that success can come to anyone" which makes the US what it is. 


  But that isn't to say that it’s a perfect meritocracy where only those who deserve it are rewarded.  It's still a society of men, and many of those men, for whatever reason, will do what they must to stand in the way of others as well.  So while the opportunity is clearly there, that alone is not a guarantee of success.  Some people, for whatever reason, lack the initiative, or the determination, or sometimes even the intelligence to achieve the same level of success as others in their chosen field.  But the question of success is not what you start out with in life, but what you do with it.  The people who achieve success are usually those who when faced with an obstacle will work harder, jump higher, run faster, and do whatever is necessary to get around it.  Success isn't defined by talent as much as it is by determination. But some people don't react that way.  Some people, when faced with an obstacle, will be quick to abandon their effort, and begin blaming others for their troubles.  They fail to take responsibility, and instead look to find a scapegoat.  And along comes Islam.


  The very core concept of Islam is the unconditional surrender to the will of Allah.  At its very heart, Islam encourages its faithful to not take responsibility for the circumstances of their life.  And from that basis all other Islamic law follows.  Have you had trouble with women?  No problem... under Islam a woman is more a piece of property than a person, so you will be able to command, and they must obey, if not... it's the sword or stoning.  Have you had trouble in business? No problem... under Islam, most worldly matters of commerce are left to the Dhimmi, those members of the unfaithful tolerated under Islam like slaves thanks to the high taxes paid by them for the right to survive.  But if the taxes should stop flowing, or the Dhimmi become defiant, then Islam provides a solution that even a loser can understand, again, it's the sword.  On and on, Islamic law makes it clear that if you are among the faithful, then anytime the world fails to meet your expectations, the perfectly acceptable and moral solution is violence.


  In short, Islam is a belief system which codifies a theological structure where those people least capable of achieving success on their own gain the political means of either taking or restricting the success of others by force.  It’s a triumph of violence as the means to realize the will of god, over the "reason" of the western world.  And in the west, people who choose violence over reason are losers.  And so it grows in the prisons of the US, and the suburban slums of Paris.  It gathers strength from the bottom, speaking a language that the losers of the west can understand.  "Obey" they say, "Obey, and we will give the means to take your revenge on a society that has left you behind.  Obey, and we will make you mighty, obey and your violence will be the last expression of the will of god."


  What those losers who convert fail to realize however, is that the price for their vengeance, and the cost of their scapegoat, is that they too become a slave.  If they aren’t responsible for the bad things that happen to them, then they aren't responsible for the good that comes to them either.  There may be no failure for them under Islam, but then there will be no triumph for them as well.  And should they achieve some moment of greatness, then they will quickly find that they too may be guilty of some obscure violation of sharia, and that the sword of Islam cuts both ways.


  For myself, I may not be the most successful man I know, or for that matter the most faithful, but my success and my failures all belong to me.  And for that alone, I'll stick to the reason of the west over the violence of Islam, anyday.    


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: erichoffer; fanatics; islam; rop; thetruebeliever; truebeliever
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To: tcostell

excellent essay and cogent argument!


21 posted on 10/21/2006 9:28:39 AM PDT by The Right Stuff
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To: x
Well I'm expanding this idea for another essay but I see no reason I can't give a synapses here.

I think it can be shown pretty clearly with nothing more than game theory, that there is a fundamental difference between the kind of problem solving offered under Christian morality and Islamic morality.

My point is that it's not necessary to believe in one or the other to be able to show that the Christian world's morality leads to conflict resolution that benefits everyone, and that Islamic morality leads to conflict resolution which usually benefits one party at the expense of the other. Eventually, this leads to even greater differences in the opposing societies which are structured on that concept.

And getting help from a "higher power to find the strength to accept my faults" is one thing but getting help from a "higher power to slaughter my enemies and punish the people that made my life suck" is another. One invloves taking personal responsiblity, which in my opinion is the hallamrk of chrstianity, and the other involves holding other people acocuntable for whatever is wrong with your life.

Calling two philosophies "religions" doesn't neccesarily make them into the same thing. And personally I don't think Ted Turner is a particularly good example of a critical thinker.

22 posted on 10/21/2006 9:30:27 AM PDT by tcostell (MOLON LABE)
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To: tcostell; ninenot; sittnick; steve50; Hegemony Cricket; Willie Green; Wolfie; ex-snook; FITZ; ...
In the history of man, no society has so successfully provided each individual with opportunity like the United States.

The ultimate measure of success is the collective survival not the opportunity for the individuals.

If you have more children you win, if you do not have enough children you follow the path of dinosaurs, no matter how big and ferocious you are or how much money you made.

23 posted on 10/21/2006 9:36:03 AM PDT by A. Pole (Evolution has demonstrated that the optimal IQ is the average IQ !)
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To: layman

Needn't go that far...they were his competition. He wanted to supplant Judaism and Christianity. He could not coexist with the infidel: convert or die.


24 posted on 10/21/2006 9:40:55 AM PDT by Pharmboy ("I have more guns than I need, but less than I want." Sen. Phil Gramm)
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To: tcostell

"it's a religion which rewards the loser for the very things which make them a loser"
That explains why the left loves it so much.
"encourages its faithful to not take responsibility for the circumstances of their life"
Another beloved belief of the left.

Notice which certain segments of society are attracted by this belief system -
those who have been unwilling to take responsibility for their underachievement
and who make a good living out of blaming their problems on the white Christian majority.

This is an excellent article.


25 posted on 10/21/2006 9:45:31 AM PDT by Leftism is Mentally Deranged (Jihadism: destroy Western Civilization and replace it with sharia)
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To: tcostell

Very good.

This explains the similarities between Socialists and Muslims. Both are organizations of losers and use similar methods to bring down the successful.

The losers of Islam are just petulent children who would burn down the house just because Mom won't give them ice cream. Nihilists.


26 posted on 10/21/2006 9:50:26 AM PDT by seowulf
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To: tcostell

Excellent article.


27 posted on 10/21/2006 9:51:38 AM PDT by ljswisc
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To: tcostell

Does anything in particular about 'the meek shall inherit the earth' strike you as an aspect of a religion that appeals to winners?


28 posted on 10/21/2006 9:53:08 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: WashingtonSource
I'd like to believe you, could you show some links where this can be proved?
29 posted on 10/21/2006 9:57:48 AM PDT by fish hawk
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To: joshhiggins
And for centuries these losers have been breeding with any other losers they could enslave. Evolution thrown into reverse.

Insecure, immature, lazy men that are afraid of the strength, stability and forward thinking that women add to a society, the give-and-take needed in a loving relationship, would rather use this demi-god pseudo-religeon as the basis to have women be their slaves and property instead.

Guilt tripping the females that they're going to hell, if they don't be "cattle". Force keeping them uneducated so they won't find out this truth. Kill any that start to "stir up trouble."

30 posted on 10/21/2006 10:02:14 AM PDT by USCG SimTech (Honored to serve since '71)
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To: HitmanLV
Sure. Please have a look at post #24.

My essay isn't about whether you like Christianity or not. And I think it can be demonstrated using objective terms that anyone would agree to regardless of faith, that the Christian world is VASTLY more successful by virtually any measure than the Islamic world. A man on the moon and a bone in the nose are not the same thing.

So a better question I think, is why would one assume that simply being meek makes one a loser?

In the western (read Christian) world, faith and success are not mutually exclusive by any means.

31 posted on 10/21/2006 10:12:25 AM PDT by tcostell (MOLON LABE)
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To: tcostell
My comment had nothing to do with liking Christianity or not. I am a Christian and I think it's clear that Christianity is a great religion.

To answer your question, this line suggests that those who don;t persue earthly success will be rewarded with heavenly, spiritual success.

The people who chide as losers in Islam have rejected (unwisely) earthly success. In that respect, they are the meek ones Jesus is talking about, but in a host of other respects they fall short of the Christian ideal.

While I agree with you that being successful and a Christian are not mutually exclusive, I have to point out that Jesus explicitly thinks that the losers in earthly, material sphere will find great reward in the afterlife.

The Islamists think that also, for different reasons, and approach it in different ways.

I don't see any evidence here that Jesus was talking about materially successful people when he said the 'meek' shall inherit the earth.

32 posted on 10/21/2006 10:37:34 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: tcostell
And by the way, post #24 has nothing to do with this, no matter how much you might like to believe it does.
33 posted on 10/21/2006 10:38:46 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: tcostell
"It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God" (Matthew 19:24)

Now that's a ringing endorsement for material overachieving if I ever read one! ;-)

34 posted on 10/21/2006 10:41:51 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: HitmanLV
Respectfully, the only one who said anything about material success was you. It's true that many people think that material success is the only success, and in the Christian world, those people are free to operate on that basis.

The definition of success that I was thinking about was a little different. I was talking about a more macro view. In the Christian world, every effort is made to encourage everyone involved in a conflict to find a way to a solution without specifically damaging another party. The win/win solution is viewed as the best. Not so under Islam.

And cherry picking the bible to lend credence to your personal definition of success doesn't negate my point.

35 posted on 10/21/2006 10:58:44 AM PDT by tcostell (MOLON LABE)
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To: HitmanLV

Excuse me... I meant post number #22.


36 posted on 10/21/2006 10:59:18 AM PDT by tcostell (MOLON LABE)
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To: tcostell
What does 'meek' mean, then, in the context of the Beatitudes?

What does Jesus mean when he is talking about the odds of a rich man entering the kingdom of God?

My point is that a lot of religions have a lot to offer losers - people with 'less,' as opposed to people with 'more.'

Your self serving macro view notwithstanding, you don't seem too willing to accept that.
37 posted on 10/21/2006 11:05:01 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: tcostell

No problem.


38 posted on 10/21/2006 11:05:55 AM PDT by HitmanLV ("If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking until you do succeed." - Jerry 'Curly' Howard)
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To: fish hawk

Data on China is hard to come by, but for starters, there was an article in The Economist earlier this year. Here is a link, but you need a subscription to see the whole article. But it's a start: http://www.economist.com/displaystory.cfm?story_id=3896585

Here are some excerpts from The Economist story about this growth: http://www.killrighty.net/2005/05/01/christianity-in-china/

Here's a link to a 2004 article from Christianity Today, which reports estimates of the number of Christians in China ranges from 30 million to 100 million:
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2004/februaryweb-only/2-16-31.0.html

This story also reports how shocked the Communists are at the rapid growth of Christianity.

I'll try to find more about the other items I mentioned and send them shortly.



39 posted on 10/21/2006 11:07:03 AM PDT by WashingtonSource
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To: fish hawk

Here's a link to an article that estimates that 20,000 Muslims convert to Christianity every year in America. This, in spite of all the death threats they get.

http://amightywind.com/islam/muslimconverts.htm

Meanwhile the number of Christian converts to Islam is estimated 50,000 a year. Hardly an earth-shattering number.


40 posted on 10/21/2006 11:11:13 AM PDT by WashingtonSource
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