N. Korean Nuclear Test: China Duped (their intel network in NK wiped out)

To: TigerLikesRooster

Please post your source. There was nothing about this last

night on the link you provided, nor is there anything this

morning.

61 posted on 10/15/2006 10:36:26 AM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)

To: lentulusgracchus

Just saw this - haven't read it yet. If you make any comments, pingify me.

Thanks!

62 posted on 10/15/2006 11:02:14 AM PDT by little jeremiah

To: TigerLikesRooster

Not just "big news", but it would definitely lead the Chinese to believe the North Korean intended to target them.

Virtually 100% of China's meaningful industrialization is within range of NK missiles.

63 posted on 10/15/2006 11:25:21 AM PDT by muawiyah

To: TigerLikesRooster

Not. This assumes that North Korean security is run by Communists rather than gangsters. EVERYTHING is for sale in North Korea.

64 posted on 10/15/2006 2:51:17 PM PDT by Thud

To: Caipirabob; TigerLikesRooster; Steel Wolf

Looks like China is suffering a similar problem our CIA has.

There are some things that the Chinese would rather spend their money on rather than a conflict with NK.

The world isn't stupid to North Korea's protectors/enablers. Even China has panic buttons that are being pushed. And if the world (countries with real value) decides, then Beijing won't have to devalue its currency artificially.

If the neighborhood decides to undo Kim Il Jong's fiasco, then the world might want to inventory its used/slightly damaged containers for humanitarian assistance in NK as substitute expeditionary housing.

I think it will be easier to bribe NK Generals further away from Pyongyang to control the sectors around Pyongyang making the capital a "forbidden city" rather than go toe to toe with Kim's personal guard.

China's strength is that it has personal history on how to retire a dynasty that isn't in step with the modern age. It may get bloody, but it'll be far smaller in scale than going toe to toe with a starving, desperate, and extremely xenophobic enemy armed with nuclear devices.

Kim is no dummy, and he'll smell the end a lot sooner than any of us will. I fully expect that Kim will purge his own ranks the way Stalin wiped out his leadership in 1937 in he isn't doing it already. In purging the old guard (similar to what Mao did with the Cultural Revolution), he'll have a highly radicalized and younger leadership corps albeit less experienced and less compromising with subordinate needs. If this happens, Kim's cult will bleed out much much quicker via mass starvation-implosion and devolving into a warlords territory. Essentially, North Korea will be a giant no-man's land that would frighten the toughest characters of Mad Max's Road Warrior films. If Kim doesn't purge, he's still doomed but with much less localized violence.

How could Kim lengthen his days? He could author his own "forbidden city" the way Pablo Escobar built his own prison, "La Catedral."

Kim will never have what Pablo had in means of engineering his escape or bribe the amount of people Pablo had in his pocket. Kim will feel much much safer in his forbidden city with his own personal guard and army of pretty girls while knowing that the rest of the world will want his head the moment he transits out of Korea. In fact, he may even thumb his nose at us and really upset those who think that he's gotten away with murder. He won't. He'd be left to God's Justice.

This might work given that the Korean is considered the "hermit kingdom". It might appeal to Kim if he had his supplies of drink, guns, girls, DVD/video collection, and even an on-line connection for whatever websites he surfs (on-line gaming?)

The angle he could work is giving the appearance of being magnanimous by retiring. And if this is the path he chooses, we just might consider that he is BEING MAGNANIMOUS for retiring without having us put his lights out for him...via a lot of killing.

Why would he say that he's retiring? He'd inform all Koreans that he's met his life's goals in making the Korean peninsula a nuclear power and a self-sustaining nation not requiring foreign intervention or overseers. In fact, that might work into the equation of his delaying retirement: "I can't/won't retire until foreign non-Koreans are off the Korean Peninsula...meaning all coalition forces be it Chinese, American, Russian, whomever."

Of course, if this were the case, the Koreans themselves would want Kim dead dead dead for all of the misery he brought them. Thus, a Coalition force is necessary to PROTECT his retirement from revenge.

But Kim can't hold the tide much longer. Sanctions will starve the miserable population. Generals and senior military/police officials will be bribed. Sectors will be lost to foreign humanitarian aid. Kim doesn't have a lot of time to make the deal first. He'd better draw the contract up and the city's defensive lines out. He'd better choose his guard and concubines now. He'd better have his Internet connection secure and a lifetime supply of high speed bandwidth for Internet movies and gaming. Because if he delays too long...

...will spend money on going to the Beijing Olympics, no one will experience appreciating property value for Olympic construction, no one will install high bandwidth Internet/media for Olympic programs, no one will do business for the nations guarding the little tyrant, and those footing the bill for this lost opportunity will see all of their future get turned over to India (vast/high density and well-educated population needing a lot of blue collar jobs...who's already packing nukes for self-preservation). If India goes internationally MFN over this, then China gets screwed...and China knows it.

The modern Chinese generation isn't a peasant army that only needs one set OD green utilities to function day in and day out.

The Cult of Mao is Dead

65 posted on 10/15/2006 3:46:25 PM PDT by SaltyJoe (A mother's sorrowful heart and personal sacrifice redeems her lost child's soul.)

Eh, not sure I believe this part.

Me, neither. Asia is the world's biggest hall of mirrors.

And even if it's true, well, here's the sound of the world's smallest violin.....

66 posted on 10/15/2006 4:46:09 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus ("Whatever." -- sinkspur)

To: lentulusgracchus; little jeremiah

67 posted on 10/15/2006 4:59:01 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus ("Whatever." -- sinkspur)

To: blasater1960; Eric in the Ozarks

"China wants Iran to have the bomb."

There are a few items that would have me disagree with this.

Yes, the criminal mind would want to enable a very real trigger puller like Iran.

No, the cultural mind knows that to make war against Jews will have only a losing outcome.

No, the historical mind will note that Iran is very serious about exporting its brand of theocracy. The Soviet atheist learned what it meant to war against an Islamic neighbor. If modern Russia has extreme problems with Islam within its own country:

And if Russia still has massive Cold War Era weaponry and trained army to use it...

And if Russia still continues to have massive problems with a very determined internal enemy radically bent on self-determination...

Then will China want Iran to export their Jihad into the Xinxiang province?

We all know that the PLA is hugh, but is it hugh enough to cover all the people their grandparents have pissed off?

Chinese Army in Tibet

Uighur separatists

68 posted on 10/15/2006 5:06:39 PM PDT by SaltyJoe (A mother's sorrowful heart and personal sacrifice redeems her lost child's soul.)

To: blasater1960

China is in control of everything. ...This NK stuff is probably more geared towards China becoming THE Asia boss and also giving cover to Iran. ....China wants Iran to have the bomb.

You're an aficionado of the "borrowed knife" theory, under which, net-net, every nuclear weapon in the (third) world will be more of a problem for the U.S. than for China.

But why would China want Iran to have the Bomb? After all, China's no more Moslem than the U.S., or barely so. Why would an "Islamic Bomb" be of benefit to China?

69 posted on 10/15/2006 5:07:40 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus ("Whatever." -- sinkspur)

What's "PWN" mean? And what's with the Wegro hand signs?

70 posted on 10/15/2006 5:08:39 PM PDT by lentulusgracchus ("Whatever." -- sinkspur)

To: lentulusgracchus

Let the n00b be trained!

http://www.purepwnage.com/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pure_Pwnage

Jeremy

FPS_Doug

Back when they were little n00bs

71 posted on 10/15/2006 5:22:36 PM PDT by SaltyJoe (A mother's sorrowful heart and personal sacrifice redeems her lost child's soul.)

Some of y'all might actually want to do a bit of looking into the who and what of NK puppet mastering.

The NK was created by the USSR.
The USSR equipped, trained, organized the NK forces and lead them in the Korean War.
The NK system is based on an exaggerated Stalinist system.
The NK has never had any love for either China or Maoism.
The NK was a wholly owned subsidiary of the USSR up until the "fall of the wall".

Now, some may want to keep following along that rosy path that says because "communism was defeated" in the old USSR that Russia is now all civilized but that's pure, unadulterated, unprocessed manure.

Russia is as dangerous today as it has ever been. They may not have access to all the nukes they would never have used anyway, nor the deep ranks of tanks and artillery they couldn't supply well enough to have fielded in force anyway, but they are still waging war against "the west" by the very same proxies they've always used.

Ever wonder why this NK issue is so freekin similar to the "Cuban crisis"?

Same play-book is being used, so why shouldn't it be so similar in appearance and motivation?

72 posted on 10/15/2006 5:26:49 PM PDT by Grimmy (equivocation is but the first step along the road to capitulation)

I agree...sounds fishy....NK is a Chinese Puppet...I don't Beijing would take killing their agents lightly...

73 posted on 10/15/2006 6:38:18 PM PDT by Defendingliberty (www.gulagthebear.com)

Kim Il Sung always had his own agenda for Korea. He was very capable, dashing, and an enthusiastic leader. He was also ambitious, ruthless, and meglomaniacal. Even his own son, Kim Jong Il, would never dare dent his father's overwhelming domination of North Korea.

From Answers.com - Before Kim's death in 1994, he arranged for power to pass to his son, Kim Jong-il. In 1998 the younger Kim gave his father the posthumous title of "eternal president."

Ironic, but the Lord's Pray, "Our Father, who art in Heaven..." would work well under the radar in North Korea.

74 posted on 10/15/2006 7:46:13 PM PDT by SaltyJoe (A mother's sorrowful heart and personal sacrifice redeems her lost child's soul.)

To: Eric in the Ozarks; TigerLikesRooster

Interesting website, pictures of North Korea from what looks like a dude from Tbilisis:

http://www.tema.ru/travel/choson-1/

Sorry, I can't translate.

75 posted on 10/15/2006 7:55:37 PM PDT by SaltyJoe (A mother's sorrowful heart and personal sacrifice redeems her lost child's soul.)

To: TigerLikesRooster

Beijing Duped by Pyongyang

This makes me laugh. China, what a blow. China forgot, deal with sh@@, and you get yours shoes full.

76 posted on 10/15/2006 7:56:43 PM PDT by Logical me (Oh, well!!!)

Re #61

I clicked the source, and I do see the Korean article I translated into English. The segment I translated is in the mid-section.

Do you read Korean?

77 posted on 10/15/2006 8:49:49 PM PDT by TigerLikesRooster

To: TigerLikesRooster

I speak very little and read even less. After clicking on the link you posted, at the top of the page there's a button to translate the page into English.

78 posted on 10/15/2006 9:15:01 PM PDT by AmeriBrit (Soros and Clinton's for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington = SCREW.)

Re #78

The button is a link to selected articles they translated into English. They do not translate all of their articles, only some of them in abridged format.

79 posted on 10/15/2006 9:31:59 PM PDT by TigerLikesRooster

To: lentulusgracchus

Islam destroys us, then China overwhelms Islam and destroys it, then claims control of the world...like a vast game of Soduku.

How do end a game of Soduku when one is losing?...one overturns the game board!

80 posted on 10/18/2006 4:49:12 PM PDT by mdmathis6 (Proof against evolution:"Man is the only creature that blushes, or needs to" M.Twain)

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794

/begin my excerpt

N. Korean Nuclear Test: China Duped (Asia Weekly)

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