Pope's speech stirs Muslim anger (ROP Alert)

BBC ^ | September 14, 2006

[Irontank]

Muslim religious leaders have accused Pope Benedict XVI of quoting anti-Islamic remarks during a speech at a German university this week. Questioning the concept of holy war, he quoted a 14th-Century Christian emperor who said Muhammad had brought the world only "evil and inhuman" things.

A senior Pakistani Islamic scholar, Javed Ahmed Gamdi, said jihad was not about spreading Islam with the sword.

Turkey's top religious official asked for an apology for the "hostile" words.

In Indian-administered Kashmir, police seized copies of newspapers which reported the Pope's comments to prevent any tension.

A Vatican spokesman, Father Frederico Lombardi, said he did not believe the Pope's comments were meant as a harsh criticism of Islam.

'Abhorrent'

In his speech at Regensburg University, the German-born pontiff explored the historical and philosophical differences between Islam and Christianity and the relationship between violence and faith.

Stressing that they were not his own words, he quoted Emperor Manual II Paleologos of Byzantine, the Orthodox Christian empire which had its capital in what is now the Turkish city of Istanbul.

The emperors words were, he said: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

Benedict said "I quote" twice to stress the words were not his and added that violence was "incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul".

The Pope is due to visit Turkey in November and the Turkish response was swift and strong, the BBC's Sarah Rainsford reports from Istanbul.

Religious leader Ali Badda Kolu said the Pope's comments represented what he called an "abhorrent, hostile and prejudiced point of view".

Whilst Muslims might express their criticism of Islam and of Christianity, he argued, they would never defame the Holy Bible or Jesus Christ.

He said he hoped the Pope's speech did not reflect "hatred in his heart" against Islam.

Many Turks see Benedict as a Turkophobe and commentators call his words just before the holy month of Ramadan "ill-timed and ill-conceived", our correspondent adds.

[RexBeach]

The Muzzies can go eff themselves. The Pope is a real man of peace.

[Buck W.]

"The Religion of Perpetual Outrage" is such an apt label.

[TheDon]

A senior Pakistani Islamic scholar, Javed Ahmed Gamdi, said jihad was not about spreading Islam with the sword.

Someone should tell AlQ.

[verity]

The Perpetually Pi**ed Off. :-)

[onyx]

Truth angers them. We're all supposed to buy into the "religion of peace" fallacy.

[kinoxi]

The Pope offends them, go figure. Hopefully they'll suffer from a string of premature detonations and relieve their 'oppressed' minds.

[cripplecreek]

I think they need a Saint or something. They can call her "Our Lady of Perpetual Outrage".

[meowmeow]

"The Religion of Perpetual Outrage" is such an apt label.

They would make good democrats.

[the invisib1e hand]

Oh,I'm sure the BBC isn't stirring the pot at all.

Let the Crusades begin.

[Just another Joe]

Whilst Muslims might express their criticism of Islam and of Christianity, he argued, they would never defame the Holy Bible or Jesus Christ.

I call BS.

I hope the Pope has some good guards. I expect there will be a fatwa out on him soon

[dennisw]

 

You want some Muslim quotes? Here you go!!!

These passages are from the Koran and Hadith

 

	Bukhari:V4B52N220 “Allah’s Apostle said, ‘I have been made victorious with terror.’”
Qur’an:8:12	“I shall terrorize the infidels. So wound their bodies and incapacitate them because they oppose Allah and His Apostle.”
Qur’an:8:57	“If you gain mastery over them in battle, inflict such a defeat as would terrorize them, so that they would learn a lesson and be warned.”
Ishaq:326	“If you come upon them, deal so forcibly as to terrify those who would follow, that they may be warned. Make a severe example of them by terrorizing Allah’s enemies.”
Qur’an:8:67	“It is not fitting for any prophet to have prisoners until he has made a great slaughtered in the land.”
Ishaq:588	“When the Apostle descends on your land none of your people will be left when he leaves.”
Tabari IX:42	“We have been dealt a situation from which there is no escape. You have seen what Muhammad has done. Arabs have submitted to him and we do not have the strength to fight. You know that no herd is safe from him. And no one even dares go outside for fear of being terrorized.”
Ishaq:326	“Allah said, ‘No Prophet before Muhammad took booty from his enemy nor prisoners for ransom.’ Muhammad said, ‘I was made victorious with terror. The earth was made a place for me to clean. I was given the most powerful words. Booty was made lawful for me. I was given the power to intercede. These five privileges were awarded to no prophet before me.’”
Ishaq:327	“Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”
Qur’an:7:3	“Little do you remember My warning. How many towns have We destroyed as a raid by night? Our punishment took them suddenly while they slept for their afternoon rest. Our terror came to them; Our punishment overtook them.”

[Irontank]

Yes...its such a peaceful religion that In Indian-administered Kashmir, police seized copies of newspapers which reported the Pope's comments to prevent any tension...."tension" (meaning likely violent rioting) over the Pope quoting a 14th century emperor

[Maceman]

Pope's speech stirs Muslim anger

What doesn't?

[Conservative_Rob]

No, actually they are completely accurate. Today they don't use swords - they use car bombs, homicide bombers, snipers, chemical weapons, and, if given the chance, nuclear weapons. "We don't need no stinkin' swords!"

[frogjerk]

Angelic Doctor of the Church St. Thomas Aquinas:

"He (Mohammed) seduced the people by promises of carnal pleasure to which the concupiscence of the flesh urges us. His teaching also contained precepts that were in conformity with his promises, and he gave free rein to carnal pleasure. In all this, as is not unexpected; he was obeyed by carnal men. As for proofs of the truth of his doctrine, he brought forward only such as could be grasped by the natural ability of anyone with a very modest wisdom. Indeed, the truths that he taught he mingled with many fables and with doctrines of the greatest falsity.

He did not bring forth any signs produced in a supernatural way, which alone fittingly gives witness to divine inspiration; for a visible action that can be only divine reveals an invisibly inspired teacher of truth. On the Contrary, Mohammed said that he was sent in the power of his arms - which are signs not lacking even to robbers and tyrants. What is more, no wise men, men trained in things divine and human, believed in him from the beginning (1). Those who believed in him were brutal men and desert wanderers, utterly ignorant of all divine teaching, through whose numbers Mohammed forced others to become his follower's by the violence of his arms. Nor do divine pronouncements on part of preceding prophets offer him any witness. On the contrary, he perverts almost all the testimony of the Old and the New Testaments by making them into a fabrication of his own, as can be seen by anyone who examines his law. It was, therefore, a shrewd decision on his part to forbid his followers to read the Old and New Testaments, lest these books convict him of falsity. It is thus clear that those who place faith in his words believe foolishly." - Summa Contra Gentiles, Book 1, Chapter 16, Art. 4.

[OldPossum]

Really stings when the truth is spoken of you, doesn't it?

If a jihad (their so-called "holy war" which seems to be their every fourth word) is not designed to obliterate other religions and their followers and spread Islam by violence, then, pray tell, what the hell is it?

[dennisw]

 

May 02, 2004

Vatican rejects Muslims' petition to use Cordoba Cathedral as mosque

Muslims are already praying in the Cordoba Cathedral, so we haven't heard the last of this controversy. Muslim groups will continue to portray it as an issue of human rights and religious pluralism, with blithe disregard for what would happen if Christians tried to pray in any of the large number of churches that are now mosques in the Middle East.

From the Spanish El Mundo, with thanks to Silvia. My translation:

VATICAN - The Vatican is against the Cathedral of Córdoba, the famous mosque, being used also by Muslims, and advises them to "accept history" without pretending to "take revenge," in the same way that Catholics don't reclaim buildings that have passed to Islam. Muslims have submitted a petition to the Vatican with this request.

This is the statement of Archbishop Michael Fitzgerald, President of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue, who has recalled that in 2001 John Paul II visited the Omayyad Mosque in Damascus, which previously had been a Byzantine basilica, "and he did not ask to celebrate Mass there."

"Some reflection is necessary. In the same way as in Córdoba, other buildings in the course of the centuries changed from their original use, like Hagia Sophia in Istanbul, converted into an Islamic museum," said the Archbishop.

Fitzgerald said that "the Pope visited the mosque of the Omayyads in Damascus and prayed before the tomb of St. John the Baptist, but he did not ask to celebrate Mass in the mosque. The coexistence between Christians and Muslims is difficult if one pretends to go back in history or makes pretensions of reclamation. It is necessary to accept history and look toward the future."

 

"The past is not dead. It is not even past." — William Faulkner.

Fitzgerald agreed that the Spanish authorities are trying to satisfy everyone, "but perhaps they don't have the necessary theological sensibility" to understand the position of the Church.

"We also want to live in peace with people of other religions, but we don't want to be pushed, manipulated, and to go against the rules of our own Faith," he declared firmly. ...

To the question of whether the petition of the Muslims concerning the mosque of Córdoba could be considered an attempt to "Islamize Europe," the Archbishop indicated that there are some Muslims who consider Europe decadent and want to Islamize it.

"For some," he said, "Islam is the answer — a religious renewal. They are not in the majority, but they exist. Although there are also many Muslims who only want to coexist with other religions in a manner compatible with the law and the tradition of the country in which they live".

[Antoninus]

Too much irony for a single article.

A senior Pakistani Islamic scholar, Javed Ahmed Gamdi, said jihad was not about spreading Islam with the sword.

He's right. They use RPGs and nail-bombs now-days.

Manuel Paleologus was 100% correct. Islam is a death cult.

[onyx]

Thank you. I have been searching old threads looking for the direct quotes from the Quran/Koran/whatever.