Can the West defeat the Islamist threat? Here are ten reasons why not

Times Online ^ | September 09, 2006 | David Selbourne

[Iris7]

LET US SUPPOSE, for the sake of argument, that the war declared by al-Qaeda and other Islamists is under way. Let us further suppose that thousands of “terrorist” attacks carried out in Islam’s name during the past decades form part of this war; and that conflicts that have spread to 50 countries and more, taking the lives of millions — including in inter-Muslim blood-shedding — are the outcome of what Osama bin Laden has called “conducting jihad for the sake of Allah”.

If such war is under way, there are ten good reasons why, as things stand, Islam will not be defeated in it.

1) The first is the extent of political division in the non-Muslim world about what is afoot. Some reject outright that there is a war at all; others agree with the assertion by the US President that “the war we fight is the decisive ideological struggle of the 21st century”. Divided counsels have also dictated everything from “dialogue” to the use of nuclear weapons, and from reliance on “public diplomacy” to “taking out Islamic sites”, Mecca included. Adding to this incoherence has been the gulf between those bristling to take the fight to the “terrorist” and those who would impede such a fight, whether from domestic civil libertarian concerns or from rivalrous geopolitical calculation.

[happygrl]

Thank you for directing me to Theodore Dalrymple's Blog.

I have read him for some time on "City Journal" and heard him interviewed on Dennis Prager's radio program, but was not aware that he had started his own blog.

What is interesting to me is how, both he and Neil Fergeson, the historian, acknowledge that a source of the downfall of British culture is the demise of Chrisitanity , but both admit that they are not believers.

I believe that this is also noted by Melanie Phillips in Londonistan.

The highest church attendance in Britian is reported to be Catholics and Black Pentecostals.

[Earthdweller]

It must suck to be a highly intelligent liberal. They hate Islamic fascism and recognize the threat but realize that only their arch enemy the Christians can defeat the threat.

(I see little minds spinning..."How can we defeat Islamic fascists without supporting Chritianitly? Hmmmmmm....hmmmmmm.")

It must be very perplexing indeed and a little depressing. This gives rise to defeatism like you see in this article.

I hope the libs sitting on the fence in this battle live long enough to figure out which side they must choose and support for their own survivals sake. LOL.

[MississippiMan]

The American Left is the problem here. They insist that we must surrender and run away immediately. This will inevitably lead to a major war, a war avoidable if those creatures would just knock it off.

---

They're ALWAYS a problem, but the problem is much, much deeper than just the American left. It's truly the world left. And our American leaders, including the president and Congress, refuse to step outside the politically correct box and say what needs to be said and do what needs to be done. You of course nailed it when you said they're avoiding not getting re-elected, but that's a totally unacceptable reason to put hundreds of millions of American citizens in greater jeopardy. Until we collectively, as a nation--citizens and leaders--refuse to be bound by political correctness, victory over our enemies will be impossible.

MM

[happygrl]

We wrestle not against flesh and blood.

Amen.

Our real ememy in Iran continues to be the Prince of Persia.

And other Powers and Principalities that have seduced the formerly Christian Middle East, Christian North Africa, and Christian Central Asia to follow a Counterfeit Religion.

[happygrl]

Personally I prefer small wars fought on time to huge wars fought because nobody wanted to fight the small war.

My sentiments also.

We should already have attacked Iran, unless there are chess pieces still being put in place of which I am unaware (quite likely) that have delayed this action.

I am praying that President Bush does not leave office with this impending nightmare left unresolved.

[Earthdweller]

"It's truly the world left. "

Exactly. They have in their little minds in the beginning that on an ideological level they can defeat both Islamic fascists and Christianity at the same time by pitting them against each other. In their minds..pitting "fascism" against "fascism".

Odd how they forget that Christian "fascism" gave birth to liberalism and enlightenment.

If the idiots all want to see what Islamic fascism gives birth to they can keep pretending that there is no real Islamic world jihad.

[FreeReign]

The first is the extent of political division in the non-Muslim world about what is afoot.

If this is the first reason why we aren't going to win, then I'm not going to waste my time reading the rest.

The Muslim world is as divided.

Most of our terrorist catches and kills have been with the help of Muslims.

[Iris7]

Again, I did not write this essay and am willing to defend only certain parts. The main thrust of Sherbourne's piece is that the main problem we have in dealing with the moslem situation is not the moslems in the near, middle, and far east Asia but instead our main problem is inside this country. (The exact same problem that faces us faces most of Europe, Canada, etc.)

The problem is an internal enemy, an enemy that makes dealing with the outer enemy perhaps impossible. This enemy wants our defeat in this struggle. This enemy controls most (but no longer all!!) of the mass media and educational and governmental establishment. As a shorthand name I call them the American Left.

I watch their pounding nightly propaganda on television, watch it being pounded into our children in the public schools, and watch the likes of Howard Dean, Pelosi, Harry Reid, Ted Kennedy, Boxer, and so many others doing everything they can to sabotage our operations in Iraq and elsewhere. They insist we quit our efforts, and quit now.

The divisions within the Islamic world are being skillfully employed by United States citizens to help the local people build a relatively modern, safe, non-terrorist and peaceful moslem world. The American Left is doing everything possible to destroy this effort. No lie is too shameful for them if they think it may help them become more powerful.

[Blind Eye Jones]

The author forgot that they have the bargaining chip of OIL and we have the NUKE one, which they want. If anything, Islam is an alarm clock for western civ to wake itself up from its cold war slumbers with the Commies and face a new modern theocratic threat. The west is very critical and down with itself (all the injustices of Capitalism that we endlessly hear from cultural Marxists) but now is the time to take stock of it's wonderful achievements and celebrate its many high points. Especially, freedom. And what better way of doing that than ridding the world of the scourge of terrorism! Amen.

[Iris7]

You are most welcome.

[sonic109]

We can only defeat ourselves.
I think we're doing a real good job of that right now..we better wake us FAST !

[Iris7]

Sir, we shall prevail.

Our current "Political Correctness", that "Newspeak" "doublethink" (as Orwell might have put it) will be destroyed. One hopes that it won't be moslem conquest that brings this about.

[stultorum]

"May I reiterate that although I find this analysis unpleasant I also find it convincing?

I do not find it convincing at all.

What I would have found convincing is if the author had mentioned cultural and demographics reasons. He did not, therefore I must consider the author a detractor, a saboteur and an enemy of the Western World.

[Iris7]

We shall prevail.

I think I see a possible way to get the job done without much city busting. The current operations in Iraq etc. are going well and have an adequate probability of success. The only people who will try to screw this up are kill crazy freaks like Amadinejad and "American" Leftists.

[Iris7]

I wish I had not made such an unqualified statement.

The central thrust of his argument, it seems to me, is that we cannot win this war with Islamic terrorism unless we deal with those here in the West who demand immediate surrender and withdrawal from the East. This is my position also.

There is a lot of puerile European world-weary angst and ennui in this article (some terrible writing too!!) but I didn't pay attention to it. Most people just refuse to grow up. And not just Europeans.

[stultorum]

"The central thrust of his argument, it seems to me, is that we cannot win this war with Islamic terrorism unless we deal with those here in the West who demand immediate surrender and withdrawal from the East. This is my position also.

And as long as the Western World does not address immigration, demographics and cultural issues or stop sending our Christian children to public indoctrination centers (aka, public schools) there can be no real victory.

And, there can be no victory on any of the issues facing America until the media and our schools are again in the hands of the American people, rather than in the hands of the enemies of Christianity who lie to us and poison the minds and spirits of our children.

[Iris7]

I fear I have been unclear.

I am 60 years old. Looking at my back trail I see a fellow who, decade after decade, decided "Now I am grown up!!" Happened when I was ten, twenty, thirty, etc. Finally I can see that since I believed then so predictably and repetitiously that "I was a big boy now" that instead of finally becoming the big boy of my childhood dreams I was still a child dreaming a child's dreams. A 60 year old man with a child's dreams. I suppose the wisdom of age is the understanding that one is a child dreaming a child's dreams. Looks like I have been a real swelled head about my humility all these years.

[Iris7]

Agree that true victory requires escape from The Ministry of Truth and the requirement that we love Big Brother (as Orwell put it).

One step on the road to victory is to get those people who insist on our submission in idea and deed (been fighting them for a long time now) to get out of our way while we deal with this moslem terrorism business. I am hoping that this will lead to an increasingly widespread willingness to abandon our submissive acceptance of intellectual, moral, and spiritual domination. I do not like Americans acting like draft animals, like chickens in little cages under red lights in huge buildings being fed the ground up remains of our ancestors.

[Screaming_Gerbil]

This analysis completely misses the West's most important secret weapon: Hispanics. Take a hot-blooded people that celebrate revenge/violence (machismo), and tell them they can't have bikini girls anymore. Guess what's gonna happen?

You're assumming that a future generation of Hispanics and/or Blacks would not be willing to support / embrace Islam. I see that Islam seems to appeal to the poor masses, and gives young and poor people who are without hope a vision and a greater purpose.

If this "global economy" causes masses of poor hispanics and blacks in America to live in constant grinding poverty, thy may not be fighting on the side of "the man".

[Iris7]

May I welcome you to the Free Republic? Your views are shared by most of us here.

As the sage once asked so clearly, "Is life so dear, and peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?"

Forbid it, O Almighty God. Amen.