No Brats Allowed!

MSNBC ^ | 8/15/06 | Victoria Clayton

[steve-b]

For Cindy Nooney's 3-year-old twin boys, playing with the Thomas the Train set at their local bookstore in Southern California is a major thrill. Jack and Sam push Thomas, Arthur and friends down the track, they run around the table, jump up and down — and, of course, they squeeeaal.

Nooney expects as much in the children's section of the store. But on a recent afternoon, she was surprised by an employee who confronted her, calling her darling Jack a tyrant.

"He was a little loud but this is a children's section," says Nooney. "They run a noisy, cavernous bookstore but they don’t want kids to make any noise? It just seems ridiculous and leads me to believe that they don't want kids, they want silent kids."

The bookstore is not the only place that likes quiet, controlled children — and isn't afraid to say so. Across the nation, there are signs of a low-burning uprising against children supposedly behaving badly in public.

Eateries from California to Massachusetts have posted signs on doors and menus saying "We love children, especially when they are tucked in chairs and well behaved" or "Kids must use indoor voices." In North Carolina an online petition was started last year to establish child-free restaurants — the petition loosely compared dining with children to dining with cigarette smoke....

[ThisLittleLightofMine]

LOL....I'm going to have to tell my husband that.

[MizSterious]

Maybe it encourages the adults with uncontrollable kids to shop more and buy more, but if I go into a book store and the decible level is too high, I leave without shopping. Amazon.com is easier anyway.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

This "time out" and "not a choice" crap needs to be retired right quick. If a parent is unable to control his or child, he or she should not take that child out to public places---plain and simple.

[ThisLittleLightofMine]

ping

[B Knotts]

Yes, there are people who let their kids run amok. But there is also, especially on the coasts, an anti-child mood in some of the large metro areas. A woman in San Francisco wrote an article about it some time ago...she would get dirty looks because she had three kids, if I recall correctly.

But this issue of bad behavior is hardly new; it has been going on for some time. Look at the current crop of adults, who do things like casually jaywalk or even stand in the street, then glare at you for not just stopping for them.

[fortunecookie]

There seem to be a lot of kids raised without the parents ever setting any limits. Complain to the parents about, oh, say, syrup poured down your back in a restaurant just for instance, and they glower at you and imply you're a grouch for not enjoying the whole thing.

So many of them say they want their child to feel free to explore his environment, and when they've done something 'wrong', to 'reason' with the 2 year old. Absolutely no limits. My son is older now, but as a preschooler he had his share of 'moments', but they were just moments. I can recall some of his friends just running wild. And the sappy parents encouraging, at least tacitly, such behavior. One young guy was given to full fledge, rolling on the ground tantrums that turned on and off as if by switch, and not at age 2, but ages 5, 6 & 7. The school eventually set limits that brought his tantrums to a halt. I could go on, but I won't. It's like the ultimate me generation thinking - their little darlings are their 'works of art' who should be allowed to express whatever, whenever and these kids' seeming cleverness is somehow a reflection of their own importance.

[MizSterious]

The reason you never saw signs like that back then was because for the most part, they weren't needed. People understood (again, for the most part) that children needed to behave. It's only recently that brats are actually celebrated, rather than punished.

[CFC__VRWC]

Children running wild at a store like Walmart, etc., holds other dangers--several have been abducted in our area over the years.

A three-year-old was recently killed at a Wal Mart when a floor display mirror fell on her. I'm not saying that the child was misbehaving, and IMO the store is responsible for making sure this kind of thing doesn't happen and should pay dearly for their negligence. But still, it gives you something to think about.

[frogjerk]

"I mean c'mon.. She's from West Hollywood, shops at Whole Foods, is unmarried and calls parents "breeders"? "

Whole Foods Market bans sale of live lobsters

Dummies...

[blu]

My mom can still make sparks fly out of her eyes! I am getting better at not trembling in her presence...much to her dismay!

[OldFriend]

If this woman is acknowledging her children were a 'little' loud you can imagine just how disruptive they were.

My guess is that she doesn't go to the bookstore to purchase anything, but to give her darlings a place to play.

[Lokibob]

You are very wrong.

Family friendly does not mean to let the little ones go wild.

A family friendly restaurant is an adult situation. A McDonald's with a play land is a kids park.

I demanded my kids use adult manners (napkins, patience etc). My kids learned very quickly that I could not deny them the bathroom in restaurant's. So, of course, I gotta go was the call. In this case, my wife (for the girl or i accompanied them. the bathroom was NOT play land.

When my kids were growing up, I insisted on adult manners in adult situations. When one threw a fit in the local store, I firmly brought him out to the car and we sat in the car until Mom finished shopping. and then another reminder when we got home. the next day, a reminder of what happened last trip. Firm, consistent and demanding was my policy.

If a child wanted to see something in the store, he (she) asked me if it was ok. Generally I said OK, but if it was breakable, Id hold it for them.

they paid for their own items with the clerk, using politeness and thank yous. They carried their own items out to the car and they felt like such hot s***s having made a purchase. Of course, if one of the kids misbehaved, he (she) got nothing while the others had toys. You pay for the consequences of your actions.

[N. Beaujon]

Yes, kids sometimes misbehave in public places. And, yes, some parents won't handle the situation. But, I'm more annoyed with loud, obnoxious adults. They should know better. I have seen many more bratty adults than children.

And this is apropos of what? Because there are bratty adults that means we should tolerate bratty children? All you've done is create a straw man argument to completely deflect from the real source of the evil. Over-entitled, bratty adults raising even more out of control and noxious "children", if you can call them that.

[VRWCmember]

I was speaking in generalities based on my overall experiences. Yes, I agree it is not ok to let a child run out of control just because it is a family restaurant, but nonetheless you will see lots of families with out-of-control kids in such places.

Also, responsible parenting is not something limited to the "well-to-do" and is in fact often lacking in that social group. However, I have noticed that in more upscale restaurants the socially conscious "well-to-do" types the dine there are typically motivated by a desire not to be embarrassed by their offspring so they will keep them under control. Again -- this is a generality. My point was that people who don't want to be bothered by unruly children can make choices that make it less likely that they will encounter them.

[July 4th]

I'm glad it's the kids. I thought you were talking about these for a minute.

[absolootezer0]

could be worse. every once in a while i have parents that bring in kids into my bar. since the owner will not institute a "no kids" policy, i get to suffer. i hate the people that come in with their kids and all of their kids' friends, order two large pizzas and a pitcher of soda, then sit there and drink and smoke, letting the kids run wild. a huge mess gets made, paying customers leave, and then the parents usually stiff me on the tip.

[New Girl]

“I do think some people turn parenting into something it shouldn’t be," she says. "They want to take their children to fancy restaurants, art openings and R-rated movies instead of getting sitters.”

This is the voice of reason in the article. I think it totally unreasonable to expect small children to behave in certain situations. Howeever, parents today, because of their own selfishness or guilt, insist on bringing small children to inappropriate venues. It's not the child's fault. When I was growing up, my parents either got a sitter or stayed home. I don't think parents back then expected to have much of social life if they had small children. Heck, my parents even attended church separately to be considerate of other parishoners. A girlfriend's recent wedding ceremony was ruined by a screaming baby in the church. What kind of idiot brings a baby to someone's wedding ceremony?

[N. Beaujon]

rofling!!!

[no dems]

Some "parents" get upset when I offer them the use of my belt.

GOOD FOR YOU! Another tactic is to say to the person with you, loud enough for the mother, and everyone else to hear, "THAT KID NEEDS A GOOD A** WHOOPING".

[Kieri]

I go to the local McDonalds for coffee. There is a bunch of blue haired "ROMEO"s (retired old men eating out). Each and every one of 'em must be deaf as a board. None of them talk in a normal tone of voice. They spend their time drinking coffee and yelling at each other about the day's events. Just as bad as kids...

When my 80-something in-laws were in town and wanted to go out to dinner, I was able to sneak in a minute ahead and talk to the hostess. I told her my MIL was mostly deaf, we had to nearly shout to make ourselves heard (she wasn't exactly quiet either), and if she could find us a spot where we would be less likely to bother other diners. I think she appreciated the warning and did her best to accommodate us, and we were eating at a time when the restaurant wasn't full.

I know what you mean about the elderly. I'm pretty sensitive to people in wheelchairs and Amigos since I need them occasionally myself, but there are seniors who are downright RUDE. They don't say "please," "thank you" and remind me of bad-mannered toddlers.