The lamentation of the slut

Washington Times ^ | 7-27-06 | Suzanne Fields

[pollyannaish]

That is flat out not true. To say so makes me believe you have never been, nor known, someone with significant disease.

YOUR post makes me a lot more upset that Capt. Norms because people CHOOSE how they dress and need to do so appropriately for their body.

But people often do NOT choose what disease they have. Ever seen a body ravaged by chemo, or reliant on prednisone? Do you know what it is like to see a four year old child bloated from disease and an attempt to keep her alive: while getting the bare caloric necessities through a damn feeding tube?

Weight is NOT always a matter of self-discipline. Often, yes. Always, no.

You are a jerk.

[kAcknor]

Nice Boobies demand a pair of Great Tits...

[capt. norm]

Many people have conditions or have to take meds which result in being overweight

I was talking about people pigging out on sweets (visibly) and who seemed to have no self-discipline. You read, selectively, from my posts exactly what you wanted to argue about and ignored the rest.

The MSM would love to have you as a reporter.

[Gumlegs]

Here's a big, blue tit for you!

[capt. norm]

There are numerous diseases with numerous symptoms and those with disease are, of course, exempted from any humor.

I spoke only about those who had a choice and were visibly over-indulging in my presence.

Do you really think I meant to insult those few who had no control over their size and shape?

I have had several, dearly loved, obsese relatives, one by a medical problem and the others by choice and they all died way early.

Maybe if we can stop glossing it over, people will eat more responsibly and live longer productive lives. Ignoring it will not make the problem go away. We need to get out of denial.

[pollyannaish]

I am not upset at you in the slightest and agree with much of what you said. In fact, we DO need to take more responsibility for our health—and I am perfectly comfortable with including myself in that admonishment.

I only put you in the "to" line as a courtesy because I mentioned your post as an example and you were getting flack for being rude. What you said didn't bother me in the least.

That said, I am really upset at tortoise saying that even people with disease don't have to be overweight. I have plenty of experience with people fighting disease. More than I wish. A case in point; We lost my 4 year old niece after a long struggle and by the end she was swollen up like a balloon. She looked huge and could barely fit into clothes or move her little body around when they took her out of the hospital to play in a park or spend a little time shopping.

We have seen first hand the judgmental looks that people like tortoise cast...and I can tell you that people who can not cut others a little slack in THOSE situations are cold, heartless, jerks.

Just like those who would allow their flab to hang out because they have no respect for others, people like tortoise appear to believe that no slack should be cut others facing the complexities of illness.

Bottom line: Courtesy extends, imo, both ways. I am pretty sure we agree on that.

[tortoise]

But people often do NOT choose what disease they have.

Irrelevant. They have a choice as to whether or not to consume a non-fattening number of calories regardless of the disease they have. There is a floor to the number of calories one consumes such that you will not put on fat no matter what disease you have, and that metabolic floor is not even obscenely low (though it does limit what you can eat). I know people who ride the edge of that floor voluntarily (I think they are crazy, but it is their life).

Ever seen a body ravaged by chemo, or reliant on prednisone?

Yes and yes. Neither causes fat to materialize on the body, the subject at hand.

Do you know what it is like to see a four year old child bloated from disease and an attempt to keep her alive: while getting the bare caloric necessities through a damn feeding tube?

Again, what does this have to do with getting fat? Being bloated has nothing to do with being fat; stop trying to conflate unrelated subjects in your rant, you've said nothing relevant to fat management.

Weight is NOT always a matter of self-discipline. Often, yes. Always, no.

Weight, no. Fat, yes. It is disingenuous to conflate the two when we are talking about the latter and not the former.

You are a jerk.

Probably, but saying so does not help you demonstrate that people get fat by magic or some other means other than poor caloric discipline. The subject of discussion here, and my previous post, was the consumption of calories in excess of metabolic need. Every obese person does this, and does it unnecessarily regardless of any disease they may have.

[capt. norm]

I had a cousin with which I was very close. We were part of a set of three cousins growing up...the first on my mother's side of the family and for several years we were the only grandchildren.

We were like the "Three Musketeers" and always played together and ate together at Grandma's Sunday dinners.

One of my cousins started going back for "thirds" (we all did "seconds") and from then on it seemed like she was always eating something.

She continued to overeat into young adulthood. Then it started to unravel. Her excess weight set off what the doctors referred to as "adult-onset dibetes". Then the next dominoe fell and she lost feeling in her feet.

It didn't stop there. She went blind as a result of the diabetes and conditions worsened. We lost her last year, but I can't help but think something could have been done, early on, and she would still be with us.

This has to stop...we can't brush it under the table anymore.

[pollyannaish]

Ok. You are correct that fat/bloat/weight are not the same. Scientifically accurate. And you are absolutely correct that MOST people who are obese are that way out of choice.

Now that said, we were originally discussing appearances...how often do you think people stopped and thought..."Hey, wait a minute, that little tubby four year old is bloated, not fat!"

Sigh. It's no big deal really. It's just that this kind of judgmental crap starts to drive me nuts after a while. There are times when I am almost relieved my niece did not have to grow up to live in a world of people who do not demonstrate even an ounce of compassion for the struggles others face, choice or no choice. I say almost, because frankly, I'd rather she'd had a chance and I miss her terribly.

Ok, now that I've said my piece, I need to ask your forgiveness for calling you a jerk. I hope you will forgive me for that. Having my buttons pushed is no excuse and I should have had more "self-control."

[Stoat]

MOST BORING SLUT THREAD EVER...

Is it hot babes that you are looking for?

[arizonarachel]

LOL...I don't know why this reminded me, but I was at Wal-Mart recently with my parents. We were looking for a broom (they just moved into a new house out here in AZ and didn't have one), and were standing there when we here this 'BEEP' noise. A lady, in her little cart, BEEPED at us. In the aisle - instead of just saying, "excuse me," (she was literally a foot away from me), she beeped! Is this what society is coming to? It was the weirdest thing...because when we moved, she said: "Thank you," just plain as day... Sigh!

[capt. norm]

Deja vu (or however they spell it) it has happened to me several times.

The thing that really got to me was when I was entering Wal-Mart raght behid an elderly getleman with a cane and a slow, unsteady walk. As we got up to where the shopping carts were, this huge blimp parks herself on the only remaining electric cart, right in front of the elderly guy and she smirked at us (those of us watching is disbelief) as she pulled off.

[pollyannaish]

I completely understand and I very sorry for your loss. Not only that, but I understand your sense of helplessness at her self-destructive behavior.

I think the point is, that your cousin had to make the decision to save herself. No amount of external haranguing, pushing or shaming her could change her behavior. In fact, that kind of thing often weakens a person's will to the point where they don't want to bother doing the right thing. Her only hope, was to find the strength within herself to choose life, to know she was loved even when she screwed up and to get right back on track.

I am not saying that we should not call a spade a spade, because we must in order to make sure people understand the choices they are making . But we must also approach this with a great deal of compassion—not absolving them of responsibility—but understanding that doing the right thing can be very difficult.

[Texas Songwriter]

I have a serious question. Did Hillary Clinton in any way commission, sign off on, or promulgation the sculpture? Is this a tactic she is using?

[Aquinasfan]

CapeCod?

Worcester area. Lots of Brazilians in the Framingham/Worcester area.