Divers find Hitler's aircraft carrier

timesonline ^ | 27 July 06 | Roger Boyes

[saganite]

The location of the wreck of the Graf Zeppelin had been a mystery for more than half a century

POLISH divers have discovered the rusting wreckage of Nazi Germany’s only aircraft carrier, the Graf Zeppelin, solving one of the most enduring maritime riddles of the Second World War. For more than half a century the location of the huge vessel was kept secret by the Soviet authorities. Even the opening of the Moscow archives in the 1990s failed to produce a precise bearing. The once-proud ship was simply one of dozens of wrecks that littered the bed of the Baltic Sea near the Bay of Gdansk.

“We were carrying out soundings for possible oil exploration,” Krzysztof Grabowski, of the Petrobaltic exploration group, said. “Then we stumbled across a vessel that was over 260 metres (850ft) long at a depth of 250 metres.”

Divers confirmed this week that it was the German ship, though who owns her and what — if anything — will happen to her remains unclear.

When the Graf Zeppelin was launched in 1938, Adolf Hitler raised his right arm in salute to a warship that was supposed to help Germany to become master of the northern seas. But, when fleeing German troops scuttled her in April 1945, she had never seen service — a casualty of infighting within the Nazi elite and the changing tide of war.

The Graf Zeppelin was scuttled in shallow water near Szczecin and it proved easy for the Red Army to recover her after marching into the Polish port. According to an agreement with the Allies, German and Japanese warships should have been sunk in deep water or destroyed. The Russians repaired the ship, then used her to carry looted factory equipment back to the Soviet Union. In August 1947 Allied spies observed her being towed back to the Polish Baltic coast and then used for target practice at Leba by Soviet dive bombers. It appeared that the Russians were preparing for possible action against US aircraft carriers.

The Graf Zeppelin sank a second time, and remained undetected until now.

Lukasz Orlicki, a Polish maritime historian, said: “It is difficult to say why the Russians have always been so stubbornly reluctant to talk about the location of the wreck. Perhaps it was the usual obsession with secrecy, or perhaps there was some kind of suspect cargo.”

At 262 metres, the Graf Zeppelin was comparable to the biggest of the US carriers that played such a significant role in the Pacific. She had a range of 8,000 nautical miles, meaning that she could easily have reached the North Sea.

[mad_as_he$$]

One of my favorites!!!

[SAMWolf]

What really happened to the "KMS Europa", although the previous "alternate history" was more exciting.

Europa (projected appearence)

The passenger ship Europa was one of the famous ship of the North German Lloyd line traveling on the North Atlantic route. After the start of World War II, the ships was first used as a barrack ship and in 1940 as a troop transport. Being the largest passenger ship in Germany, the Europa was also selected in the 1942 auxiliary carrier program, but because of the lack of stability and the high fuel consumption, its conversion was stopped in November 1942.

After the war, the Europa was taken over by the US who used the ship as troops transport AP 177 . In 1946 it was given to France, renamed as Liberte and used as a ocean liner again between 1950 and 1962.

[Tallguy]

The Bf-109's landing gear arrangement was barely adequate as it was. It's not clear how it could have been beefed up given that it had to retract outward into a fairly thin wing. Many Bf-109's suffered collapsed landing gears -- especially when operating from rough airfield in the East.

A better choice would have been the FW-190A. It had a wide-track landing gear that folded inward. Plus, it had a radial engine for ease of maintenance -- an important consideration for carriers. Folding wingtips, similar to the Zero could have been added.

Much is made of German aircraft designs making it to Japan. I guess German pride would have prevented the adoption of the A6M Zero.

[Michael.SF.]

US losses by comparison were around 20%.

Actually, I believe they were significantly lower then that.

[Michael.SF.]

I stand corrected, 1 of 5 it is.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

According to this website U.S. Submarine Losses in World War II we lost one in five submariners which would be 20% but I have seen lower numbers for combat losses.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

LOL GMTA

I think maybe one is total losses and the other is combat losses.

[fso301]

I doubt it would have ever gotten out into the open Atlantic. The Royal Navy would have been all over it. The sinking of the Bismarck changed the game, virtually requiring the Germans to focus on U-Boats.

Consider the outcome had she been ready in time to sail with the Bismark.

[LukeL]

[fso301]

Many Bf-109's suffered collapsed landing gears -- especially when operating from rough airfield in the East.

BF-109 also had weak wings. A little bit of damage and a tight turn could snap the wing. Wings were also unable to house high velocity 20mm cannon.

[saganite]

Aww. dang! I liked the first story a heck of a lot better.

[festus]

Quick... float it, so we can sink it again, just on principle

If we could make it float again let it float up to France's shores and see if they surrender again.

[Spirited]

Congratulations to the divers of Poland.
May the obscured reasons be revealed.

[Oztrich Boy]

She had a range of 8,000 nautical miles, meaning that she could easily have reached the North Sea.

Well mighta nreded to refuel at Brunsbuttel, but yes, The North Sea was a possibilty.

[Gandalf_The_Gray]

As the old joke goes:

Not quite right, you left a few out:

Heaven is where the police are British, the cooks French, The mechanics German, the lovers Italian and it is all organized by the Swiss.

Hell is where the chefs are British, the mechanics French, the lovers Swiss, the police German, and it is all organized by the Italians.

Regards,
GtG

[amigatec]

The Japs close to 40 Aircraft Carriers during WW2 and ALL of them are sunken wrecks now.

[Michael.SF.]

Well, truth be told I left the others out for brevity. There are many variations of this joke, yours is one of them. Usually when I tell it I use: The Swiss are the lovers and the Italians run the government. Of course reversing the roles, as appropriate.

Another version adds the Scots into the mix. In as much as: In Heaven the Scots run the Bank and in Hell, the Scots run the Bank.

[Rb ver. 2.0]

Wow! Never heard about that one before. To attempt to board an aircraft carrier and gain control via hand to hand combat must have taken balls of steel.

[oneamericanvoice]

That was my first thought...the GrafZeppelin was a dirigable.

[oneamericanvoice]

Thank God for in-fighting!