Utahns say no thanks to illegal alien handouts (POLL)

Salt Lake Tribune ^ | 6/22/06 | Jennifer W. Sanchez

[goalinestan]

Most Utahns feel a state law that allows undocumented students to pay in-state college tuition should be repealed, according to a new Salt Lake Tribune poll.

Seventy-one percent of the 625 registered voters who were interviewed by telephone for the statewide poll this week said Utah should "repeal the current state law that offers the discounted resident college tuition rate to the children of undocumented immigrants."

Ruth Bick, a 63-year-old Ogden resident, said Utahns should not have to pay taxes to subsidize a college education for undocumented students. The state's middle class already is burdened enough with big tax bills, she said.

"Taxpayers should not have to pay for illegal children to go to school here," said Bick, a poll respondent who calls herself a political independent. "I just don't know what the answer is."

Layne Barnes, a West Jordan Republican who also participated in the poll, said children of undocumented immigrants already get free assistance and a free public school education, so "they should not be rewarded for breaking the law."

"I have no sympathy for them," he said of undocumented students.

But Shane Andrews, a stay-at-home dad and poll respondent, said in-state tuition is about wanting to "make them [undocumented Utahns] better people.''

''If they can't better themselves, their only alternative is to seek more public assistance," said the 32-year-old Republican.

The 2002 Utah law grants in-state college tuition rates to undocumented students who attended a state high school for at least three years and graduated. Last year, 169 students qualified for the tuition rates under the law, state numbers show. Rep. Glenn Donnelson, R-North Ogden, has sponsored a bill for the past three years to repeal the law, but he has had no success. Still, he has said he will try again.

Philip Bernal, Salt Lake County Hispanic Democratic Caucus chairman, said the poll results on the tuition question "are not positive for education or Utah's future." Bernal, who didn't take the poll, said it's all in the wording of the question because the poll could have asked: Should Utah residents, who have attended at least three years at a state high school and graduated, be allowed to pay in-state college tuition?

There's a "misperception" statewide that the law allows undocumented students, many of whom have spent most of their education in Utah schools and cannot apply for federal financial aid, to pay less tuition, Bernal said.

"They're residents of Utah like everyone else," said Bernal, who had worked in higher education for 34 years. "It's not a benefit - it's a right they have."

In a January 2006 Tribune poll, nearly 60 percent of respondents said Utah should "repeal the state law that offers the discounted resident college tuition rate to the children of undocumented immigrants."

The statewide telephone poll by the Washington, D.C.-based Mason-Dixon Polling & Research, Inc. was conducted Monday and Tuesday and had a margin of error of 4 percentage points.

Minorities make up 16 percent - Latinos 11 percent - of the state's population and 12 percent of Utahns do not speak English at home, according to the U.S. census. The poll did not ask about respondents' ethnicity.

Many Utahns also said they support building a wall along the U.S.-Mexico border (56 percent); oppose a path to citizenship for immigrants who are in the United States illegally (54 percent); and feel the state government should not have a public information Web site in Spanish (46 percent).

Bick said a pathway to citizenship is out of the question. A wall would give the United States "control of the border." And she doesn't want millions of state tax dollars spent on translating services into different languages.

''I hate that I have to 'Press 1' to hear English,'' Bick said. ''If they're here, they should know English.'' Barnes, a Utah Minuteman Project supporter, agreed. He went to the border in Fall 2005 with a group of Minutemen to learn more about the area and definitely supports a wall.

"I would help build it," Barnes said. He hears a lot on the news about Latinos committing crimes and blames them for Utah's unsafe streets. Barnes said he is frustrated that the employees at the fast-food burger joint in his neighborhood only speak Spanish.

"They're illegal aliens," he said. "I'm tired of being a victim."

Bernal said the wall being built on the border is not welcoming.

''It's the United States saying . . . we don't want to be neighbors,'' he said. ''If we decide later we don't like people who speak French, are we going to put a wall on [the U.S.-Canada] border?''

[Rex Anderson]

It is complimentary... He wants this thread to remain active and have lots of people read it.

Welcome to FR, by the way!

[VOA]

"Bump"s come in these types:

1. Bumps for exposure of the material. These usually are written thusly:
"bump"
"bump to the top" Or shorthand of "bttt"
"bump for publicity"
"bump for exposure"
Overall, it's just an attempt to keep the thread title at or near the
top of the browse articles list, thus assuring that more people see it
simply due to the virtue of most folks start browsing at the top of that list

OR

2. Bump for a place-holder
This is done so that you can find the article quickly if you look at your
"pings' list within the next couple of days

OR

3. Bump for a reminder
This is just about the same as #2 above.
Often you'll see someone say
"bump for later read" in this case.

I hate to admit it, but it took me a while to get a hand of the full
functionality of this place, but it's worth it.

[VOA]

just an additional sampling of the feedback our civil servants were
getting while some Senators were talking about how much "the American people"
hungered and thirsted for their "comprehensive package":

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0605/26/ldt.01.html


DOBBS: And senator, Senator McCain is saying you are doing the will of the
American people. Where in the world -- what planet is he on?

HUTCHISON: Well, Lou, I think that he's very sincere, and I think that...

DOBBS: Well, I am not talking about his sincerity. I am sure he is sincere.
I am just asking where in the world is his attachment to reality?

HUTCHISON: Well, it's not what I am hearing from my constituents.
I have been doing phone tallies, of course, to know where people are, e-mails,
faxes and phone tallies. And this week I had 1,578 call in against the bill
and 12 called in for it. That's what I'm hearing everywhere I go.

[Reaganwuzthebest]

McCain and the polls coming from the WSJ and the Manhattan Institute are as phony as a three dollar bill.

Here's another victory in Virginia for those of us who are pro-borders:

Miller wins GOP nomination in 50th District:

Miller pounced on the red-hot topic of illegal immigration, saying in order to scale down the "influx of illegal immigrants" in the county, "state and local governments must step to the plate" when the federal government will not.

[goalinestan]

Thank you very much!

[goalinestan]

Thanks a lot for the helpful information. I am slowly getting the terms and rules down. Appreciate the help!

[Soul Seeker]

Leaving aside discussions about how strong Sensenbrenner is on all aspects of the issue, no use going there, I'd stick to the obvious conclusion.

If one Republican loses a primary, they can all lose a primary. Gerrymandered districts are supposed to protect most of them from being fired. When that doesn't work, the full weight of the party apparatus is supposed to caccoon them. Money, endorsements and the like in primaries. It worked for Specter.

There's a possibility he's also friends with Cannon or perhaps they have another issue Sensenbrenner believes him to be key on. But I'd stick with the most obvious being the truth. If a 5 time incumbent can go down, they all can go down. And that isn't a comforting thought to suddenly discover you really are subject to the people above yourself, lobbyists and other politician cliques. It's a fear conservatives, liberals and everything inbetween in washington have in common.

Hence, the endorsement.

[colorcountry]

It's a fear conservatives, liberals and everything inbetween in washington have in common. Hence, the endorsement.

You hit the target right on.

[Arizona Carolyn]

By golly, simple deductions always work the best. Good post.