Posted on 06/11/2006 4:22:24 PM PDT by Mr. Brightside
Today: June 11, 2006 at 16:17:5 PDT
Armor Causing Humvees to Roll Over
ASSOCIATED PRESS
DAYTON, Ohio (AP) - Thousands of pounds of armor added to military Humvees, intended to protect U.S. troops, have made the vehicles more likely to roll over, killing and injuring soldiers in Iraq, a newspaper reported.
"I believe the up-armoring has caused more deaths than it has saved," said Scott Badenoch, a former Delphi Corp. vehicle dynamics expert told the Dayton Daily News for Sunday editions.
Since the start of the war, Congress and the Army have spent tens of millions of dollars on armor for the Humvee fleet in Iraq, the newspaper reported Sunday.
That armor - much of it installed on the M1114 Humvee built at the Armor Holdings Inc. plant north of Cincinnati - has shielded soldiers from harm.
But serious accidents involving the M1114 have increased as the war has progressed, and the accidents were much more likely to be rollovers than those of other Humvee models, the newspaper reported.
An analysis of the Army's ground accident database, which includes records from March 2003 through November 2005, found that 60 of the 85 soldiers who died in Humvee accidents in Iraq - or 70 percent - were killed when the vehicle rolled, the newspaper reported. Of the 337 injuries, 149 occurred in rollovers.
"The whole thing is a formula for disaster," said Badenoch, who is working with the military to design a lighter-armored vehicle to replace the Humvee.
Army spokesman John Boyce Jr. told The Associated Press on Sunday that the military takes the issue seriously and continues to provide soldiers with added training on the armored Humvee.
The Army also made safety upgrades to the vehicle, including improved seat restraint belts and a fire suppression system for the crew, he said.
There are more than 25,300 armored Humvees in Iraq and Afghanistan, he said.
When Humvees do roll, the most vulnerable passenger is the gunner, the soldier who operates the weapon mounted in the vehicle's top.
Gunners were killed in at least 27 of the 93 fatal Humvee accidents since 2001, according to the newspaper's analysis.
And if it is, then that should be addressed. But I'm not convinced that it is, and this article leaves a lot to be desired in the effort to clarify that charge.
Could be just antoher attempt at assaulting our troops. Dunno, the armored humvee is a stopgap measure anyway, right?
I suspect the weight of the machine gun and the gunner at the very top of the vehicle does more to change the center of gravity than the armor. Also, the ctitic here is trying to sell against the humvee. He has his own vehicle he is saying is superior. He may be right but his perspective should be considered.
I'm certain the center of gravity issue is why the HumVees
weren't equipped with top heavy armor in the first place. I'd also bet the army new this even before they placed an order for the vehicles and I wonder why they didn't speak up when the controvery hit.
Well, that could be. It could also be that the vehicle was not intended to be used in situations where it would be subjected to so much hostile fire.
I could be wrong, but I think it was intended to be used for transportation in relatively non-hositle situtations. The armoured carriers were more targeted for what the humvees are actually being used for IMO.
I don't know exactly how to answer that. Try my response in the post above. I'm not in the military and don't have any inside insight on this.
Don't forget where the complaints were coming from - the RATS. It goes to prove that the uneducated once again open their mouths. It has destroyed the humvees for what they were designed to do.
The day after Rumsfeld announced the "up-armoring" of HumVees, a Bradley was hit by an IED -- with nearly all (15?) troops on board killed.
Thanks. Wouldn't doubt it.
Wouldn't you agree that the armoured carriers are better, or do you have a different take on that?
"It has destroyed the humvees for what they were designed to do."
Nobody ever said that a Humvee was designed to be operated in an insurgency. We've made plenty of mistakes in the past. Blame the Gov't in general. It simply does not change once a design or a model of Military Structure is put in.
Look at Somalia. We used Humvees there and took a hit. 10 plus years later and we are still using them in an Urban environment.
I dunno if the Stryker is the answer or the Lav 25, but we can't expect a OverHauled Jeep to tbe the answer in an Hostlie environment.
Wouldn't you agree that the armoured carriers are better, or do you have a different take on that?
No opinion: My "armoured carriers" floated!
The problem is,how much "armor"can you put on a HumVee and have it still be "Mission Capable"?
why not use a real armored vehicle and ditch the humvee for these types of missions?
If the media weren't doing what they are perhaps we could fight this war like it should be. Then we wouldn't have the long drawn out street battles.
Hit them hard and keep hitting until they die or surrender. If they surrender dont let them out of jail and interrogate them agressively. No whining about a dog barking in their face or panties on their head.
perhaps if we were fighting it that way the whole issue of armored humvees wouldnt exist.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m996.htm
You would think that these are even more top heavy.
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