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White House: Haditha details to be public
AP/Yahoo ^ | 5/31/06 | Unknown

Posted on 05/31/2006 6:20:21 AM PDT by Coop

... Snow said that he has been assured by the Pentagon that "all the details" will be made available...

Rep. John Murtha... has said Marines shot and killed unarmed civilians in a taxi at the scene and went into two homes and shot others.

On Tuesday, [Snow] said President Bush learned of the killings only after a reporter from Time magazine asked questions...

Asked when Bush was first briefed about the events in Haditha, an insurgent stronghold in western Iraq, Snow replied Tuesday: "When a Time reporter first made the call."

According to the attorney for one of three Marine Corps officers relieved of command from a Marine battalion are not targets of investigations into whether their troops killed the civilians or tried to cover it up.

Meanwhile, Lance Cpl. James Crossan of North Bend, Wash., who was injured in the roadside bomb attack in Haditha, told a Seattle television station that some of the Marines might have snapped after seeing one of their own killed in action.

"So, I think they were just blinded by hate ... and they just lost control," Crossan told KING-TV, which aired the interview Tuesday.

The targets... are about a dozen enlisted Marines, according to Hackett, a Marine reservist and Iraqi war veteran who represents Kimber... [Hackett] said the highest ranking among those under investigation is a staff sergeant who led the four-vehicle convoy that was hit by the bomb.

Kimber... was relieved of command last month because his subordinates... used profanity and criticized the performance of Iraqi security services during an interview with Britain's Sky News TV...

...Hackett told The Associated Press by telephone. "He's not under investigation for anything related to what has played out in the press." [snip]

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Crime/Corruption; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: alleged; crossan; hackett; haditha; iraq; jamescrossan; kimber; marines; massacre; murtha; murthawatch
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To: Coop
a President involved in operational details of military engagements.

I don't think anyone here wants that - a scenario we have seen before. Anyway, this President has shown that he has faith in the military leaders on the ground so that is not even in question. Tony's "Time" remark may have been a flippant one - not realizing how it would play. Myself, I believe the President knew something of this before "Time". He gets casualty reports which are bound to include Iraqi military and civilians. Perhaps Tony meant that Pres Bush did not know of the slant Time was going to put on this incident.

101 posted on 05/31/2006 8:55:25 AM PDT by daybreakcoming (If destruction be our lot, we must ourselves be its author and finisher. A. Lincoln)
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To: lugsoul
Yes, but his word as a defense attorney is now gold to those who want to treat this story as made up from whole cloth.

And it's an annoying spur under the saddle for the likes of you.

102 posted on 05/31/2006 8:55:32 AM PDT by Coop (FR = a lotta talk, but little action)
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To: libstripper
I suspect whatever killings occurred were perpetrated by terrorists wearing counterfeit US uniforms.

OK, so explain this part:

First official report "concluded" that the Iraqis civilians were killed by the IED.

A subsequent investigation concluded that the Iraqis were killed by gunfire.

Gunshot and shrapnel wounds look very different from one another.

So how did the terrorists get the Marine commander to submit a false report up his chain of command?

103 posted on 05/31/2006 8:56:01 AM PDT by BeHoldAPaleHorse ( ~()):~)>)
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To: Freee-dame
Is Murtha the "military official?"

Do you really have to ask that question? Who else has been trying these Marines in the press?
104 posted on 05/31/2006 8:57:48 AM PDT by boxerblues
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To: Coop
Nobody corrected them on the 'Net

There was no "'Net" as we know it in 1991.

105 posted on 05/31/2006 9:00:02 AM PDT by sinkspur ( Don Cheech. Vito Corleone would like to meet you......Vito Corleone.....)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum; Cold Heat

I don't believe the president needs to be informed everytime cilvilians are killed in Iraq- my thoughts were more about how soon after Murtha made his accusations the president was told..

I probably was unclear in my first couple of posts on this.

My son was a combat soldier in Iraq- so while my understanding of situations on the ground is not personal- he's given me some perspective:)


106 posted on 05/31/2006 9:00:22 AM PDT by SE Mom (God Bless those who serve.)
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To: foxfield

Like Kerry the traitor's record, an SF180 must be signed by him releasing the info.


107 posted on 05/31/2006 9:00:32 AM PDT by afnamvet (It is what it is.)
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To: Coop

Murtha is the one that should be on trial. I don't understand why everyone is falling into this pack of lies. First we are at war, if civilians get in the way, that's just happens to be part of the war. We all know that the terrorist are cowards and hide behind woman and children, and here is a prime example as to why. Because we have idiots in the goverenment that are trying with all their might to make our armed forces look bad and use this kind of incident to twist and turn and make the soldiers look as though they are the bad guys.
These are the same terrorist that had their own blow up the the world trade center, these are the same people that behead people, these are the same people that killed thousand and thousand of their own. We went over there to help stop all this and to also keep them from our shores. But all we get is what bad soldiers we have, please!!!! These are not murderers, these are soldiers doing their job. If Murtha was a general, I assume that it was during the Viet Nam War and he was one of those brave elitist that sat on his butts in DC directing the war and didn't have a clue as to what was truly going on over there.
What we need is the people of our country to come up in arms to help these soldiers, but instead we believe the liberal BS.
Maybe the President did know about it, what difference does it make, he knows that these men/woman are over their doing a very difficult job. Its war, and there truly is nothing else to say.


108 posted on 05/31/2006 9:02:25 AM PDT by moneypenny (if your for the UN you are UNAmerican)
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To: Coop
Completely depends on whether or not it was intentional.

The first report reported, supposedly based on detailed examination of the scene after the fact by all involved, including the officer submitting the report, that the deaths were the product of shrapnel from the IED. But higher-ups found inconsistencies, dug a little deeper, and found that the deaths were the product of gunfire.

That goes a ways beyong "fog of war" in my book.

109 posted on 05/31/2006 9:02:46 AM PDT by BeHoldAPaleHorse ( ~()):~)>)
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To: Coop

No, it is not. He may be 100% correct. Good for his client if he is. But it is amusing to me that so many here jump to take the word of a defense attorney who was demonized as a traitor during his Congressional run as absolute fact, when it is what they want to hear. If he was saying the opposite (i.e. that his client was relieved or is being investigated because of Haditha), no one here would deem him worthy of belief.


110 posted on 05/31/2006 9:02:51 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: finnman69

If it's the truth, it's the answer Tony should give. If the President is out of the loop, Tony can't lie to protect him.

Frankly, I would have expected the President to know about this pretty early in the process -- but didn't the Time story run a long time ago? I would hope that the military has a standing order that any investigations of troop misconduct be sent up the chain of command to Rumsfeld, who should brief the President so if he's asked a question at a press conference, he knows what is happening.

But it's not Tony's fault if the President didn't know -- that was before Tony came on board.

I hope Tony will change the procedures so that the President DOES know about this stuff. I like the "hands-off" management style, but there are some things a good manager wants to be informed about. This would be one of those things.


111 posted on 05/31/2006 9:03:25 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: BeHoldAPaleHorse

Why do you hate America?


112 posted on 05/31/2006 9:03:34 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: veronica

No, I think this is the right thing to do. Troops cannot be making fun of, or belittling, our allies, because it gives aid and comfort to the enemy.


113 posted on 05/31/2006 9:04:34 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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To: lugsoul
I don't. I'm just pointing out that there are two stories, both based on detailed investigation, that concluded two very different things.

When I was a cop, and the story I got from the "witness" diverged sharply from the evidence at hand, and did so in a way that implied the "witness" was trying to hide his role in events, the "witness" became a "suspect."

114 posted on 05/31/2006 9:06:47 AM PDT by BeHoldAPaleHorse ( ~()):~)>)
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To: afnamvet
Like Kerry the traitor's record, an SF180 must be signed by him releasing the info.

Did Kerry ever really sign his SF180? A lot was known about him from other sources.

115 posted on 05/31/2006 9:07:42 AM PDT by foxfield
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To: sinkspur
There was no "'Net" as we know it in 1991.

No radio net(work)? Darn it all! I wonder to whom I was talking? Hmmmm. Must have been those darned voices again. You know me and all my delusions of made-up charges and excusing murder, those kinds of things...

116 posted on 05/31/2006 9:08:58 AM PDT by Coop (FR = a lotta talk, but little action)
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To: BeHoldAPaleHorse

If that is indeed what the investigation shows, I'll agree with you. But we've already found several discrepancies between Time, Murtha and our beloved media's "initial reports."


117 posted on 05/31/2006 9:10:43 AM PDT by Coop (FR = a lotta talk, but little action)
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To: moneypenny
If Murtha was a general,

Murtha floated up to the rank of colonel.

118 posted on 05/31/2006 9:11:18 AM PDT by Coop (FR = a lotta talk, but little action)
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To: CharlesWayneCT
but didn't the Time story run a long time ago?

Yes

119 posted on 05/31/2006 9:12:10 AM PDT by Coop (FR = a lotta talk, but little action)
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To: BeHoldAPaleHorse
"A subsequent investigation concluded that the Iraqis were killed by gunfire . . . Gunshot and shrapnel wounds look very different from one another."

The 13-year-old girl who survived - Safa Younis Salim, if I recall - claimed that she and about a dozen others were rounded up into a room into which the Marines tossed two grenades before opening fire with their automatic weapons. Salim has - so far - given THREE different versions of how she managed to survive. Do any of the the autopsy reports indicate deaths caused by a grenade, as this girl claimed?
120 posted on 05/31/2006 9:12:35 AM PDT by Steve_Seattle
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