Posted on 05/23/2006 8:42:02 AM PDT by Paddlefish
Mark Inglis, an amputee who conquered Mount Everest on artificial legs last week, yesterday defended his party's decision to carry on to the summit despite coming across a dying climber. As his team climbed through the "death zone," the area above 26,000 feet where the body begins to shut down, they passed David Sharp, 34, a stricken British climber who later died. His body remained on the mountain.
Mr. Inglis, 47, a New Zealander, said: "At 28,000 feet it's hard to stay alive yourself. He was in a very poor condition, near death. We talked about [what to do for him] for quite a lot at the time and it was a very hard decision. "About 40 people passed him that day, and no one else helped him apart from our expedition. Our Sherpas (guides) gave him oxygen. He wasn't a member of our expedition, he was a member of another, far less professional one." Mr. Sharp was among eight persons who have died on Everest this year, including another member of his group, a Brazilian. Dewa Sherpa, a manager at Asian Trekking, the Katmandu company that outfitted Mr. Sharp before his climb, said he had not taken enough oxygen and had no Sherpa guide.
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The company charges $6,000 to provide services as far as base camp -- far less than the $35,000 or more cost of guided trips to the summit. Other mountaineers have criticized the commercialism of climbing the 29,035-foot peak, with guides charging huge sums to climbers with minimal experience.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
Surprised this guy walks around with a frozen heart.
Better to lose your life getting his "BODY" back down the mountain.. DUUUUGHH!..
Can you describe the man's condiiton and are you aware of the conditions up there? What would be your purpose?
As an aside, despite your curious responses to my post, I continue to give substantial credence to your posts that seem to reflect actual knowledge of the difficulties of mountain climbing and the tough decisions one must make in life and death situations. However, I do not feel that trying to save a life or getting to the top of a mountain is a "life and death" situation. A life or death situation is "can we get down while trying to save this guy's life". It's not, well, I hope you can see.
Interesting article. Looks like the guy used his only 2 bottles of Ox, just to get to base camp. He then went on to the Summit w/o any.
I can only describe what I've read.
But if you are asking me......do I personally know what the man's condition was.....and what the conditions on the mountain were at that moment? No, I cannot. I wasn't there...I don't know.
As for "my purpose"....I guess you are asking why I would try to help the guy beyond giving him 02...?
FWIW, I work in a hospital where I often treat people that are dying. The short version is..we do what we can. We provide comfort. We address their physical wants and needs..And we address their spiritual wants and needs, if any.
I'm a pretty "black and white" guy...but I just don't think I could walk on by this guy...and NOT try to do something more than tossing the guy my extra 02 tank. I don't think like that....And even though it may have been futile. I would have tried.
Maybe you could walk on by. I don't think I could have.
Inspiring is the right word for Shackelton's story.
The temperature is roughly -30oC (-22oF) up there when it's ~-81oF at sea level. The air is less than 1/3 as dense, so it has that much less oxygen. Footing is tough enough for one. The guy had used up the 2 bottles of Ox he brought, just to get to base camp. He shouldn't have needed that to get there. He went on to the Summit alone w/o any.
They found him passed out and frozen in the snow. His pO2 levels had to be very low. The Ox was given to wake him and assess his condition. W/o it, he'd just pass out again. There's no way to warm him and keep him warm for the descent to the base camp. He'd continue to freeze, the rest of the way. Their assessment was that the man was terminal under these conditions. In addition, the descent would have been much more dangerous taking the man down. The man was passed out again before they walked away. That's about the best comfort they could give him.
"Maybe you could walk on by. I don't think I could have."
Given the conditions and what would be my assessment that the guy wouldn't make it, and there's nothing I can do to save him, I would't risk my life trying to take his body down. If he's part of my group, the trek reverses when one of the group clearly isn't going to make it. With this guy, the indicaiton was when he took 2 bottles of Ox just to get to base camp, then said he could continue up into the thin air w/o it. He could always decide to go on his own, which this guy did, but having buddies along means they catch you when you drop, or at least before your stumps freeze solid. Which this guy's did long before he got to the summit.
From the article: This time, he apparently reached the summit with the help of two oxygen bottles from his trekking company, which took him only to base camp.
Trekking company took him to base camp, he took 2 bottles of Ox from there. Not what you said. Yes it can be blamed on crappy writing. But for a guy who knows so much about "mountaineering" I can't believe you would think ANYONE who needed 2 bottles of Ox to get to base camp would be able to get anywhere close to 8000m.
As I pointed out earlier, your logic is sound.
To walk past a dying man on the way UP, however, raises a lot of questions for me. Kind of like finishing a game with the oppositions man lying dying on the court.
It would be very different if it had occured on the way down.
Not that it matters, but I hope this dogs those guys for a long time.
You can try next year. All you have to do is pay $35,000 and spend one year in very rigorous physical training.
If you are lucky enough to make it past the last base camp, a tent in the death zone that you cannot linger at for more than a couple of hours, you will find a climber in need.
Every year its the same story, different names.
Good luck getting him down. Chances are you will not make it and climbers will be stepping past your body for decades.
Don't be silly. It's automated now. They have electronic check in at the guard station every 1000 feet along the path. And at every rest area they have a lounge where you can warm up in front of the fire, call home and watch some good movies.
I've seen people do worse. It didn't amaze me. It did cause me to think he was one of the more brilliant folks though.
I know it does. I don't see the calm safe atmosphere of a "game" as an appropriate analogy though.
And I didn't read your "conditions" post. My fault, as I've not read every post.
I totally understand critical assessment triage, and the implications thereof. It's just what has to be done under certain conditions. Were those conditions present on that day?
Could have 40 some people made a difference in that guy's outcome? How long does it take to have 40 people trudge by? What was the guy's condition when the first guy walked by...versus the last guy? How many even knew the guy wasn't well?
How many people passed him..while he was still climbing, and noted he was by himself? How many had no clue to his struggles, while battling their own?
All questions that have crossed my mind. Not monday-morning QB'ing...just trying to better understand.
FWIW-
To Mr. Brightside:
LOL!! Okay wise guy..I've never climbed under those extreme conditions..nor will I ever. But that doesn't make me stupid.
Of course I wouldn't try to drag the guy down by myself...Of course I would assess all available courses of action. I realize that this was an extreme situation....and what I think could be done, maybe couldn't. But I also refuse to be so flippant in thinking nothing could be done. As above and after further thought I imagine many that passed that guy...had no idea he was in dire straits.
All FWIW-
"How long does it take to have 40 people trudge by?"
No idea, but in the range of some hours.
"What was the guy's condition when the first guy walked by...versus the last guy?"
More frozen.
"How many even knew the guy wasn't well?"
Most of his limbs frozen, hypothermia, less than 1/3 the Ox pressure, out cold. They all knew.
"How many people passed him..while he was still climbing, and noted he was by himself?"
It's not clear, but if he's moving, he's fine.
"I totally understand critical assessment triage, and the implications thereof. It's just what has to be done under certain conditions. Were those conditions present on that day?"
Yes. It appears Inglis's group was the only one to stop and they concluded, that nothing could be done to save him. From the little I've seen so far folks die very fast when they're down. Hours. There's a story posted on the last page regarding a climber named Hall. His wife was in base camp and he died before anyone could get up. He stopped for one of his ailing clients. Apparently the respiration isn't enough to keep from going into hypothermia when you're stationary.
"Could have 40 some people made a difference in that guy's outcome?"
The key is getting him back to the base camp. I don't think the size of the party matters much. It's being able to go back down with a body, gently. According to Hall's wife, Hall said "it's like trying to rescue someone from the moon".
The "I" and "ME" Generation. May they all suffer a similar fate.
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