Posted on 04/08/2006 7:32:33 PM PDT by Heartofsong83
Everything I said about leftists and socialism and the misery and ultimate destruction it brings can be independently verified. Everything I said about the "Christians" who fight to the death to rob people suffering under oppression and tyranny the chance for freedom and liberty is fact.
Instead of calling me "hateful", why don't you take an honest look at your beliefs and how they collapse under the force of reality and truth. Why don't you stop using my precious Lord and Savior to try to justify, what in the end, is a Satanic, Christ-hating philosophy.
Here are three examples of hate and gross generalizations from your posts.
1. “where on earth do you find anything Christ-like among the anti-American, mass-murdering dictator-loving, terrorist-coddling Bush haters that continually fight to stop the liberation of the Iraqi people?”
Here you’ve lumped anyone who disagrees with the war in Iraq as not ‘Christ-like.’ My faith compels me to find Christ in anyone, whether it is apparent or not. “When did we see you Lord. . .” Seeking Christ in others in love. Denying the Christ in others is, in my opinion. . .hate.
2. “These are people who have whole-heartedly rejected Jesus Christ and are completely on the side of death and hell.”
The examples I gave included Thomas More and Oscar Romero. You can add to this list Martin Luther King Jr., and Dorothy Day. In the current war in Iraq, you can include the Benedict XVI, and other church leaders who recognized the invasion of Iraq as an unjust war.
3. “bestows civil rights on a deadly virus that is caused by and large by homosexual behavior,”
This is not so much hate, as ignorance. I don’t think you meant to imply that anyone has ‘bestowed civil rights on the virus that causes AIDS’ AIDS is in no way ‘caused’ by homosexual behaviour. The virus that causes AIDS is virus that attacks the immune system. The virus most likely originated in Africa and was transmitted from apes to humans. The virus is transmitted through the blood stream. High risk activities include unprotected sex (homosexual and heterosexual), needle sharing, accidental puncture wounds (eg. medical professionals) and any other activity that introduces blood from one person to another. The virus is carried in the blood stream. Suggesting that the virus that causes AIDS is ‘caused by and large by homosexual behaviour” is to scapegoat homosexuals. Scapegoating homosexuals for ‘causing’ AIDS is hate.
Thanks for this dialogue. It appears that their exists a chasm between our understanding of Christianity. I’m not trying to convince you that I have the right view, and you the wrong. Nor have I been an apologist for socialism. All I have wanted you to recognize is the God is greater than all of us, and that he will work with and through who he pleases. An ideological rejection of anyone who disagrees with our politics can blind us to the power of God working through all people. As I posted previously, through our baptism we are born into new life with Christ. We see the world through the eyes of the resurrection. I do not judge or condemn your experience of the risen Lord, and I simply and respectfully ask that you not judge mine. In this way, we can be true to Christ's words, "May they be one."
Peace,
Chris D-Hales
No, seeking Christ in others who show no evidence whatsoever of knowing Him or desiring to know Him is not love, it is self-delusion. Christ does not exist in everyone. If a person has not accepted Christ as his personal Savior, he does not know Christ, and Christ is not in Him. I did not say that, God did. And you will know if Christ is in them by thier works- let me know if you really can see Christ among the A.N.S.W.E.R. communists who are in the streets screaming for us to leave al Quaeda alone, or the people who camp out in front of the Walter Reed hospital screaming threats and insane rantings at the injured soldiers inside.
And it's not people who simply "disagree with the war in Iraq". Alot of these "innocents" who "disagree with the war in Iraq" are in collusion with killers in Iran:
Here's a cold, hard dose of reality for you . Tell me if Christ is in those who not only "disagree with the war" but help terrorists kill soldiers.
The examples I gave included Thomas More and Oscar Romero. You can add to this list Martin Luther King Jr., and Dorothy Day. In the current war in Iraq, you can include the Benedict XVI, and other church leaders who recognized the invasion of Iraq as an unjust war.
Here is an example of how God feels about war:
Deuteronomy 20
1 “When you go out to battle against your enemies, and see horses and chariots and people more numerous than you, do not be afraid of them; for the LORD your God is with you, who brought you up from the land of Egypt. 2 So it shall be, when you are on the verge of battle, that the priest shall approach and speak to the people. 3 And he shall say to them, ‘Hear, O Israel: Today you are on the verge of battle with your enemies. Do not let your heart faint, do not be afraid, and do not tremble or be terrified because of them; 4 for the LORD your God is He who goes with you, to fight for you against your enemies, to save you.’
10 “When you go near a city to fight against it, then proclaim an offer of peace to it. 11 And it shall be that if they accept your offer of peace, and open to you, then all the people who are found in it shall be placed under tribute to you, and serve you. 12 Now if the city will not make peace with you, but war against you, then you shall besiege it. 13 And when the LORD your God delivers it into your hands, you shall strike every male in it with the edge of the sword. 14 But the women, the little ones, the livestock, and all that is in the city, all its spoil, you shall plunder for yourself; and you shall eat the enemies’ plunder which the LORD your God gives you. 15 Thus you shall do to all the cities which are very far from you, which are not of the cities of these nations.
16 “But of the cities of these peoples which the LORD your God gives you as an inheritance, you shall let nothing that breathes remain alive, 17 but you shall utterly destroy them: the Hittite and the Amorite and the Canaanite and the Perizzite and the Hivite and the Jebusite, just as the LORD your God has commanded you, 18 lest they teach you to do according to all their abominations which they have done for their gods, and you sin against the LORD your God. 19 “When you besiege a city for a long time, while making war against it to take it, you shall not destroy its trees by wielding an ax against them; if you can eat of them, do not cut them down to use in the siege, for the tree of the field is man’s food. 20 Only the trees which you know are not trees for food you may destroy and cut down, to build siegeworks against the city that makes war with you, until it is subdued.
I guess it would have been better if the "religous leaders" you cited had had the advantage of perusing the documents that were found in Iraq and are now being translated and are confirming what many believed: that Saddam Hussein had ties with al Quaeda. As it was, a simple reading of the Scripture that "religous leaders" try to hide behind when espousing leftist ideology would have revealed that there are times when God commands governments to go to war. Now that we know that Hussein had ties with al Quaeda, and therefore was quite possibly involved in 911, the invasion of Iraq and subsequent war was not only justified, the US government was morally bound to go into Iraq and take out not only Hussein but the terrorists there as well.
This is not so much hate, as ignorance. I don’t think you meant to imply that anyone has ‘bestowed civil rights on the virus that causes AIDS’ AIDS is in no way ‘caused’ by homosexual behaviour. The virus that causes AIDS is virus that attacks the immune system. The virus most likely originated in Africa and was transmitted from apes to humans. The virus is transmitted through the blood stream. High risk activities include unprotected sex (homosexual and heterosexual), needle sharing, accidental puncture wounds (eg. medical professionals) and any other activity that introduces blood from one person to another. The virus is carried in the blood stream. Suggesting that the virus that causes AIDS is ‘caused by and large by homosexual behaviour” is to scapegoat homosexuals. Scapegoating homosexuals for ‘causing’ AIDS is hate.
Now who is being ignorant? AIDS is not caused by homosexual behavior? You can't possibly be serious. It is an established fact that the AIDS virus began in the homosexual communities of San Francisco. The "gay" community spent the entire 1980s blaming Ronald Reagan for the fact that they were getting AIDS and dying by the hundreds. It is now the law of the land that the partners of people with AIDS cannot be notified that the person with whom they had sex has the AIDS virus. That sounds like a civil right to me.
The fact that it has metastisized to other ways of transmission does not negate the fact that it began with homosexuals and is primarily caused by homosexual behavior. Don't get up on some fantasy moral high ground because you have chosen to buy into homosexual re-invention of history. Stating facts, as cold and hard as they may be, is not "hate". Stating facts, as cold and hard as they may be, is not "scapegoating." Try to deal in reality and not the alternate universe of the left, where facts are "scapegoating" and "hate" and lies are facts and always happen to be politically correct.
Thanks for this dialogue. It appears that their exists a chasm between our understanding of Christianity. I’m not trying to convince you that I have the right view, and you the wrong. Nor have I been an apologist for socialism. All I have wanted you to recognize is the God is greater than all of us, and that he will work with and through who he pleases. An ideological rejection of anyone who disagrees with our politics can blind us to the power of God working through all people. As I posted previously, through our baptism we are born into new life with Christ. We see the world through the eyes of the resurrection. I do not judge or condemn your experience of the risen Lord, and I simply and respectfully ask that you not judge mine. In this way, we can be true to Christ's words, "May they be one."
God is greater than all of us, I agree. But nowhere in Scripture does it even hint that God works through all people. All beliefs are not equally valid, all cultures are not equally worthy, all behavior and ideologies are not of God. In this day and age we are not supposed to actually take the Word of God seriously and literally. But the notion that all roads lead to God, and a person's beliefs and actions do not matter, is not of God, but an arrogant idea of fallen man.
Yes, there is a chasm between what we believe about Christianity. I simply cannot reconcile the ideologies and behavior of those who flagrantly violate the Word of God with thier claims that they are Christians. It's simply an immovable object.
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