"Intelligent design" legislation in New York reborn

National Center for Science Education ^ | 21 March 2006 | Staff

[PatrickHenry]

Assembly Bill 8036 is back. Originally introduced on May 3, 2005, the bill would have required that "all pupils in grades kindergarten through twelve in all public schools in the state ... receive instruction in both theories of intelligent design and evolution." It also charged New York's commissioner of education to assist in developing curricula and local boards of education to provide "appropriate training and curriculum materials ... to ensure that all aspects of the theories, along with any supportive data, are fully examined through such course of study."

NCSE previously reported that the bill died in committee when the New York State Assembly's legislative session ended on June 24, 2005. But apparently not: on January 4, 2006, the bill was again referred to the House Committee on Education, where, after two amendments, it remains. The main difference is that the bill now would require pupils to receive instruction in "all aspects of the controversy surrounding evolution and the origins of man," including but not limited to "intelligent design and information effectively challenging the theory of evolution."

[dread78645]

You forgot the Pantheon.

LAVS?

When ya got to go, ya got to go.

[Dimensio]

Genesis Chapter 2.

I do not see how a religious-themed creation account constitutes evidence for an event.

If this isn't good enough for you, where is the evidence for the signing of the Declaration of Independence?

I do not see how your question is related.

[jec41]

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

It wasn't rocket science that produced those truths.

Well, thats faith and belief and a good thing to govern by however I doubt that slaves thought it was a fact or the truth.

[jec41]

Populations undergo change. Change is not evolution.

Evolution as it applies to science is defined as change. You need a dictionary.

[taxesareforever]

Genesis Chapter 2. I do not see how a religious-themed creation account constitutes evidence for an event. If this isn't good enough for you, where is the evidence for the signing of the Declaration of Independence? I do not see how your question is related.

I'm sure you do, but you don't know how to answer it without saying that it is on faith that you believe the Declaration of Independence was signed.

[Thatcherite]

Thanks for saving me some time. That's the response I was going to make too. "The best churches". Sheesshhh. Does he really want his religion judged on the beauty of its buildings of worship?

I also liked the "Christianity is right because of its cultural dominance" schtick. Presumably in the 14 century the Moors had the true religion then... And in the first millenium the Hindus were worshipping the True Gods.

[AndrewC]

Well, thats faith and belief and a good thing to govern by however I doubt that slaves thought it was a fact or the truth.

Well, I have on good authority that they did. They tried to escape.

[jec41]

Well, I have on good authority that they did. They tried to escape.

Well I have it on good authority that the the other good folks that believe it would hunt them down and kill them for believing it.

[dread78645]

"Hello, Discovery Institute? You have a collect call from Answers in Genesis. Will you accept the charges?"
??????

We're waiting for the "greatest scientific acheivements" from the Discovery Institute or AIG ...

(Sarcasm is wasted when you have to explain it)

[AndrewC]

Well I have it on good authority that the the other good folks that believe it would hunt them down and kill them for believing it.

Well, you just contradicted yourself. Nice.

[WKB]

Name one material fact or knowledge ever produce by theology.




Jesus Saves.

[Dimensio]

I'm sure you do, but you don't know how to answer it without saying that it is on faith that you believe the Declaration of Independence was signed.

The presence of signatures on the Declaration of Independence is fairly strong evidence that the document was signed.

[Vaquero]

In NY???? Ha!

[Vaquero]

"Name one material fact or knowledge ever produce by theology.




'Jesus Saves'."



No...he said MATERIAL FACT....not spiritual...you did not answer the question as asked...even though how you answered may be true....it is certainly not a MATERIAL FACT and is a not tangible.

[PatrickHenry]

Name one material fact or knowledge ever produce by theology.

The Bible has been a reasonably good guide for archaeological research. The places it mentions are generally found to have existed. I say "generally" because there are questions about Eden and such, but such questions are beyond the scope of this humble response.

If researchers in the far future have only an Ian Flemming novel as a source of information of our times, they will find that James Bond's adventures possess the virtue of accurate place-names and locations. As James Bond could one day be a guide for future archaeologists, so is the Bible for us. And the Iliad.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"I believe the absence of organized matter that performs specific functions would be evidence one could adduce against the idea of intelligent design. It is most certainly "conceivable." Static on a TV set is a real life example that illustrates, albeit weakly, that intelligent design is lacking."

No it isn't. Static on a TV is an example of matter performing specific functions. So again, everything for you is evidence of ID, and nothing in the universe could not be.

"You cannot point to a single example where the basic elements behave erratically, and until you do, you are a mere discpiple of an ideology and no defender of either free inquiry or science."

I thought you said you had an example. It's was an incorrect example (static on a TV), but have you already abandoned it even before my objection to it?

"A theory that fits all the evidence might actually be true in fact and in perfect accord with objective reality."

A theory that by definition will always fit all the evidence is useless. It's a tautology. ID is such a claim.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"You might want to rephrase that. Cold Fusion?"

No, replication isn't a requirement of science. Testability is. Cold fusion wasn't testable OR replicable.

[Fester Chugabrew]

And you propose instead, "the entire religious community for XXX years" as a scientific argument?"

Nope.

[Vaquero]

I was answering someone else's post....but am not good with HTML or whatever it is that causes me to make something italicized and still have spaces between paragraphs. My answer was at the bottom of the post. Funny, your use of Fleming and Bond, after 40+ years I am re-reading the entire Bond library and am near the end. I suggest that when Cubby Broccoli gets done screwing around with them, that he should give the rights to the BBC to be produced, for the small screen, like they were written. There is a profound difference.

[CarolinaGuitarman]

"If this isn't good enough for you, where is the evidence for the signing of the Declaration of Independence?"

The actual document still exists. Hundreds of first hand accounts of it still exist. It was an event that happened within recent historical times. Genesis Chapter 2... we have just Genesis Chapter 2 to back it up. And we have physical evidence that goes against it. It is not physically possible for 2 people to be the ancestors of every person alive today. The earth is billions of years old. Genesis 2 cannot be literally true.