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Mumbai: The Catholic Church gets its first-ever Married Deacon
Daiji World and Mumbai Mirror ^ | January 19, 2006 | Manoj Nair

Posted on 01/19/2006 1:03:06 AM PST by Cronos

Mumbai, Jan 18: The Roman Catholic Church in India will witness a landmark event on Sunday when the Archbishop of Bombay will ordain two married men as permanent deacons.

Lloyd Dias, belongs to the Sacred Heart Parish, Vashi, and Elwyn deSouza is a parishoner of St Joseph’s,  Juhu will receive their religious orders at a ceremony at the Holy Name Cathedral in Colaba.

Deacons are ranked next to bishops and priests in the hierarchy of the Catholic Church. They can perform most of the religious duties that a priest does, like baptism and nuptials, but cannot conduct mass or hear confessions. Till date, priests have worked as deacons. This is the first time a lay person is being ordained as a permanent deacon. 

Father Anthony Charanghat, spokesperson for the Cardinal Ivan Dias, Archbishop of Bombay, said, “This is the first time a married person will be officially ordained as a deacon. No other diocese in India is known to have ordained a permanent deacon.”

In the West, a shortage of priests, caused by a decline in the number of men taking up the vocation, was one of the prime reasons for the decision to train deacons to perform some of the religious duties previously performed only by priests.

In India, though the problem is not so acute, there has been a perceptible decline in the number of candidates at seminaries.

The church says that deacons could help take the work pressure off the priests on weekends when baptisms, nuptials and masses are lined up one after the other. Married men who take up the vocation are expected to embrace the vow of celibacy.

Though the headquarters of the Roman Catholic Church in Rome had given the go ahead for the ordaining of lay Catholics as deacons as early as 1983, the church in India decided to let the idea seep into the laity slowly. “We had to prepare the people for it. There could have been resistance from people, especially old people who would not like to receive communion from a lay person. We also needed to create a training programme for the candidates,” said Charanghat.

Dias, a 74-year old grandfather and a former supervisor with a Saudi Arabia-based shipping company said that his fascination for preaching the word of God led him to a two year course in theology at the St Pius Seminary in Goregaon, Mumbai. “Even in Saudi Arabia where preaching in religions other than Islam is not allowed, I preached to fellow workers. The American workers there encouraged me to learn theology,” he said.

He studied theology between 1985 and 1987 after he came back from the Middle East and worked with the community till Bishop Bosco Penha, auxiliary bishop of Bombay suggested his diaconate with cardinal Dias.

To prepare the laity for this significant event, parishioners in Mumbai were given questionnaires to seek their opinion. Some church members did say that they did not see the need for deacons from the laity. “We are saying that priests should get married. But I do not see the need for deacons who are married, when priests and nuns are asked to be celibate.

“If we have married deacons, what is the difference between the Catholic Church and the new born-again churches,” said a parishioner from South Mumbai, who requested anonymity.

There are an estimated 30,000 permanent deacons all over the world today. But for India, this will be a first.

In a church circular released this Sunday Bishop Dias said, “January 22, 2006 will truly be a red-letter day in the history of the Bombay Archdiocese, for it will mark a big step forward towards providing an ever more efficient pastoral care to the faithful,” he said.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: catholic; india; permanentdiaconate
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To: adamsjas
"I've never known a single catholic parish that even had a deacon. I've never heard the term mentioned in connection with any catholic church."

My parish has two--at least one of whom IS married (not sure about the other--he may be single). The married deacon AND HIS WIFE are teaching a bible study class together.

Married deacons = old news.

21 posted on 01/19/2006 6:00:03 AM PST by Wonder Warthog (The Hog of Steel)
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To: Cronos

We have a married deacon at our parish, and he's the most orthodox man in holy orders we have. He gives wonderful homilies, and even bows at the appropriate parts of the creed (maybe four other people in the parish do this, including my husband and I, excluding the two priests).

I still firmly believe that celibacy is a beneficial discipline to our rite and should not be abandoned.


22 posted on 01/19/2006 6:14:52 AM PST by Eepsy
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SACRUM DIACONATUS ORDINEM
General Norms for Restoring the Permanent Diaconate in the Latin Church
Pope Paul VI
Motu Proprio issued June 18, 1967

Beginning already in the early days of the Apostles, the Catholic Church has held in great veneration the sacred order of the diaconate, as the Apostle of the Gentiles himself. bears witness. He expressly sends his greeting to the deacons together with the bishops and instructs Timothy[1] which virtues and qualities are to be sought in them in order that they may be regarded as worthy of their ministry.[2]

Furthermore, the Second Ecumenical Vatican Council following this very ancient tradition, made honorable mention of the diaconate in the Constitution which begins with the words "Lumen Gentium" where, after concerning itself with the bishops and the priests, it praised also the third rank of sacred orders, explaining its dignity and enumerating its functions.

Indeed while clearly recognizing on the one hand that "these functions very necessary to the life of the Church could in the present discipline of the Latin Church be carried out in many regions with difficulty," and while on the other hand wishing to make more suitable provision in a matter of such importance wisely decreed that the "diaconate in the future could be restored as a particular and permanent rank of the hierarchy."[3]

Although some functions of the deacons, especially in missionary countries, are in fact accustomed to be entrusted to lay men it is nevertheless "beneficial that those . . . who perform a truly diaconal ministry be strengthened by the imposition of hands, a tradition going back to the Apostles, and be more closely joined to the altar so that they may more effectively carry out their ministry through the sacramental grace of the diaconate."[4] Certainly in this way the special nature of this order will be shown most clearly. It is not to be considered as a mere step towards the priesthood, but it is so adorned with its own indelible character and its own special grace so that those who are called to it "can permanently serve the mysteries of Christ and the Church."[5]

Although the restoration of the permanent diaconate is not necessarily to be effected in the whole Latin Church since "it pertains to the competent territorial Episcopal conferences, with the approval of the Supreme Pontiff, to decide whether and where it is timely that deacons of this kind be ordained for the care of souls,"[6] we therefore consider it not only proper but also necessary that specific and precise norms be given to adapt present discipline to the new precepts of the Ecumenical Council and to determine the proper conditions under which not only the ministry of the diaconate will be more advantageously regulated, but the training also of the candidates will be better suited to their different kinds of life, their common obligations and their sacred dignity.

Therefore, in the first place, all that is decreed in the Code of Canon Law about the rights and obligations of deacons, whether these rights and obligations be common to all clerics, or proper to deacons—all these, unless some other disposition has been made, we confirm and declare to be in force also for those who will remain permanently in the diaconate. In regard to these we moreover decree the following.

I

1. It is the task of the legitimate assemblies of bishops of episcopal conferences to discuss, with the consent of the Supreme Pontiff whether and where—in view of the good of the faithful—the diaconate is to be instituted as a proper and permanent rank of the hierarchy.

2. When asking the Apostolic See for approval, the reasons must be explained which favor the introduction of this new practice in a region as well as the circumstances which give well-founded hope of success. Likewise, the manner will have to be indicated in which the new discipline will be implemented, that is to say, whether it is a matter of conferring the diaconate on "suitable young men for whom the law of celibacy must remain intact, or on men of more mature age, even upon those living in the married state," or on both kinds of candidates.

3. Once the approval of the Holy See has been obtained, it is within the powers of each Ordinary, within the sphere of his own jurisdiction, to approve and ordain the candidates, unless special cases are concerned which exceed his faculties.

Let the Ordinaries, in drawing up the report on the state of their diocese, also mention this restored discipline.

II

4. By the law of the Church, confirmed by the Ecumenical Council itself, young men called to the diaconate are obliged to observe the law of celibacy.

5. The permanent diaconate may not be conferred before the completion of the 25th year. Nevertheless, an older age can be required by the episcopal conferences.

6. Let young men to be trained for the diaconal office be received in a special institute where they will be put to the test and will be educated to live a truly evangelical life and prepared to fulfill usefully their own specific functions.

7. For the foundation of this institute, let the bishops Of the same country, or, if advantageous, of several countries according to the diversity of circumstances, join their efforts. Let them choose, for its guidance, particularly suitable superiors, and let them establish most accurate norms regarding discipline and the ordering of studies, observing the following prescriptions.

8. Let only those young men be admitted to training for the diaconate who have shown a natural inclination of the spirit to service of the sacred hierarchy and of the Christian community and who have acquired a sufficiently good store of knowledge in keeping the custom of their people and country.

9. Specific training for the diaconate should be spread over a period of at least three years. The series of subjects, however, should be arranged in such a way that the candidates are orderly and gradually led to carrying out the various functions of the diaconate skillfully and beneficially. Moreover, the whole plan of studies can be so arranged that in the last year special training be given for the various functions which deacons especially will carry out.

10. To this moreover should be added practice and training in teaching the elements of the Christian religion to children and other faithful, in familiarizing the people with sacred chant and in directing it, in reading the sacred books of Scripture at gatherings of the faithful, in addressing and exhorting the people, in administering the sacraments which pertain to them, in visiting the sick, and in general in fulfilling the ministries which can be entrusted to them.

11. Older men, whether single or married, can be called to the diaconate. The latter, however, are not to be admitted unless there is certainty not only about the wife's consent but also about her blameless Christian life and those qualities which will neither impede nor bring dishonor on the husband's ministry.

12. The older age in this case is reached at the completion of the thirty-fifth year. Nevertheless, the age requirement is to be understood in this sense, namely, that no one can be called to the diaconate unless he has gained the high regard of the clergy and the faithful by a long example of truly Christian life, by his unexceptionable conduct, and by his ready disposition to be of service.

13. In the case of married men care must be taken that only those are promoted to the diaconate who while living many years in matrimony have shown that they are ruling well their own household and who have a wife and children leading a truly Christian life and noted for their good reputation.[7]

14. It is to be desired that such deacons be possessed of no small learning about which we have spoken in numbers 8, 9, 10 above, or that they at least be endowed with that knowledge which in the judgment of the Episcopal Conference is necessary for them to carry out their specific functions. Consequently they are to be admitted for a time in a special school where they are to learn all that is necessary for worthily fulfilling the diaconal ministry.

15. Should this be impossible, let the candidate be entrusted for his education to an outstanding priest who will direct him, and instruct him and be able to testify to his prudence and maturity. Care must always and emphatically be taken that only suitable and skilled men may be admitted to the sacred order.

16. Once they have received the order of deacon, even those who have been promoted at a more mature age, can not contract marriage by virtue of the traditional discipline of the Church.

17. Let care be taken that the deacons do not exercise an art or a profession which in the judgment of the local Ordinary is unfitting or impedes the fruitful exercise of the sacred office.

IV

18. Any deacon who is not a professed member of a religious family must be duly enrolled in a diocese.

19. The norms in force with regard to caring for the fitting sustenance of priests and guaranteeing their social security are to be observed also in favor of the permanent deacons taking into consideration also the family of married deacons and keeping article 21 of this letter in mind.

20. It is the function of the Episcopal Conference to issue definite norms on the proper sustenance of the deacon and his family if he is married in keeping with the various circumstances of place and time.

V

21. According to the above-mentioned Constitution of the Second Vatican Council it pertains to the deacon, to the extent that he has been authorized by the local Ordinary to attend such functions:

1) To assist the bishop and the priest during liturgical actions in all things which the rituals of the different orders assign to him;

2) To administer baptism solemnly and to supply the ceremonies which may have been omitted when conferring it on children or adults;

3) To reserve the Eucharist and to distribute it to himself and to others, to bring it as a Viaticum to the dying and to impart to the people benediction with the Blessed Sacrament with the sacred ciborium;

4) In the absence of a priest, to assist at and to bless marriages in the name of the Church by delegation from the bishop or pastor observing the rest of the requirements which are in the Code of Canon Law[8] with Canon 1098 remaining firm and where what is said in regard to the priest is also to be understood in regard to the deacon;

5) To administer sacramentals and to officiate at funeral and burial services;

6) To read the sacred books of Scripture to the faithful and to instruct and exhort the people;

7) To preside at the worship and prayers of the people when a priest is not present;

8) To direct the liturgy of the word, particularly in the absence of a priest;

9) To carry out, in the name of the hierarchy, the duties of charity and of administration as well as works of social assistance.

10) To guide legitimately, in the name of the parish priest and of the bishop, remote Christian communities;

11) To promote and sustain the apostolic activities of laymen.

23. All these functions must be carried out in perfect communion with the bishop and with his presbytery, that is to say, under the authority of the bishop and of the priest who are in charge of the care of souls in that place.

24. Deacons, as much as possible, should have their part in pastoral councils.

VI

25. Let the deacons, as those who serve the mysteries of Christ and of the Church, abstain from all vice and endeavor to be always pleasing to God "ready for every good work"[9] for the salvation of men. By reason, therefore, of the order received they must surpass by far all the others in the practice of liturgical life, in the love for prayer, in the divine service, in obedience, in charity, in chastity.

26. It will be the task of the episcopal conference to establish more efficacious norms to nourish the spiritual life of the deacons, both celibate and married. Let the local Ordinaries, however, see to it that all the deacons: devote themselves assiduously to reading and meditating on the word of God; frequently and if possible every day, participate actively in the sacrifice of the Mass, receive the sacrament of the Most Holy Eucharist and devoutly visit the Sacrament; purify their souls frequently with the sacrament of Penance and, for the purpose of receiving it worthily, examine their conscience each day; venerate and love the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God with fervent devotion.

27. It is a supremely fitting thing that permanent deacons recite every day at least part of the Divine Office, to be determined by the episcopal conference.

28. Diocesan deacons must, at least every third year, attend spiritual exercises in a religious house or pious institution designated by the Ordinary.

29. Deacons are not to neglect studies, particularly the sacred ones; let them read assiduously the sacred books of the Scripture; let them devote themselves to ecclesiastical studies in such a way that they can correctly explain Catholic teaching to the rest and become daily more capable of instructing and strengthening the minds of the faithful.

For this purpose, let the deacons be called to meetings to he held at specified times at which problems regarding their life and the sacred ministry are treated.

30. Because of the special character of the ministry entrusted to them they are bound to show reverence and obedience to the bishop; the bishops, however, should in the Lord highly esteem these ministers of the people of God and love them with the love of a father. If for a just cause a deacon lives for a time outside his own diocese he should willingly submit to the supervision and authority of the local Ordinary in those matters which pertain to the duties and functions of the diaconal state.

31. In the matter of wearing apparel the local custom will have to be observed according to the norms set down by the episcopal conference.

VII

32. The institution of the permanent diaconate among the Religious is a right reserved to the Holy See which is exclusively competent to examine and approve the recommendations of the general chapters in the matter.

33. Let the Religious deacons exercise the diaconal ministry under the authority of the bishop and of their own superiors according to the norms in force for religious priests; they are also bound by the laws to which the members of the same Religious family are obliged.

34. A Religious deacon who lives either permanently or for a specified time in a region which lacks a permanent diaconate may not exercise diaconal functions except with the consent of the local Ordinary.

35. The provisions in nos. 32-34 regarding the Religious must be regarded as applying likewise to members of other institutes who profess the evangelical counsels.[10]

VIII

36. Finally as regards the rite to be followed in conferring the sacred order of the diaconate and those orders which precede the diaconate, let the present discipline be observed until it is revised by the Holy See.

Finally, after issuing these norms the desire springs spontaneously from our heart that deacons in performing their arduous functions in the modern world follow the examples which we propose for their imitation; the example of St. Stephen the protomartyr, who as St. Irenaeus says "was the first chosen for diaconal service by the Apostles,"[11] and of St. Lawrence of Rome "who was illustrious not only in the administration of the sacraments but also in the stewardship of the possessions of the Church."[12]

We order, then, that what has been established by us in this letter, given "motu proprio" be firm and valid, all things to the contrary notwithstanding.

Given at Rome, at St. Peter's on the feast of St. Ephrem the Syrian, June 18, 1967 in the fourth year of our pontificate.

ENDNOTES

1 Cf. Phil. 1:1.

2 Cf. 1 Tim. 3:8-13.

3 Cf. AAS 57 (1965) D. 36 n. 2S.

4 Cf. Second Vatican Council, Decree: <Ad gentes>, n.[16] AAS 58 (1966) p. 967.

5 Cf. AAS 57 (1965) p. 46.

6 <Ibid.> p. 36.

7 Cf. 1 Tim. 3:10-12.

8 Cf. canons 1095 #2, and 1096.

9 Cf. 2 Tim. 2:21

10 Canon Law of the Eastern Church, <Concerning Persons> canon 87, AAS 49 (1957) p. 462.

11 <Adversus haereses> 4.15.1, PG 7:1013.

12 St. Leo the Great, <Sermon> 85, PL 54:436.


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23 posted on 01/19/2006 6:17:18 AM PST by A.A. Cunningham
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To: Cronos
Married men who take up the vocation are expected to embrace the vow of celibacy.

Er, not quite. They remain married, and enjoy full rights of marriage, as long as their wives live. However, if a deacon's wife dies (or the marriage is otherwise ended), then must he adopt the discipline of celibacy. This is right out of the Bible: a deacon is to be "the husband of one wife", or "a one-woman man" - so naturally, if she dies he cannot remarry (or at least, he cannot retain his diaconate).

24 posted on 01/19/2006 10:11:02 PM PST by Rytwyng
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To: BearWash
Dear BearWash,

In Fact, I was aware of this for some time as there have been articles in the "Examiner" a Catholic Weekly published by Father Anthony Charanghat from Mumbai,Bombay for the past 2 years but last year there were a couple of articles by Bishop Bosco D'Penha and by Bishop Agnelo Gracias who are Auxiliary Catholic Bishops in the Archdiocese of Mumbai on the pros and cons of the installation of Permanent Married Deacons in Parishes in Mumbai.


My Only Prayer is that these Permanent Deacons will do some good for the Catholic Church in Mumbai, namely stem the exodus of Catholics to Born- Again Pentecostal Churches in Mumbai which has reached Epidemic Proportions in a number of parishes in Bombay.

The Born again Pentecostal Churches that are the biggest threat to the Catholic Church in Bombay and other places is the "New Life Fellowship" supposedly based somewhere in the South-Western United States as well as the Fundamentalist "Assembly of God" that has led many catholics out of the Church in Goa, Bangalore, and in some parts of Kerala and Tamil Nadu too.

Let us pray that these Deacons will not be mere Figureheads but will promote the Eucharistic Kingdom of Jesus Christ among Christ's faithful.

My Biggest Concern in Mumbai is that most Catholics do not seem to be well educated in their faith and thus are falling for every trick of these Pentecostal Churches. If this Exodus can be stemmed, then we can say that these deacons are doing something worthwhile else, I guess it would be better just to have Priests as Our Pastoral Ministers.

However, that being said not many catholic young men are coming forward in large enough numbers in Mumbai, Goa, Bangalore, etc to serve the Church. Vocations have fallen by at least 20% in Mumbai, and by a third in Goa, Bangalore, etc.
25 posted on 01/20/2006 12:07:05 AM PST by MILESJESU
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To: BearWash
Dear BearWash,

In Fact, I was aware of this for some time as there have been articles in the "Examiner" a Catholic Weekly published by Father Anthony Charanghat from Mumbai,Bombay for the past 2 years but last year there were a couple of articles by Bishop Bosco D'Penha and by Bishop Agnelo Gracias who are Auxiliary Catholic Bishops in the Archdiocese of Mumbai on the pros and cons of the installation of Permanent Married Deacons in Parishes in Mumbai.


My Only Prayer is that these Permanent Deacons will do some good for the Catholic Church in Mumbai, namely stem the exodus of Catholics to Born- Again Pentecostal Churches in Mumbai which has reached Epidemic Proportions in a number of parishes in Bombay.

The Born again Pentecostal Churches that are the biggest threat to the Catholic Church in Bombay and other places is the "New Life Fellowship" supposedly based somewhere in the South-Western United States as well as the Fundamentalist "Assembly of God" that has led many catholics out of the Church in Goa, Bangalore, and in some parts of Kerala and Tamil Nadu too.

Let us pray that these Deacons will not be mere Figureheads but will promote the Eucharistic Kingdom of Jesus Christ among Christ's faithful.

My Biggest Concern in Mumbai is that most Catholics do not seem to be well educated in their faith and thus are falling for every trick of these Pentecostal Churches. If this Exodus can be stemmed, then we can say that these deacons are doing something worthwhile else, I guess it would be better just to have Priests as Our Pastoral Ministers.

However, that being said not many catholic young men are coming forward in large enough numbers in Mumbai, Goa, Bangalore, etc to serve the Church. Vocations have fallen by at least 20% in Mumbai, and by a third in Goa, Bangalore, etc.
26 posted on 01/20/2006 12:08:29 AM PST by MILESJESU
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To: Hill of Tara

Ping!


27 posted on 01/20/2006 12:46:51 AM PST by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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To: SOLDIEROFJESUSCHRIST
The Born again Pentecostal Churches that are the biggest threat to the Catholic Church in Bombay and other places is the "New Life Fellowship" supposedly based somewhere in the South-Western United States as well as the Fundamentalist "Assembly of God" that has led many catholics out of the Church in Goa, Bangalore, and in some parts of Kerala and Tamil Nadu too.

Is this really true? I thought these groups were winning converts, but didn't know the converts were formerly Catholic.

28 posted on 01/20/2006 12:49:07 AM PST by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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To: CarrotAndStick


Yes, not only true but there has been a major crisis brewing in the Catholic Church in Mumbai and other cities and towns all across India since 1990.

In 1990, in Mumbai I will give you the figures of Catholics who had left the Catholic Church at that time for these Pentecostal Churches. It was 35,000. Now, it is estimated to be between 1,50,000 - 2,00,000. In Goa, many more Catholics have left -- in fact in a number of places in Goa like Panjim, Margao, etc all the pastors of these Pentecostal Churches are all Ex- Catholics.

Ditto is the case in Mumbai in a number of Pentecostal Churches and it is the same case in Bangalore, Belgaum, Kolkata, Chennai, and whatever place you can think of.

There are other Churches that are a big threat to the Catholic Church in the Cities and Towns all across India. They are as follows-- The Seventh Day Adventists, The Jehovah Witnesses, and a host of other Churches. They have made a big impact even in a number of cities and towns in South India in places like Trivandrum, Tuticorin, Salem, Changanacherry etc.

The Catholic Church has been unable to give a suitable response to them as well as stem the massive exodus of Catholics to these Churches. I personally know a number of Catholic Priests in the Catholic Church in Mumbai who are extremely concerned about these Churches and the effect they are having on a number of Parishes in Mumbai.

But, unfortunately nothing at all is being done to bring these Catholics back to the fold of the Catholic Church. I truly consider these Pentecostal Churches totally Gutless--

You will ask me why ?

Simply because, they find it much easier to evangelize Catholics to their Churches rather than Hindus, Tribals, Low Caste Hindus, Etc. In South America, they have caused a Pandemic kind of exodus particularly in Brazil, Mexico, Guatemala, etc where in the case of Brazil around 5,00,000 Catholics regularly leave the Church for these Churches -- in Mexico and Guatemala it ranges between 50,000 - 100,000 Catholics that leave the Church every year.

To make matters worse, in the Catholic Church in India specially in Mumbai and in other places too some Catholic Priests have been engaging in inappropriate rituals in the Mass like recitation of the Verses of the Koran, GuruGranthSaheb, Vedas, Puranas, Upanishads etc which has only resulted in confusing and confounding a large number of Catholics leading them to leave the Catholic Church in large numbers.

This is what as a concerned Catholic I have dealt at length with in the Thread " Destruction of Catholicism in India". Jesuit Priests have been solely responsible for this as well as some Priests of other orders in the Church who are unaware of the damage they are doing to Christ's Faithful.

Unfortunately, GenghisKhan did not fully understand or comprehend what I was getting at in that Thread. I was not attacking any particular religion. All I will say is that in the Mass it is not appropriate to recite verses from other Religions or to even incorporate Rituals from other Religions as it will lead to Mass Confusion all around.

There is a proper forum for all of this. For Example I have nothing against Catholic Priests reciting verses from the BhagvadGita, or the Vedas, or the Upanishads, at a Public Forum but certainly not in the Holy Mass in the precincts of a Catholic Church. In the Mass, we are supposed to Adore Christ and only him.

I hope this explains everything.


29 posted on 01/20/2006 8:45:53 AM PST by MILESJESU
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To: SOLDIEROFJESUSCHRIST

I hear you. Any other religious person would be outraged to see what they hold dear being defaced.

I found it strange though, that Catholics, Indian ones (supposedly more conservative), of all places, were being swayed into other faiths. You obviously know the ground realities in your area better.

Thanks for the information.


30 posted on 01/20/2006 8:54:27 AM PST by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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To: varg

Well, its not going to make much of an impression on Catholics. Nearly all church going Catholics have met at least one married deacon.


31 posted on 01/20/2006 8:59:14 AM PST by Netheron
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To: CarrotAndStick

It's nice that the Indian Catholics are getting more deacons, but I'm surprised that there are only 2 and they have only just been ordained.

My Church has a married deacon (and used to have another one).

Deacons arent priests, they can be married. But if their wife dies, they cannot remarry.


32 posted on 01/20/2006 10:09:07 AM PST by Hill of Tara
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To: CarrotAndStick
Thanks for your reply. One of the Core Problems in the Catholic Church in India specifically in Cities and Towns is what Catholics prefer to call the "Challenge of the Pentecostal Sects".

Jesuit Priests and other Catholic Priests have been promoting and practicing inappropriate rituals in the Holy Mass for at least 2 -3 decades or more. However, at that time Indian Catholics had no avenue to air their grievances regarding this wrongdoing in the Catholic Church.

Ever Since, the entry of U.S.,U.K. and Australian based Pentecostal Churches to various Cities in India many Catholics both conservative and Liberal felt that only by leaving the Church would they be able to make a statement to the Church Authorities what we call "Ecclesiastical Clerics".

I know of a number of Goan and Manglorean Catholics in Bombay and other places who have openly told me that they left the Catholic Church as they felt that Jesus Christ was not being promoted or in fact preached from the Pulpit to a large extent.

To make matters worse, some Catholics in India do not know the ABC's of their faith making them easy targets for these Pentecostal Churches as is the case in South and Central America.


I strongly believe that the Leadership of the Pentecostal Churches is deliberately targeting Catholics specially in the Third World as they know for one that the average Catholic is quite weak in their faith and secondly a large number of Catholic Priests are quite indifferent to the Pastoral Needs and Concerns of Catholics.

They also know for a fact that it is much easier to convert Catholics who are already Christian than it is to convert Hindus, Buddhists, Sikhs, Animist Tribals, Low Caste Hindus, Atheists, Agnostics or even Muslims.

In the early 1980's in Calcutta I was aware of a number of Catholic Families who had left the Church and had joined the Assembly of God Church there.

Finally, in the Tribal Belt the Catholic Church has another Challenge. That is the R.S.S. and V.H.P. Radicals who often harass Catholic Tribals to leave Catholicism in Gujarat, Rajasthan, Madhya Pradesh, Chhatissgarh, Jharkhand, Orissa, and even in West Bengal.

Thus, the Catholic Church in India has two Challenges it is facing at one and the same time. In the Cities and Towns it is facing the Pentecostal Churches and in the Tribal Belt it is the R.S.S.

Both of these challenges are as bad as each other. Most Indian Catholics are conservative; however if they find that their own priests do not care a damn for them and are highly indifferent and if they strongly believe that they are going to be spiritually stronger and get to know Christ Better they wouldn't mind leaving the Catholic Church and joining these Pentecostal Churches where by the way their Pastors come across as extremely concerned and individuals who are interested in promoting CHRIST and only him.


This is the current problem in a number of cities and towns in India and I feel it will get much worse, unless the Leadership in the Catholic Church wakes up from its slumber and realizes before it is too late what is happening. P.S.- I have known for a number of years of even Jesuit Bishops and Archbishops in various parts of India specially in North India who celebrate "Islamic Masses". They get some individuals from an Islamic School or Cleric from the Mosque to rcite verses from the Koran and other Islamic Books. This is all very imappropriate and only results in the weakening of the Christian Catholic Faith among Catholics in general.
33 posted on 01/20/2006 11:54:38 AM PST by MILESJESU
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To: SOLDIEROFJESUSCHRIST

Thanks for taking the trouble to explain the problem to me.


34 posted on 01/21/2006 1:34:47 AM PST by CarrotAndStick (The articles posted by me needn't necessarily reflect my opinion.)
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