BREAKING: FLORIDA SUPREME COURT STRIKES DOWN SCHOOL VOUCHERS

AP

[SoFloFreeper]

TALLLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) -- The Florida Supreme Court has struck down the state's school voucher system that paid for some students to attend private schools.

[RobbyS]

Well, There is the procedent set back in the '20s when the Supreme Court said that Oregon could not do that. On the other hand, even the federal courts have movbed away from the Principle that the parent is the primary educator of the child.

[Red Badger]

I don't mean "teach TO the test", that would be fine. I mean "TEACH THE TEST", that's a tragedy..........and maybe illegal.......

[Beagle8U]

"In one school I've heard of, about 90% of the children lived in single-parent homes. How do you fix that?"

I'm not sure that its the job of any school to fix single family homes.

I just wonder if those children of single parents might just make better life choices if their peers in school were planning for the future, rather than dropping out to become gang-bangers?

[Lurking Libertarian]

As to whether the case can be appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court, I my opinion this depends on whether the Florida Supreme rested its decision in whole or in part on the Blaine Amendment in the Florida state constitution.

The decision is based on a different provision of the Florida Constitution. I don't see any way this could go to SCOTUS-- it's based purely on an issue of Florida law.

[bvw]

Back, say in Isaac Newton's time and for many centruies before then "philosophy" meant "science". The two terms were interchangeable. A person can "love wisdom" (philosophy) and love "knowledge" (science).

Today ridiculous distinctions pervade. Hyper-compartemntalization, "experts" scoffing at knowledgable and intelligent thinkers who do not observe the many buzzword nuances of their expertise. Ridiculous.

Ridiculous ... if one is truly after wisdom and knowledge.

The same conditions are found regarding "religion". What is "religion", anyway? Wanting to answer that question I took a college course in comparative religions -- what was the wisdom I gained? Could be many things. A "belief" system -- not always. A "belief in spirits" -- not always. An establishment of social order that had fixed rituals and calender -- nearly always. So I aksed -- "Professor, is Football a religion?" His answwer was yes, by some standards, yes it is.

I do NOT believe in G-d. I have come to KNOW that there is a G-d, He is mericful and exacting both. Do I have "religion"? It is not necessary for me to preach any "religion", and even can be a waste of time -- which counts negatively to my account -- yet for the sake of social order and for the abeyamce of future miseries to myself, my family, my friends, and my descendants and the descendants of all, for the sake of peace, justice and mercy, for my own love of a good conversation let there be other good conversationalists!

So what is a "religion" in the context of modern Courts rulings? We understand it or can -- it is NOT the same as the Founders' understandings, nor the same as the Founders' definitions of terms in the Constitution. Yet by the (lousy, btw) definition and scope of definition employed by the Courts in modern years, Secular Humanism (in variants atheism and "process atheism"), in their own context it is a religion. Secularism is a Modern Religion. It is a sect, it has its beliefs, it has its "spirits" -- for "natural selection" is a "spirit", so I hold, and there are others I'd guess -- it has it's Secular Religious Calendar, such as January 2nd and Presidents Day, etc.

[airborne]

Thanks for the link (post # 24).

The way the State Constitution is written, "Adequate provision shall be made by law for a uniform, efficient, safe, secure and high quality system of free public schools", it appears, IMHO, that the FSSC made the right legal decision.

[DocRock]

"IMHO, the Florida voters don't really think whien it comes to State constitutional issues. They have voted to include in the constitution a ban on one pig farmer's methods,"[snip]

Ahh yes! The famous Pregnant Pig Amendment. I've often wondered... How do you know if a pig is pregnant and not just really fat? Surely there should now be a Florida State Agency to give pregnancy test to pigs to see if their constitutional rights are being violated.

/Sarc

[LWalk18]

I just wonder if those children of single parents might just make better life choices if their peers in school were planning for the future, rather than dropping out to become gang-bangers?

Or maybe the bad kids would influence the good kids to drop out and become gang bangers- that is why vouchers and school choices are feared by many parents.

[gondramB]

"
Yeah, but what is sad is that the voucher system was something available to parents of students in public schools that had repeatedly failed, and in those public schools, unless there is a real alternative available to those parents, the schools have no motive to improve. The vouchers provided that alternative to parents and motive to the schools (even though relatively few parents took advantage of it). Still, it existed as something real enough for district administrators and others to consider."

Yes, but we argue all the time that it's up to the legislative branch to change the laws instead of the courts rewriting the law as they go.

[lastchance]

Yes I should have used the term " teach the test".

[RobbyS]

Public road construction everywhere is done by private contractors. The state transportation departments administer the funds , do the planning, set construction standards, and supervise the work done by contractors. Of course, with federal money being involved and enviromental standards, there is also that layer of bureacracy, and all this has slowed down construction. What used to take ten years from idea to realization now takes fifteen.

[linda_22003]

So.... should you pay for roads you do not personally drive on? That was the original point, after all.

[Irish Queen]

Let me stick in my two cents. I taught in both public and private schools from 1868 to 2005.

In the typical public school nowadays, if the teacher follows the watered down, time wasting curriculum a typical elementary students receives more education from alternate resources from "Leap Frog" educational toys, kid web sites, and certain cable TV channels.

After retiring from full time teaching in 2000 (in California), I continued to keep my toe in the classroom by substitute teaching (in Nevada). If a 4th grade teacher faithfully follows the curriculum, a student is fortunate to receive an hour of hardcore math, reading and writing lessons. Much of the day is devoted to mind-numbing busyness, waiting for slower students to catch up and discussions of social issues.

[Beagle8U]

"Or maybe the bad kids would influence the good kids to drop out and become gang bangers- that is why vouchers and school choices are feared by many parents."

With all due respect, why would you assume that all inner-city kids are "bad kids"?

I would go one step further and say that the child of a single parent that cared enough to send their child to a better school would have an excellent chance of succeeding in life.

[gondramB]

"Let me stick in my two cents. I taught in both public and private schools from 1868 to 2005."

I will make an effort to treat you with extra respect, o venerable one. Was it hard teaching during the roaring twenties? :)

[Mad_as_heck]

Absolutely. They want to program little mind-numbed robots that will happily goose step into a socialist future 'ala Orwell.

Personally I'm in favor of anything that loosens the NEA and government's grip on education. I think we would be better off, however, building a network of 100% privately funded schools. The less Big Brother is involved the better.

[Irish Queen]

"Let me stick in my two cents. I taught in both public and private schools from 1868 to 2005."

I will make an effort to treat you with extra respect, o venerable one. Was it hard teaching during the roaring twenties? :)

Oops - there's nothing like a teacher who fails to proofread her work before posting it. Thanks! :< )

[Chanticleer]

Not a great moment for those of us trying to avoid the label of Flori-DUH.

[Warren_Piece]

I taught in both public and private schools from 1868 to 2005.

You seem quite chipper for a 138 year old!

[Chanticleer]

Children keep you young! ;-)