Liberals, Conservatives, Moderates, it's a special time, can we find a little peace?

CookingWithCarlo.com ^ | Dec. 24 2005 | Carlo3b

[carlo3b]

  Liberals, Conservatives, Moderates, it's a special time, can we find a little peace?

I have been wanting to do this for quite some time. Somewhere deep inside I believe that there can be a bit of common ground between the Left side of the political spectrum, and the Right. Why would we want this, assuming of course that there is someone other than me that would like to see that happen. I believe that there are many things about our wonderful nation that we share that could serve as a starting point to start a healing between us.

I think we should try it, if only for the sacrifice so many have made to afford us this opportunity. If I am right, I'll bet there are some things, more than we imagine, that we have in common, and given a real chance we may find them..

If we can at least agree that we as a nation, have been slowly dividing culturally for quite some time. Perhaps we can even go a bit further, I think our society is sick, and it can use threatening to become truly polarized, to the point of permanent harm to the very fabric of our being..

Help me make a list of those things that make us a country that is united..

Please I am serious, list anything that you can, that you believe you agree  would be a compromise on your part for the good of our nation..

Moderator, please give us a bit of latitude, and maybe we can start a dialogue that will benefit all.. Merry ()

I'll start..
1) As much as it would burn my butt, I believe I could live with Gay Marriage if the Gay community could stop the Gay agenda, infiltration into our public schools, and private businesses.. You know what I mean.. I.E.: School, Diversity training, Gay-Straight, and tolerance BS.. and Boy Scouts, Salivation Army.. etc., I don't want to count the number of right wing conservatives in the offices of the ACLU. You don't want the 10 commandants being taught or a class on religious freedom, and creation, I say we both back down, and teach our own kids..

2) I don't like being told that I can't have religious symbols in the marketplace, but can we agree that any private business should be able to display any religious display it wishes without litigious reprisals? If the anyone in the public hates it, they could avoid that business as they wish..

3) I could live with abortion in cases of forcible rape, and the life of the mother or the baby, and even financial crises.. I am an adoptive parent, and I really can't think of a way to justify giving birth to every baby without a plan to care for it with love and security until maturity..

4) I believe there are still reminisces of sick racial prejudice in pockets of our society but I also believe affirmative action is insidious and cruel in main. I would agree to the harshest of penalty if anyone is caught withholding a job or position simply because of a persons race.. But I must say that I have no idea how to prove a case.. I have seen it happen on both sides and I wanted to scream, perhaps I will the next time, and maybe that is a start..

developing..

[dalereed]

"so many forget the advances that we have made in the last 20 years"

I have no idea how old you are but your so called advances are just a slight up blip in the downward fall of this nation towards total distruction that started before I was born and i'm 68.

[Melas]

Carlo is no liberal, and you name calling won't make it so.

[JoJo Gunn]

Even the very liberal Mrs. Melas.

And we, sir, will pray extra hard for you.

[Aquamarine]

No retreat on God's principles.

This is a bad cause Carlo - Tempt not my soul away.

[Melas]

Prayers are always welcome, but nothing special on her account is warranted. She's not only my anchor in this world, but the love of my life.

[carlo3b]

I have no idea how old you are but your so called advances are just a slight up blip in the downward fall of this nation towards total distruction that started before I was born and i'm 68.

Bless you my young FRiend, we are almost the same age, and my reflections are as clear as yours I'm sure.. I recall when there were no Republicans in statewide office in Illinois or Texas in the 60's except for a token liberal Senator in each state that vote more Democrat than the Democrats did..

All three branches of governments were dominated by liberals and all appointments were safely red diaper communist.. LOL

Nixon was a great Republican albeit paranoid, that set us on a sour course for a decade.. Reagan turned the corner and brought us the modern Conservative movement that we are enjoying to this day..

With the exception of a very few phony Republicans we would have the battle won.. Extracting those bastards will be a lot harder than not, because the state leaders are as parinoid as Nixon was about loosing elections to the detriment of our future..

[Mr Cobol]

No!

[carlo3b]

Thank you for your thoughtful response.. I can't say that I do not understand.. But I have this bug in my drawers that tells me that the few liberals that I had the PLEASURE of spending time with while in the hospital gave me a renewed optimism..

They had no idea that I was a right wing wacko when they carried on about their hatred of Bush.. It turned out that the hatred wasn't Bush at all, it was his religion that they despised..

They were all bent backward over prayer in school, 10 commandments in every bathroom and total ban on abortion.. As the day passed they moderated almost every stance until the only thing left was only that Bush was elected over Gore in Florida. (they really thought Gore was a bore and a blow-hard jerk.. go figure) They moved right when I agreed with them that the Right Wing was as fanatic as the Left Wing on many of their issues..

They didn't really care about the moment of silence in schools, they did think that was a slippery slope to having everyone kiss the Pope's ring before class.. LOL Abortion was the biggest surprise, they didn't think abortion on demand was wise or late term slaughter of babies was defensible.. but that having abortion available in the first term was their watershed. All four of them dissagreed with the Gay agenda, the key to that argument was they felt that they were defending against the fundamentalist religious drift..

[carlo3b]

OK, OK .. I think I get the subtle point you are attempting to make.. Hahahahahhahahahaha

[carlo3b]

I would never attempt to persuade you to retreat from GOD'S bedrock principles.. I am trying to state my case for winning more hearts and souls..

I believe pushing harder only makes the wall stronger.. The answer is not caving in, but softening the crust.. I may go to Hell for it, but it will be for an honorable cause.. Thank you my trusted FRiend.. and Merry Christmas.. :)

[carlo3b]

Carlo is no liberal, and you name calling won't make it so.

Thank you my dear FRiend.. I needed that.. :)

[Aquamarine]

I am trying to state my case for winning more hearts and souls..

For what cause?

I believe pushing harder only makes the wall stronger.. The answer is not caving in, but softening the crust.. I may go to Hell for it, but it will be for an honorable cause.. Thank you my trusted FRiend.. and Merry Christmas.. :)

You will not go to hell for a bad cause but will be judged for it. Continue to Believe and stay the course Dear FRiend.

Merry Christmas to you and yours!

[carlo3b]

I can't tell you how much I value your opinion and weigh many of my own opinions on the sage advice that I get from friends like you.. MERRY CHRISTMAS

[carlo3b]

.. you are just encouraging them with this crap. Meet someone throwing a tantrum half way, and you get fifty more tantrums each more ridiculous than the last, asking for a hundred times as much, to get fifty. We've already long since learned the lesson, even if you haven't.

Well.. I guess we will mark you down as undecided.. :)

[etlib]

Melas: Carlo is no liberal, Perhaps not, in which case I apologize.
Melas: and you name calling won't make it so. Definitely true.
carlo3b: I will abandoned my knee-jerk reaction to the insults that you use to replace a coherent argument
Except for my stating that " you are a liberal, it's obvious" and "you are at heart a liberal" I don't know of any "insults."  Since the tone of your posts in this thread is that liberals are to be respected as human beings (something I agree with) I don't know why you find that significantly insulting.  Perhaps I am overly sensitive from my years at Berkeley and in the Bay area.  Perhaps you are worn down by the negative responses to what you thought was a positive Christmas posting.  However, I list here my reasons for making this characterization.

1. Your general attitude in the thread is one of "can't we just get along."    Yes, it would be best if we could just get along but unfortunately my experience has been that this is usually a liberal tactic to lead me on.
2. Your selection of examples of cases (gay marriage, religion in public, abortion, gun control) where we might agree are probably the most contentious issues between right and left.  Throughout the thread it appears to me that you defend the liberal position.
3. You seem to be ignoring all the arguments being made about the difficulty of and results from accommodating liberal views.  This appears to me to be the usual liberal tactic of  refusing to pay attention to arguments other than their own.
4. When you do respond to an argument it seems to be the liberal tactic of misdirection or a non-sequitur. As an example your response to my post about the problem with "unwanted children" being the unwanted part not the children part.  rather than show any attempt to understand you responded with a sarcastic statement "It's that simple, it's just semantic, not a really big deal at all."  This is exactly what I expect from liberals.  I have gotten this kind of response so often that it really hits one of my hot buttons.

[carlo3b]

.. I believe their motives are to destroy us. By any means.

You are correct.. absolutely.. but I am no pushover either.. I do not believe I will ever change the mind of one liberal activist because they are as intractable as I am about my bedrock beliefs.. They are never going to change..

The folks that can be persuaded are the millions of people just like us that have never voted for anyone that didn't have a D following their name.. union workers, teachers, parents, students.. We can reach them with calm, reasonable, convincing approaches to common concerns.. I'm not afraid of them. These are my next door neighbors.. They will become the new Conservative activists.. :)

[carlo3b]

Sorry my friend.. you are busted.. go back to DU, and tell them about your game.. NEXT

[x]

Most Americans do get along well in real life. Starting up political arguments for no reason with friends or strangers is on par with gratuitous religious or ethnic baiting, and very much to be avoided. But because people get along well enough in the real world, we cling all the more to political differences in the sphere in which they are allowed and encouraged. Americans pretty much can and do "all get along" in families, neighborhoods, and the anonymous public sphere -- whatever their politics -- but expecting agreement about controversial issues on top of that is demanding too much. Those disagreements usually do work out over time, if only because new conflicts and controversies replace the old ones. Until then, people want to stay in the debate and not simply give up.

[etlib]

Most of us are former Democrats that were persuaded more by the actions of the socialist, lying, perverted, Democrats than the positive actions of the Republicans.

I am guessing you include yourself in this group.

That's a big difference between you and me. I think I have been a conservative from birth. Some examples: At age 10 I had disagreements with my favorite aunt, who was a union leader, about the appropriateness of "right to work" laws. Some of my speeches in my High School speech classes defended conservative principles like reasons against federal government aid to education. I enrolled at Berkeley in the 60's as a conservative and graduated as a conservative.

Perhaps I have just had more experience talking to liberals and experiencing the result.

[harrowup]

I'll start with,

And on earth, Peace, to men of good will.

...and then I'll list my dreams for political peace when I've a bit more time...

Thanks for your thoughfulness over the years and Merry Christmas...Heard a joke last night on Leno about the fact that while we manage to have 8days for Channuka y'all took 12 days of Christmas. Since we celebrate both I am exhausted.