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Education panel stalls curriculum vote for creationism appeal [S. Carolina, another Kansas?]
MyrtleBeachOnline ^ | 14 December 2005 | Staff

Posted on 12/14/2005 6:23:06 AM PST by PatrickHenry

An education oversight panel has put off a final recommendation on the state's biology teaching standards at the urging of a state senator who wants alternatives to evolution - including creationism - taught in classrooms.

The Education Oversight Committee voted Monday to recommend approval of the state's biology content standards, but by an 8-7 vote, the panel removed for further study the wording that deals with teaching evolution.

The committee plans to put together a panel of scientists and science teachers to advise committee members on the biology standards dealing with evolution, JoAnne Anderson, the committee's executive director, said Tuesday.

State Sen. Mike Fair, a panel member, wants the education department to change the standards to encourage teaching alternatives to the theory of evolution. Fair, R-Greenville, also has proposed a bill that would give lawmakers more say on biology curriculum.

The Education Department writes standards teachers must follow in designing their daily lessons. The State Board of Education must give those standards final approval. The Education Oversight Committee can recommend the board approve or reject those standards.

The head attorney for the state Department of Education said he didn't think committee members are authorized to change the standards.

"This is unprecedented," attorney Dale Stuckey said. "It's my interpretation of the law that [EOC members] have no authority to change the standards."

Anderson said Tuesday that is not the committee's intent. The committee issued a news release clarifying that it does not have the authority to revise content standards.

"We are asking our colleagues at the State Department of Education for recommendations of individuals from the science community who can assist the committee in bringing about a resolution."

Fair said he wants to encourage "critical analysis of a controversial subject in the classroom."

State Education Superintendent Inez Tenenbaum, a Democrat, said Fair was trying to derail teaching standard revisions she said have wide support in academia. The agency recently conducted a yearlong review of key subjects and basic knowledge all science teachers in public schools must teach.

Current biology curriculum includes Charles Darwin's 19th century theory that life evolved over millions of years from simple cells that adapted to their environment. Creationism relies on the biblical explanation that mankind's origin is the result of a divine action.

In November, the S.C. Board of Education approved changes to science standards some teachers said needed clarification. The oversight committee put off voting on the rules in October to give Fair more time to lobby education officials.

Karen Floyd, a Republican candidate for state education superintendent, has said she will encourage the teaching of intelligent design.

Rep. Bob Walker, R-Spartanburg, said he supports Fair's efforts because "there are other ideas that can be addressed as to how this world came about."

One school official, Lexington-Richland 5 science supervisor Kitty Farnell, said the committee's questioning of educators' work sets "a terrible example for our students."

"It's an embarrassment," she said.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Philosophy; US: South Carolina
KEYWORDS: crevolist; evolution; schoolboard; scienceeducation
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Talk About Stalking Someone From Thread to Thread with the same old Crap! Placemarker
341 posted on 12/15/2005 11:05:48 AM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is a grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: RunningWolf

It's a rather red herring. Quite attractive when you've caught nothing else.


342 posted on 12/15/2005 11:08:13 AM PST by cornelis
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To: shuckmaster; farmer18th
Raise a child to be pig-ignorant and guess what you get?


Something along the line of schuck and jive, and a proclivity for trivial one sentence inannities comes to mind in this instance.

Wolf
343 posted on 12/15/2005 11:09:01 AM PST by RunningWolf (Vet US Army Air Cav 1975)
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To: Thatcherite

I am always amazed by the True Believer mentality of evolutionists. There is far more closed-minded fundamentalism among your ranks than among all the fundamentalists in all the religions of the wortld taken together. Makes it very difficult to have a rational conversaltion.


344 posted on 12/15/2005 11:12:37 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: TheWormster
Your earlier critics are correct. Your science is your religion

You are also comp[letely lacking a sense of humor. Don't take yourself so seriously. You might just be wrong about everything.

345 posted on 12/15/2005 11:15:52 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: cornelis
Since all change, whether biological or not, could not be a just God's will, I would tweak it a bit. Otherwise it's all determinism

My point is that the scientific method demands a predictability that will allow for independent confirmation of results. If the physical universe were a totally random phenomenon, it wouldn't be worth studying. The "copying error" that results from altered conditions should, in fact, occur in exactly the same way if those less than ideal conditions are recreated in exactly the same way. Should all the coefficients be known, the formula would have the same result every time. Mutations, understood as random accidents, random copying errors, are not random at all--they were pre-determined by the 0 state of the universe.

Evolutionists need God--a divine author of order--for their independent peer review to work, but they need chaos to escape their fear of intelligent design.

As far as spiritual or material determinism goes, I prefer the belief in the natural and the supernatural. The supernatural steps into change the course of the natural world, to "interrupt" it, to state "Lazarus will live."
346 posted on 12/15/2005 12:47:39 PM PST by farmer18th ("The fool says in his heart there is no God.")
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To: farmer18th
The "copying error" that results from altered conditions should, in fact, occur in exactly the same way if those less than ideal conditions are recreated in exactly the same way. Should all the coefficients be known, the formula would have the same result every time Absolutely. The error is according to a criterion of observation. Statistical correlation is not an intrinsic cause. To be consistent, it is not an error. That is why the die-hards are forced to efface the distinction between life and death. The origin of life is a non-question. Evolutionists need God--a divine author of order--for their independent peer review to work, but they need chaos to escape their fear of intelligent design.

Chaos of the gap?

I prefer the belief in the natural and the supernatural.

If human agency is a unique cause, we are supernatural.

347 posted on 12/15/2005 1:54:29 PM PST by cornelis
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To: cornelis
If human agency is a unique cause, we are supernatural.

Yes. Even Patrick Henry--and his namesake.
348 posted on 12/15/2005 1:59:03 PM PST by farmer18th ("The fool says in his heart there is no God.")
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To: RunningWolf

Looks to me like science and evo actually have very little to do with their agenda.

All your posts are belong to us.

349 posted on 12/15/2005 4:26:10 PM PST by ml1954 (NOT the disruptive troll seen frequently on CREVO threads)
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To: Amos the Prophet

Your earlier critics are correct. Your science is your religion
You are also comp[letely lacking a sense of humor. Don't take yourself so seriously. You might just be wrong about everything.


---

Being involved in education, specifically science education, it is a topic I take very seriously. I dont find it very amusing when people seriously suggest that lying to children is a good educational strategy.


350 posted on 12/16/2005 1:52:06 AM PST by TheWormster
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To: farmer18th
"Mutations, understood as random accidents, random copying errors, are not random at all--they were pre-determined by the 0 state of the universe."

I assume you know as much about quantum mechanics as you know about the theory of evolution.
351 posted on 12/16/2005 2:38:35 AM PST by MHalblaub (Tell me in four more years (No, I did not vote for Kerry))
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To: PatrickHenry
(AP) Responsible, mature, professional educators and the entire scientific community yesterday were aghast at the attempt by raving fundamentalists to hijack biology curriculums and substitute the book of Genesis. Senator Bob Futzmeyer's powerful committee, with ties to Haliburton, has engineered a power play to overrun any academic standards to satisfy his base, which is widely believed to consist of religious cretins with no education.

The charges flew at the state capitol yesterday. I.M. Smarternyu, spokesperson for the nonjudgmental and highly qualified education union called the action "treasonous." "These poisonous and dishonest braying fundametalists want to burn books, teach Genesis as the creation myth, bring back witch trials, and burn heretics at the stake. People with such clear ideological bias should never be allowed to be in contact with our students, much less have a say in how we teach them." Senator Futzmeyer's office released a statement which said the charges were "not true." The one page paper looking remarkably similar to talking points script from the right wing religous group "Make Christianity the Law of the Land and Incarcerate the Atheists." The leader of that group, Bob Finklemeyer, was recently jailed for keeping his children in chains because they could not correctly recite the entire book of Leviticus in the original Hebrew, so he was unavailable to comment on the similarity.

The subject has come to the forefront on the national scene recently, with the entire scientific community speaking in a unified voice on the issue. A few rogue pseudoscientists -most of them friends of Karl Rove with ties to Haliburton and the Iraq war - have brought up the charge that 1) the argument that science is done in a secular setting is philosophical, not "scientific" and 2) the universe looks like it might be designed. This attempt to slip religion in under the door has infuriated respectable scientists like Oxford don Richard Dawkins, who stated "these damn religious inquisitionists are going to make my head explode some day. All the really smart people believe like I do."

For more reading on the subject, go to :

For the reasonable side, go to

www.whyreligionisafable.com
www.whyintelligentdesignisjustreligion.com
www.religionisfortheweakminded.com
www.truescienceisatheistic.com
www.onlytheuneducatedareagainstus.com

Religious loons may go to senator Futzmeyer's site for links. You can find it at www.google.com

352 posted on 12/16/2005 3:23:34 AM PST by chronic_loser ((Handle provided free of charge as flame bait for the neurally vacant.))
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To: RunningWolf

The evos are soooo afraid of both sides being taught.

Why?


353 posted on 12/16/2005 5:53:47 AM PST by Sun (Hillary Clinton is pro-ILLEGAL immigration. Don't let her fool you. She has a D- /F immigr. rating.)
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To: TheWormster
Being involved in education, specifically science education, it is a topic I take very seriously. I dont find it very amusing when people seriously suggest that lying to children is a good educational strategy.

AHA! The face of the enemy.

As an educator does it seem appropriate to you to label as liars those who are in fundamental disagreement with you?

As one who honors the scientific method is it not more appropriate to respect the honor and integrity of your adversaries than to denegrate and belittle them? Or is this your application of the principles of science? What kind of lesson is your ad hominem tactics teaching our children?

354 posted on 12/16/2005 5:56:04 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: Sun

The evos are soooo afraid of both sides being taught.

Why?


---

Because one side (evolution) is science and the other (creationism/ID) is not. Nothing wrong with teaching them both. Creationism should be taught in comparative religion classes along with things likethe Hindu creation story, or the ancient Egyptian one. However, to teach creationism as science is LYING to children.
Do you think we should teach children that astrology is a science?


355 posted on 12/16/2005 6:51:56 AM PST by TheWormster
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To: Amos the Prophet

Being involved in education, specifically science education, it is a topic I take very seriously. I dont find it very amusing when people seriously suggest that lying to children is a good educational strategy.
AHA! The face of the enemy.

---
You think that people who educate children are the enemy. Interesting..


As an educator does it seem appropriate to you to label as liars those who are in fundamental disagreement with you?

--

Yes. It does. When they lie, then they are liars. And claiming that ID/creationism is science is a LIE.

---

As one who honors the scientific method is it not more appropriate to respect the honor and integrity of your adversaries than to denegrate and belittle them? Or is this your application of the principles of science? What kind of lesson is your ad hominem tactics teaching our children?

--

When people HAVE integrity, then I respect it. But sadly, people who want to lie to children about science do not, in my opinion have integrity. And as a matter of fact, I have not used an ad hominem tactic. You should look it up before you use such words.
The simple facts of the matter are as follows:
Evolutionary biology fits the definition of science.
ID/creationism does not.

Claiming the opposite is a lie.


356 posted on 12/16/2005 6:55:26 AM PST by TheWormster
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To: TheWormster
The simple facts of the matter are as follows: Evolutionary biology fits the definition of science. ID/creationism does not. Claiming the opposite is a lie.

Your snarly rationale defines yourself as a liar. Thus you shall be known.

Ad hominem is perfectly clear to me, as it clearly is not to you.

357 posted on 12/16/2005 7:27:25 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: Amos the Prophet

BTW - The enemy is not educators, but educators who can be civil.


358 posted on 12/16/2005 7:29:41 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: Amos the Prophet

BTW The enemy is not educators, but educators who cannot be civil.


359 posted on 12/16/2005 7:31:32 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (amen)
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To: TheWormster

Evo is a science THEORY - guesses.

So what's it doing in a science class?

I don't care where they teach evo and ID, but they need to be taught side by side, so students can judge for themselves.

I am often very confused as to why otherwise intelligent people can believe that this big, beautiful and very complex world could have happened by CHANCE.


360 posted on 12/16/2005 7:42:07 AM PST by Sun (Hillary Clinton is pro-ILLEGAL immigration. Don't let her fool you. She has a D- /F immigr. rating.)
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