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Board member to resume testimony in 'intelligent design' trial
Times Leader (Wilkes-Barre, PA) ^
| 02 November 2005
| MARTHA RAFFAELE
Posted on 11/02/2005 3:35:41 AM PST by PatrickHenry
A school board member who was questioned by a federal judge about discrepancies in his testimony on the purchase of "intelligent design" textbooks was expected to return to the witness stand Wednesday.
Dover Area School Board member Alan Bonsell was to undergo redirect questioning by an attorney representing the board in a landmark trial over whether intelligent design can be introduced in high school science classes.
Bonsell testified Monday that he had received an $850 check from fellow board member William Buckingham. The check was made out to Bonsell's father, who volunteered to donate copies of "Of Pandas and People" to the district.
U.S. District Judge John E. Jones III asked Bonsell why he never shared that information in a January deposition when he was repeatedly asked under oath about who was involved in making the donation. Bonsell, who served as the board's president in 2004, said he misspoke. [Note to school board lawyers: When the judge asks your client why he's lying, it's usually not a good sign.]
Buckingham testified Thursday he collected $850 in donations to help purchase the books during a Sunday service at his church.
The board is defending its October 2004 decision to require students to hear a statement about intelligent design before ninth-grade biology lessons on evolution. The statement says Charles Darwin's theory is "not a fact," has inexplicable "gaps," and refers students to the textbook for more information.
Eight families are suing to have intelligent design removed from the biology curriculum because they believe the policy essentially promotes the Bible's view of creation, and therefore violates the constitutional separation of church and state.
Intelligent design supporters argue that natural selection, an element of evolutionary theory, cannot fully explain the origin of life or the emergence of highly complex life forms.
The trial began Sept. 26 and is expected to conclude on Friday.
TOPICS: Culture/Society; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: bearingfalsewitness; creationisminadress; crevolist; dover; rwc1tempertantrum
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The demolition of Behe happened, as expected, while the plaintiff parents were putting on their case. But this disintegration of the school board members is happening while the defendant school board is putting on their defense. Their lawyers must be on the verge of suicide. And this appears to be the final week of the trial. Things are, as they say, reaching a climax.
To: VadeRetro; Junior; longshadow; RadioAstronomer; Doctor Stochastic; js1138; Shryke; RightWhale; ...
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2
posted on
11/02/2005 3:36:59 AM PST
by
PatrickHenry
(Reality is a harsh mistress. No rationality, no mercy)
3
posted on
11/02/2005 3:42:55 AM PST
by
Junior
(From now on, I'll stick to science, and leave the hunting alien mutants to the experts!)
To: PatrickHenry
So far, this trial has only reconfirmed what we've constantly seen evidenced over and over on these threads. Creationists are basically a disorganized bunch of dishonest liars who base their whole concept on reality on liberally self interpreted myths and superstitions supplemented with constant denial of what's easily observed all around them. What's really scary is that there's enough of them to elect local school board officials in isolated backwaters.
4
posted on
11/02/2005 4:13:48 AM PST
by
shuckmaster
(Bring back SeaLion and ModernMan!)
To: shuckmaster
"...What's really scary is that there's enough of them to elect local school board officials
in isolated backwaters."
Don't forget the state of Kansas.
To: shuckmaster
What's really scary is that there's enough of them to elect local school board officials in isolated backwaters. Democracy is scary. You just can't allow or trust a bunch of slope-headed slack-jawed Christians to elect school board members to represent their views and design a school program curriculum. The State must shove Darwinism and athiesm down their throats until we eliminate this this scourge called Christianity.
/sarc
To: Rightwing Conspiratr1
Christianity survived Copernicus and it will survive Darwin. God is not offended by our discovering how things work.
7
posted on
11/02/2005 5:35:03 AM PST
by
js1138
(Great is the power of steady misrepresentation.)
To: Rightwing Conspiratr1
Democracy has nothing to do with it when the democratically elected morons breach people's constitutional rights. If you democratically elected a bunch of people who decided to institute Islam as the official religion of the United States, you'd be one of the first of the mouth-breathers lining up in protest.
To: PatrickHenry
Isn't this the same school board member who "misspoke" about not saying that the school needed to teach Creationism, despite contemporaneous notes that had him saying exactly that?
A serial mis-speaker!?!?!?
To: PatrickHenry
Their lawyers must be on the verge of suicide. I'm still not 100% optimistic about a win (though that may be my pessimistic side attempting to avert potential disappointment...when it comes to pseudoscience, to me the glass is always half empty.)
Another (humorously) interesting link from FoxNews - apparently the key to the true genius of Einstein & Darwin is managing your inbox .
10
posted on
11/02/2005 6:13:00 AM PST
by
Quark2005
(Science aims to elucidate. Pseudoscience aims to obfuscate.)
To: Rightwing Conspiratr1
What's really scary is that there's enough of them to elect local school board officials in isolated backwaters.Democracy is scary. You just can't allow or trust a bunch of slope-headed slack-jawed Christians to elect school board members to represent their views and design a school program curriculum. The State must shove Darwinism and athiesm down their throats until we eliminate this this scourge called Christianity.
Teaching semi-inteligent design as a valid alternative to evolution is just one step from teaching that the earth is flat with 4 corners like the bible says as a valid alternative to conventional geography.
So9
To: Quark2005
I'm still not 100% optimistic about a win (though that may be my pessimistic side attempting to avert potential disappointment...when it comes to pseudoscience, to me the glass is always half empty.) I'm cautious, as well. Pseudoscience is a pernicious and seductive evil, appealing to many people partly because it re-inforces prejudices and partly because it offers simple solutions to complex issues.
It's like liberalism - fuzzy-headed, feel-good answers to tough questions. Feelings over facts, emotions over reason. And just like liberalism, pseudoscience will continue to win converts among them who want easy answers.
That's why we can't let down our guard, even when our opponents are as transparent and incompetent as this bunch of yahoos.
12
posted on
11/02/2005 7:00:24 AM PST
by
highball
("I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson)
To: WildHorseCrash
"The real object of the [first] amendment was, not to countenance, much less to advance Mahometanism, or Judaism, or infidelity, by prostrating Christianity; but to exclude all rivalry among Christian sects, and to prevent any national ecclesiastical establishment, which should give to an hierarchy the exclusive patronage of the national government..." - Supreme Court Justice Joseph Story
To: Servant of the 9
"There is simply no historical foundation for the proposition that the framers intended to build a wall of separation...
... the "wall of separation between church and State" is a metaphor based on bad history, a metaphor which has proved useless as a guide to judging. It should be frankly and explicitly abandoned." -- Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, William Rehnquist
To: PatrickHenry
And this appears to be the final week of the trial. Things are, as they say, reaching a climax. And I for one will being going through withdrawl symptoms once it is over; this has been the most illuminating and entertaining trial I've ever seen reported, featuring an ID "Scientist" who claims that despite having no idea what the mechanism is for ID, he can none the less "see" it based on "purposeful arrangement of parts," plus several members of the school board who have variously lied & dissembled, and thus probably perjured themselves and obstructed justice whilst under oath.
Essentially, the notion that ID is science has been crushed, the notion that this school board wanted to introduce the statement in question for reasons unrelated to religion has been demolished, and the board memebers' integrity lies [no pun intended] in a smoldering heap.
It doesn't get any better than this.... unless of course the judge has the board members arrested and thrown in jail for perjury, obstruction, or contempt of court. He could just as well charge them with felony stupidity, but that would be "piling on."
To: PatrickHenry
Willkommen! Bienvenue! Welcome!
I need a shower after the thread I just came from. YEEECCHHH!!! Wouldn't have pinged my worst enemy to it.
16
posted on
11/02/2005 7:19:07 AM PST
by
VadeRetro
(Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
To: Rightwing Conspiratr1
Would it shock you to know he was writing in 1833, well before the passage of the 14th Amendment, and that his views are a minority view of what the law is??? Look, we can debate back and forth about what the law should be, but not what the law is. (You are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts, as someone on these boards keeps noting.)
To: Rightwing Conspiratr1
Funny, William Rehnquist telling us that Jefferson didn't actually mean what Jefferson said he meant.
18
posted on
11/02/2005 7:24:29 AM PST
by
highball
("I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -- Thomas Jefferson)
To: PatrickHenry; connectthedots
The demolition of Behe happened... Oh, no! Just ask connectthedots. Everything is going swimmingly for the defense. They're refuting all allegations and it's all wonderful.
[Whoops! There goes another load of winged monkeys out of my rectum!]
19
posted on
11/02/2005 7:30:54 AM PST
by
VadeRetro
(Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
To: highball
Funny, William Rehnquist telling us that Jefferson didn't actually mean what Jefferson said he meant. He's telling us that Jefferson didn't mean what Hugo Black said Jefferson meant.
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