Times: Cheney First Disclosed CIA Official's Name

newsmax.com ^ | Monday, Oct. 24, 2005 10:24 p.m. EDT

[InvisibleChurch]

Monday, Oct. 24, 2005 10:24 p.m. EDT Times: Cheney First Disclosed CIA Official's Name

The New York Times reported late Monday that Vice President Cheney has been directly linked to the so-called "Plamegate" scandal involving the disclosure of the name of Valerie Plame, a CIA officer.

The paper reported that Cheney's chief of staff, Lewis "Scooter" Libby "first learned about the C.I.A. officer at the heart of the leak investigation in a conversation with Mr. Cheney weeks before her identity became public in 2003."

The paper sourced their story to "lawyers involved in the case."

The Times said that notes taken by Libby differ from his own testimony before the grand jury as to when he first learned of Plame's identity.

"The notes, taken by Mr. Libby during the conversation, for the first time place Mr. Cheney in the middle of an effort by the White House to learn about Ms. Wilson’s husband, Joseph C. Wilson IV, who was questioning the administration’s handling of intelligence about Iraq’s nuclear program to justify the war."

Cheney apparently discovered details of Plame's CIA work after he questioned then CIA Director George J. Tenet about her husband, Ambassador Wilson.

But even if Libby or Cheney had disclosed Plame's identity as a CIA officer they may not have committed a crime.

"Disclosing a covert agent’s identity can be a crime, but only if the person who discloses it knows the agent’s undercover status," the Times said.

[KC_Conspirator]

An unsourced person claims that Cheney did it?

[Kryptonite]

Maybe Libby will lose his law license too. Maybe not.

Jones' case was not about perjury, but the articles of impeachment from the Lewinski scandal were, and we know how that turned out. You brought up the Jones case and I responded to that. He had his law license suspended as part of an agreement to end the independent counsel's investigation.

But the main point is that Fuhrman's and Clinton's lies were material to the investigations that were going on. I don't see how Libby allegedly lying about where he heard of Plame being material if Fitzgerald cannot prove that Plame's identity as an undercover agent was known.

[Howlin]

Well, I guess Judge Wright and the Arkansas Bar was wrong then.

Better contact them.

[Kryptonite]

I already have, several times.

See my prior posts regarding proving criminal knowledge of Plame's status as a covert agent, as opposed to someone merely working for the CIA, at the time of the communications.

If Fitzgerald cannot prove that any alleged leaker either had actual knowledge of Plame's status as a covert agent or reasonably believed she was a covert agent, he has no case relating to "unauthorized disclosure", as you put it. I think that its pretty clear that he has no case on the main part of the investigation, at least not against Cheney, Rove or Libby.

Perjury only comes into play if it is material to the underlying investigation. Although the underlying investigation also dealt with sources of leaks, Libby cannot be convicted of perjury for allegedly lying about his source unless it can also be shown that he knew Plame was a covert agent. It's a fine point of law but that's what I see in the leaks from unidentified lawyers close to the investigation, and all the prattling on about other issues by the likes of Fineman and O'Donnell yesterday.

Can you point to anything anywhere that indicates any target of the investigation besides Joe Wilson and Plame knew that Plame was a covert agent instead of simply a CIA employee at the time of the communications?

[Kryptonite]

For an example of the kind of building block analysis that is easily chopped down by first rate legal professionals, see this O'Donnell article, where O'Donnell argues that anybody identified as “a CIA official" must be a covert agent. That's preposterous. George Tenet, a CIA official, was not covert. But that sort of argument underscores my point about the difficulty Fitzgerald will have in proving criminal knowledge of her status or perjury for testimony material to that point.

The fact that Wilson's wife worked for the CIA is just as probative, perhaps even more, of the alleged bad intent behind discrediting Wilson, than if she was working as a covert agent. If she was in a position to have her husband assigned to Niger, it's more likely that she'd have more influence as a "CIA official" than she would as a "covert agent".

[drjimmy]

Perjury only comes into play if it is material to the underlying investigation. Although the underlying investigation also dealt with sources of leaks, Libby cannot be convicted of perjury for allegedly lying about his source unless it can also be shown that he knew Plame was a covert agent. It's a fine point of law but that's what I see in the leaks from unidentified lawyers close to the investigation, and all the prattling on about other issues by the likes of Fineman and O'Donnell yesterday.

You may choose to disbelieve it because of the source, but here is how the NY Times article explains Libby's potential jeopardy:

"It would not be illegal for either Mr. Cheney or Mr. Libby, both of whom are presumably cleared to know the government's deepest secrets, to discuss a C.I.A. officer or her link to a critic of the administration. But any effort by Mr. Libby to steer investigators away from his conversation with Mr. Cheney could be considered by Patrick J. Fitzgerald, the special counsel in the case, to be an illegal effort to impede the inquiry.

The notes help explain the legal difficulties facing Mr. Libby. Lawyers in the case said Mr. Libby testified to the grand jury that he had first heard from journalists that Ms. Wilson may have had a role in dispatching her husband on a C.I.A.-sponsored mission to Africa in 2002 in search of evidence that Iraq had acquired nuclear material there for its weapons program. But the notes, now in Mr. Fitzgerald's possession, also indicate that Mr. Libby first heard about Ms. Wilson - who is also known by her maiden name, Valerie Plame - from Mr. Cheney. That apparent discrepancy in his testimony suggests why prosecutors are weighing false statement charges against him in what they interpret as an effort by Mr. Libby to protect Mr. Cheney from scrutiny, the lawyers said."

Those who continue to focus on the "but Plame wasn't undercover and that's the only thing Fitzgerald is allowed to investigate" mantra are ignoring that back in 2004 the acting attorney general had told Fitzgerald he could bring charges against anyone who impedes his investigation in any way. That's the letter that I have quoted from.

[muawiyah]

Because of a number of findings in this case I've proposed that Judith Miller got the name wrong from a written document, and that came from an "intermediary" source between her and Valerie Plame's CIA office ~ that's where she got all her apparantly inaccurate intelligence concerning Iraq WMD. She then wrote a book on the topic.

It would make a lot of sense of a reporter preparing a book to make every possible effort to bypass other news media, and Administration statements and try to get directly to the folks in the CIA putting together the reports the Administration was using.

Judith can't recall WHO because there are many folks who provided her information for her book.

[Kryptonite]

I'm more credible than the Slimes, dr.

The point isn't that Plame was not in fact covert - the point is that there's no proof that any of the people I've discussed actually knew or reasonably believed she was when the communications were made - for what's going on about the 5th or 6th time with you.

I'm not going to explain to you it again.

[Carolinamom]

Aldridge Ames outed Valerie Plame in 1995......over 9 years ago. David Corn was the first reporter in this media frenzy to name her in his column.

[AmericaUnited]

No! No! You mean the Vice President of the United States discussed 'classified' information with his Chief of Staff??!!! This is UNBELIEVABLE! /sarcasm

Rush just pointed out how utterly absurd it is to think THE VICE PRESIDENT can't/should'nt speak of matters of the US with his staff.

[richconklin]

To me this is great news. I think George W. has a chance to remake the final chapters of his Presidency. W. would be well served to clean house and get Cheney and Libby the hell out.

Bring in George Allen by special appointment and lets get back to righting this ship.

Allow Delay and Dick and their losing political styles to exit stage left...good riddance

[LS]

But didn't Wilson himself, or her, on a web site, also "out" her?

[F.J. Mitchell]

The NY Times, so famous for fiction of late, seems to be attempting to branch out into commedy.

If the Times commedy is even half as hillarous as it's fictional facts have been, it should be a smashing success.

[Carolinamom]

No thanks to any of your suggestions. Allen is A-okay as a presiential candidate in '08 though.

P.S. As a newbie you haven't quite got the lay of the land around these parts re VP Cheney.

[Carolinamom]

oops....that's presiDential

[F.J. Mitchell]

IMHO Judith Miller can't recall, for exactly the same reason the Clinton twins could not recall. Taking the fifth makes everyone more suspicious.

Little does Judith realize that post-Clinton, can't recall, raises the same suspicions.

[Carolinamom]

It is a FACT that Aldridge Ames outed Valerie Plame in 1995......9 years ago. It is a FACT that in the present media frenzy David Corn was the 1st reporter to name her in his column.

[beyond the sea]

Well, I guess Judge Wright and the Arkansas Bar was wrong then.

Well, I guess Judge Wright and the Arkansas Bar 'were' wrong is correct............ don't get pissed.

Facts and grammar are our friends.

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By the way, I PRAY that Mr. Fitzgerald has done his homework well and that he is honorable, and then indicts the real liars........... Wilson, Plame, and a bundle of others.

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I don't know if you saw this thread. I was afraid to ping you on this.

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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1508146/posts

Is Valerie Plame the new Deep Throat?

[Howlin]

For the one millionth time, do NOT post to me or FREEPMAIL me again.