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Ivor L. van Heerden, deputy director of the Louisiana State University Hurricane Center, said he was concerned that serious design defects had contributed directly to the wall failures. He has called for an intensive independent investigation.

This "expert" was on Meet the Press last Sunday--the second of two visits--and basically laid the whole thing at the feet of the Bush Administration for cutting funds to the Army Corps of Engineers. Two days ago he was quoted in an NBC Nightly News story where Lisa Meyers reported the contractor--while upgrading one of the levees ten years ago--had told the Army COE the ground was not strong enough to support one of the now broken levees. This professor never mentioned it on MTP. Now he's calling for an independent investigation regarding New Orleans sinking yet he never mentioned that either.

This story conveniently leaves out the fact the Prof. van Heerden is also an expert in levees and I've seen his actual title reported elsewhere as "deputy director of the Louisiana State University Hurricane and Levee Center".

So, he started out on Meet the Press blaming Bush, came back on MTP blaming Bush, then gets questioned regarding reports of irregularities dealing with the levee upgrades ten years ago and now is calling for an "independent investigation" for something he's supposed to be an expert on yet never bothered to mention.

I think he did know all this and was more interested in tieing an albatross around Bush's neck. Now, he's playing dumb when his job requires him to know--or at least study to find out--this information. Did he know any of this or is he just another incompetent Louisiana boob like the governor and the mayor of New Orleans?

1 posted on 10/01/2005 10:07:15 AM PDT by blake6900
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To: blake6900
Levees and storm walls may be as much as 2 feet lower than they were designed to be, both because elevation data were outdated when the levees were built and because the land has continued to sink,

Waht about the explosives? They forgot to mention the explosives used to blow up the levees.

2 posted on 10/01/2005 10:09:31 AM PDT by ElkGroveDan (California bashers will be called out)
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To: blake6900

It was Karl Rove's landsinker machine.


3 posted on 10/01/2005 10:18:08 AM PDT by manic4organic (We won. Get over it.)
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To: blake6900
"As levees have sunk, melting glaciers have lifted ocean levels globally, she added."

This is where I stopped reading!

5 posted on 10/01/2005 10:21:46 AM PDT by strongbow
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To: blake6900
"As levees have sunk, melting glaciers have lifted ocean levels globally, she added. "

I stopped reading right there, this is all I needed to see to know her agenda on this subject. Her adding the 1/4" raise in ocean levels over the last 100 years compared to the 2' of settlement tells me she is an environmentalist pushing a global warming hype to the problem.

7 posted on 10/01/2005 10:26:03 AM PDT by Abathar (Proudly catching hell for posting without reading since 2004)
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To: blake6900
All the more reason NOT to spend billions to rebuild in the 9th Ward (former cypress swamp) and other "below sea-level" areas.
8 posted on 10/01/2005 10:26:10 AM PDT by VRWCTexan (History has a long memory - but still repeats itself)
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To: blake6900

Another theory to ponder......
He sounds about 3 sandwiches short of a picnic.IMHO


10 posted on 10/01/2005 10:34:19 AM PDT by WasDougsLamb (Just my opinion.Go easy on me........)
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To: blake6900
Now, with evidence suggesting Katrina's intensity fell within the range the levees should have handled, corps spokesmen are saying the organization wants to conduct a full-scale analysis of the design and construction of the levees.

So, when the head of Homeland Security said the levee break was a surprise he was telling the truth.

OTOH: It's still Bush's fault.

11 posted on 10/01/2005 10:35:37 AM PDT by Mike Darancette (Mesocons for Rice '08)
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To: blake6900

There was an excellent thread on FR a few weeks ago analysing satellite data and pointing to areas where the levees were noticeably lower than they were supposed to be. It's possible FR was out ahead of this story by weeks.


16 posted on 10/01/2005 10:47:25 AM PDT by saganite (The poster formerly known as Arkie 2)
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To: blake6900
"The land has been sinking on the President's watch. Sources tell us that...
(background whisper)
...well it says 1950.
(shuffling of paper)
Who?
(pause)
HARRY TRUMAN?!!"

We are experiencing historical difficulties; please stand by.

17 posted on 10/01/2005 10:50:24 AM PDT by niteowl77 (A soldier's dad once again.)
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To: blake6900

Review this FR thread for an early discussion of the condition and height of the levees using the satellite data I mentioned.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1484668/posts


18 posted on 10/01/2005 10:52:12 AM PDT by saganite (The poster formerly known as Arkie 2)
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To: blake6900

Two prime Bush bashers, NBC and the LA Times, come out with levee failure stories within 24 hours of each other, both factually correct, both also sumarily incorrect. It's no accident.

Both sets of scum know the truth, they know it is going to come out one way or another, and this is yet another attempt to head utter disaster off by means of a pre-emptive strike.

Let them play their games. There was no need to draw Dan Rather in, his impatience and arrogance caused him to throw caution to the winds and plunge ahead, right into a trap, without thinking.

For the moment, these idiots are doing our work for us. They raise attention to Cat 3 levees that failed in Cat 2 conditions. Allow them to continue. So far, they are unable to make their point without explicitly stating it, and this issue is much too complex for the average man in the street to get what the media is trying to sell with only innuendo at their disposal.

Before too long though, NBC, the LA Times, and all the rest will come to a crossroads. They will have to decide between letting their point go unspoken and stating it explicitly.

Regardless of which avenue they choose, the truth is known. The truth is...archived.

If they choose to commit themselves, they leave themselves open to yet another Rathergate.

If they choose not to take the risk of explicitly stating a lie, then the ground is primed and ready for us to make the real point for them.

Once again, those who would save effort and work in achieving undeserved political benefit have outmaneuvered themselves.

No surprise.

Of course, if they were intelligent to begin with, they wouldn't be Liberal, would they?


19 posted on 10/01/2005 11:09:19 AM PDT by jeffers
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To: blake6900
[ This story conveniently leaves out the fact the Prof. van Heerden is also an expert in levees and I've seen his actual title reported elsewhere as "deputy director of the Louisiana State University Hurricane and Levee Center". ]

Rename New Orleans as New Holland.. and use lowland techniques to rebuild the place.. with windmills and everything.. Course that will put a hurtin on the crawfish crop.. draining all them swamps.. or maybe even building the first underwater city.. Should be cheaper than inhabiting to Mars or the Moon..

20 posted on 10/01/2005 11:13:14 AM PDT by hosepipe (This Propaganda has been edited to include not a small amount of Hyperbole..)
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To: blake6900

Much of NO East was peaty boggy land before they filled it in. I moved out to one of the suburbs before most of the area was built up, and the air was frequently filled with the smell of smoke from bog fires. We moved to one neighborhood in 1968, but moved out in 1973 in part because the ground had sunk below the house slab, exposing places that rats and cats would come into the house from below. In 5 years, must have sunk around a foot. During the same time period, in Jefferson Parish, the area immediately west of New Orleans, houses blew up because of subsidence problems with the gas lines to the houses.


22 posted on 10/01/2005 11:18:45 AM PDT by Knitting A Conundrum (Act Justly, Love Mercy, and Walk Humbly With God Micah 6:8)
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To: blake6900

Experts had sounded alarms in recent years about subsidence, as the sinking is known ...

Subsidence (sub si dence), a condition where everything collapses after politicians suck all the money out of the environment.


24 posted on 10/01/2005 11:20:08 AM PDT by caryatid
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To: blake6900

"This "expert" was on Meet the Press last Sunday--the second of two visits--and basically laid the whole thing at the feet of the Bush Administration for cutting funds to the Army Corps of Engineers."

WRONG! I have it on good authority that George Bush ordered Navy divers to blow up the levees because he hates blacks and wants to steal their land.


25 posted on 10/01/2005 11:32:48 AM PDT by dljordan
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To: blake6900
"As levees have sunk, melting glaciers have lifted ocean levels globally"

And then and then when the Bush Administration dynamited the levees and the black neighborhoods were flooded with the water bypassing the white neighborhoods and the military gunships shot at black people foraging for food and the black people had to eat each other and kill and rape thousands in the Superdome and poor Ray Nagin was out there begging the Bush administration for help and Kathleen Blanco was trying to get the Louisiana National Guard to come in and help but Bush had called all of them to Iraq, except a few who had to stay to help dynamite the levees and the global warming caused the levees to sink cause the Bush admistration was brewing up hurrycanes to kill of the African Americans in New Orleans all because they don't like black people.

Ray Nagin for Congress 2008 /sarc>
26 posted on 10/01/2005 12:28:53 PM PDT by Bar-Face (The Embassy helicopter is warming up.)
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To: blake6900

>>As levees have sunk, melting glaciers have lifted ocean levels globally, she added.<<

I am not a scientist but I do have a call into one to verify what I am thinking. I think:

When water freezes it encompasses greater mass.

When an iceburg melts the amount of ice above the surface will only fill the space that the iceburg took below the waterline.

Therefore this will not cause the oceans to rise.

Am I correct?


27 posted on 10/01/2005 12:29:37 PM PDT by B4Ranch (Reality: By the time you get your head together, your body's shot to hell.)
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To: blake6900

OK, so NOW as (still) more evidence gathers than 'norlins' is sinking, can we quit trying to rebuild a city that is below sea level in a swamp?

All the workers have been evacuated, they will find new jobs where they are now. That is what workers do. The business owners will establish their businesses where they are now, its not like they have any assets to return to.

All the welfare receivers have been evacuated, tell them to pick up their checks where they are now.

Every ocean going ship that was going to dock there has been redirected to another port.

Farmers will have to have the rail cars that they load their grain into go to one of the other US ports.

The human debris of the Frog Quarter will have to go somewhere else for their annual 'parade'



... And where are the environmental impact studies that are required by law any time a wetlands is drained?

If a normal citizen fills in a puddle on their land, they go to jail. Why aren't the citizens of 'norlins' held to the same legal standard?



29 posted on 10/01/2005 12:46:56 PM PDT by Casekirchen (Quit wasting my tax dollars rebuilding Sodom in the Swamp)
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To: blake6900

The fed should pay NOT ONE CENT to rebuild New Orleans.


30 posted on 10/01/2005 12:52:23 PM PDT by Tax Government (Put down the judicial insurrection. Contribute to FR.)
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To: blake6900

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1489838/posts


32 posted on 10/01/2005 2:23:22 PM PDT by Ellesu (www.thedeadpelican.com)
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