Posted on 09/29/2005 10:29:26 PM PDT by Sprite518
A good quick read...
If we could all in concert begin to replace the emotion-laden "rich" word with the three which more correctly describe who we are talking about, then the power inherent in the "tax cuts for the rich" mantra will fade. The power will fade because those who have the least to gain from having ENTREPRENEURS, EMPLOYERS, AND INVESTORS targeted as the declared enemy of tax policy are, of course, THE POOR, THE UNEMPLOYED, AND THE EMPLOYED.
23% but it eliminates all other taxes including Social Security and Medicare....
LOL! You guys are cracking me up... Do you just say this stuff on the fly or what??? LOL!
Crack you up??? Its all in your bill. Tax collection nazis would love the way your bill is written.
A recent poll showed the flat tax is almost twice as popular as the national sales tax – and the same poll showed that the sales tax is tied with the current system.
"Moreover, I'm concerned whether a national sales tax is politically viable. Senator Jim DeMint had an unexpectedly tough race in South Carolina last year because his opponent demagogued against the fair tax."
At least Dr. Mitchell accurately described what happened in the SC senate race: "demagogued" is an appropriate term. He could have also mentioned that the DNCC and DNSC put in huge amounts of $$ to aid in the demagoguing, while little money was available to support the FairTax. In spite of all that, exit polling indicated that DeMint won among voters who listed tax reform as a priority by a margin of about 2-1.
The FairTax is an asset to any candidate running on it if they have the resources to explain it to voters and rebut the false accusations of the opposition.
"Republicans also may have lost the Colorado Senate race because their candidate was zinged for supporting a national sales tax."
That is incorrect. To my knowledge, Coors never endorsed the sales tax.
"And the GOP lost a Senate seat in Louisiana back in 1996 because the candidate backed the wrong tax reform plan."
What candidate? What "wrong tax reform plan"? This is meaningless.
"Flat tax is the only way to go. 15% across the board. No shelters, no loopholes, no exemptions. No modifications to the tax code for 200 years. Government must live beneath its means until the national debt is paid off and then it can only live within its means thereafter. Period. End of story."
What is the bill number for that proposal? How many co-sponsors does it have?
My reasons for supporting the Fair Tax are not about money saved or taxes lessened. I think that it'll be a wash in those areas.
I support the FairTax because a sales tax will get the Fed out of my life. Think of never having to fill out Fed tax forms ever again; think of the IRS as we know it going away; think of all those companies that survive because of the complexity of this tax code having to turn that energy and capital into something useful to the nation; think of foreign visitors having to pay when they visit; think of everyone having to pay something rather than some getting a free ride.
The flat tax is my 2nd choice.
But politicians will be politicians. I have no illusions that politicians couldn't corrupt either of those 2 systems.
I do not think enough people know about the fair tax to even have a poll. Steve Forbes has been purchasing the Flat Tax in the public for years, but it has not done anything. Even with the Republicans in control of congress and the White House.
The short Time that the Fair Tax has been out it has been a New York Times Best seller. I believe that says something. Moreover, there is a House and Senate Bill for the Fair Tax. HR 25 and S 25 are the Bills. Does the Flat tax even have a bill in congress.
I do not keep up on local politics in South Carolina. I did not even know that was a debate there?
Paying for the military is easily done with a 5% flat rate if wasteful, welfare state spending is cut drastically.
Bingo... LOL! ;-)
"But if we actually want to get rid of the IRS and adopt a simple and fair tax system, the flat tax is the only horse that can make it to the finish line."
"Surprised to hear Neal say that. That comment is going to PO fairtaxers."
That wasn't Neal, it was Dan Mitchell. Most of the "inside-the beltway" types favor the flat tax. I'm a FairTaxer and it doesn't PO me. He is just wrong. The flat tax will never have any significant Democratic support. The FairTax should, although moderate Dems will have to buck their liberal leaders to support it.
I noticed that Mitchell referenced an unidentifed poll showing the flat tax as preferred by Americans. That is odd, since every poll that I have seen in the past few months has shown the FairTax leading, typically by margins of about 2-1. That begs the question of why that one poll was so different and why Dr. Mitchell considers it definitive, even though it apparently contradicts the vast majority of polls that are out there. For example, I think the CNBC poll that Kudlow did had a final tally of about 75% in favor of the FairTax.
I am with you on that 100%. My second choice would be a Fair Tax. The tax system in its current state is destroying our country slowly. Hopefully, Bush will be able to get it reformed.
"And I don't buy this 'Congress passed what was essentially a flat tax' in 1986 bullcrap."
That is your option. Here are the facts. What the 86 TRA did was to essentially flatten the rate chart to two levels and eliminate a number of deductions. It was an effort to simplify, among other things. Although not a pure flat-tax (with a single rate), it was as close as was politically possible at the time, certainly much closer than what the 86 act replaced.
According to CCH, the total number of pages numbered 26,300 in 1984, so it was probably somewhere between 25 and 30k in 1986 when it was simplified. Today, it is over 60k.
I will leave it to other thread visitors to decide if they think the 1986 attempt to simplify our tax system was successful.
"And you can not be audited under the fairtax? The first thing the fairtax bill does is make the consumer liable for the sales tax. If they think you owe sales tax, the new taxing authority can most certainly audit you."
Only businesses would be audited. Individuals don't file returns; therefore there is nothing to audit at the individual level.
"You think an infrastructure on par with the IRS isn't going to be created to track those sales taxes?"
Yes, that is exactly what I think. WIth a simplification of more than 98% in the system being audited, as well as a huge reduction in the number of points of collection and enforcement, whatever level of resources that will be committed to enforcement will be much more effective with a much streamlined system.
If we do not get rid of the Income Tax, PERMANENTLY, before we institute a sales tax, in short order, we WILL be strapped with BOTH.
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