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Biology expert testifies. Professor: Intelligent design is creationism.
York Dispatch ^ | 9/27/05 | Christina Kauffman

Posted on 09/27/2005 9:10:31 AM PDT by Crackingham

Dover Area School District's federal trial began yesterday in Harrisburg with talk ranging from divine intervention and the Boston Red Sox to aliens and bacterial flagellum. After about 10 months of waiting, the court case against the district and its board opened in Middle District Judge John E. Jones III's courtroom with statements from lawyers and several hours of expert testimony from biologist and Brown University professor Kenneth Miller.

On one side of the aisle, several plaintiffs packed themselves in wooden benches behind a row of attorneys from the American Civil Liberties Union, Pepper Hamilton LLC and Americans United for Separation of Church and State. On the other side of the aisle, nine school board members, only three of whom were on the board when it voted 6-3 to include a statement on intelligent design in biology classes, piled in behind lawyers from the Thomas More Law Center. Assistant superintendent Michael Baksa and superintendent Richard Nilsen shared a bench with Michael Behe, a Lehigh University professor expected to take the stand in defense of intelligent design.

SNIP

Miller, whose resume is several pages long and includes a stint as a professor at Harvard University, was the first witness called for the parents. Miller co-wrote the Prentice Hall textbook "Biology" with professor Joe Levine. The book is used by 35 percent of the high school students in the United States, Miller said. His were some of the thousands of biology books in which school officials in Cobb County, Ga., ordered stickers to be placed, warning that evolution is only a theory, "not a fact." Miller also testified in a lawsuit filed by Cobb County parents, and a judge later ordered that the stickers be removed.

Yesterday, the scientist's testimony was at times dominated by scientific terminology, though he jokingly told ACLU attorney Witold Walczak he would do his best to explain things in the layman's terms he uses with his mother.

Miller said intelligent design supporters think an intelligent designer must have been involved in the creation of life because science can't yet prove how everything evolved. He said the intelligent design idea that birds were created with beaks, feathers and wings and fish were born with fins is a creationist argument.

Intelligent design supporters often cite "irreducible complexity" in their research, he said. "Irreducible complexity" means that a living thing can't be reduced by any part or it won't work at all. So those living things could not have evolved in the way Darwin suggested; they had to be created with all of their existing parts, Miller said.

Intelligent design proponents often cite the bacterial flagellum, a bacterium with a tail that propels it, Miller said. Behe and his colleagues claim bacterial flagellum had to be created with all of its parts because it couldn't function if any of them were taken away, Miller testified. But scientists have proved that the bacterial flagellum can be reduced to a smaller being, a little organism that operates in a manner similar to a syringe, Miller said.

One of the biggest problems with the scientific viability of intelligent design is there is no way to experiment with the presence of a supernatural being because science only deals with the natural world and theories that are testable, Miller said.

Some people might suspect divine intervention last year when the Boston Red Sox came back to win the World Series after losing three games in a row to the New York Yankees in the playoffs. It may have been, but that's not science, he said. And intelligent design proponents haven't named the "intelligent being" behind their supposition, Miller said. They have suggested, among other things, that it could be aliens, he said. He said there is no evidence to prove intelligent design, so its proponents just try to poke holes in the theory of evolution.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: anothercrevothread; crevorepublic; enoughalready; lawsuit; makeitstop; scienceeducation; yourmomisanape
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To: MineralMan
Have one on me.

No, no, no...don't pour one on me...

Oh never mind.

361 posted on 09/27/2005 2:33:47 PM PDT by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: Junior
oh... no: this thread is starting to stagger and shimmie like a burned out junkie hooker lurching bowleggedly homeward to her decrepit hovel at the end of a long night of cheap thrills, moderately adulterated and economical crack cocaine, and grotesque sound effects.
362 posted on 09/27/2005 2:34:17 PM PDT by King Prout (19sep05 - I want at least 2 Saiga-12 shotguns. If you have leads, let me know)
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To: Doctor Stochastic

but look what I did to this thread!?!?!


363 posted on 09/27/2005 2:34:59 PM PDT by King Prout (19sep05 - I want at least 2 Saiga-12 shotguns. If you have leads, let me know)
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To: b_sharp
Radiocarbon? Wrong?

Of course it's wrong.

Wrong, wrong, wrong.
Were you there?
Light speed used to be faster.
Sediment from St. Helens was carved by water, really really fast.
The flood was wet.

I'm right, you aren't.


Good satire!

(Ah, I love the sound of beta decay in the morning!)

364 posted on 09/27/2005 2:35:01 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Is this a good tagline?)
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To: Gumlegs

Actually, two guys were standing in the end zone of Memorial Stadium, and one asked the other 'Why is there a big Z in the middle of the field'?


365 posted on 09/27/2005 2:35:15 PM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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To: Junior
Oh, that "little" one. Used his size like a club, he did. Always trying to get sympathy from women. And the crazy thing was, it usually worked. "Oh, isn't he cute?" "Don't you just want to pet him?" He ate it up like honey on a salmon, which I'm told bears would really eat up if they could find the combination in nature. Not that this one would bother looking. He made his living through flattery, back rubs, and those bottles of Clairol he'd smuggle into the house from time to time.

"Goldilocks," my foot. "Pyritelocks" was more like it.

366 posted on 09/27/2005 2:35:24 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: Gumlegs
Curiously, statistics appear to indicate that Christians, whether evangelical, born-again, or unmodified, all have higher divorce rates than atheists.

So if he really cared about his daughters happiness rather than his position at church he'd encourage his daughter to marry one of them "evolutionist atheists"

367 posted on 09/27/2005 2:36:03 PM PDT by Thatcherite (Conservative and Biblical Literalist are not synonymous)
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To: Right Wing Professor

Ha! You have f.Christian in a frenzy over on LP. He must be off his meds again.


368 posted on 09/27/2005 2:38:08 PM PDT by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: Thatcherite
So if he really cared about his daughters happiness rather than his position at church he'd encourage his daughter to marry one of them "evolutionist atheists"

...better to get a sperm count first, though. Can't tie yourself to a male of uncertain evolutionary fitness.

369 posted on 09/27/2005 2:38:35 PM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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To: Doctor Stochastic; All
I've recently unearthed evidence that Omar was a lurker in crevo debates on IR (IslamicRepublic.com)

Myself when young did eagerly frequent
Doctor and Saint, and heard great Argument
About it and about: but evermore
Came out by the same Door as in I went.

370 posted on 09/27/2005 2:40:10 PM PDT by Thatcherite (Conservative and Biblical Literalist are not synonymous)
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To: balrog666
Ha! You have f.Christian in a frenzy over on LP. He must be off his meds again.

Hot damn! I think I'll pop over, sign up and taunt him!

371 posted on 09/27/2005 2:40:11 PM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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To: King Prout

Sorry about that chief, I had a stigmata in my eye.


372 posted on 09/27/2005 2:40:40 PM PDT by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: balrog666
Ha! You have f.Christian in a frenzy over on LP.

That differs from his usual state ... how?

373 posted on 09/27/2005 2:41:34 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: King Prout
A far flung rock-u-mentry.
374 posted on 09/27/2005 2:41:49 PM PDT by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: Right Wing Professor

Actually, I rather like the name the team originally had, but I guess early PETA types objected to "Bugeaters."


375 posted on 09/27/2005 2:44:41 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: b_sharp

s'ok, b. thanks for watching. your lord and master - Foamy.


376 posted on 09/27/2005 2:51:01 PM PDT by King Prout (19sep05 - I want at least 2 Saiga-12 shotguns. If you have leads, let me know)
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To: King Prout; Right Wing Professor

It's all RWP's fault. He started it with the double post about the wheelbarrow full of rocks.


377 posted on 09/27/2005 2:51:33 PM PDT by Gumlegs
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To: b_sharp

rock-u-mentally?
izzat like screwin wi' summun'z mind?


378 posted on 09/27/2005 2:52:04 PM PDT by King Prout (19sep05 - I want at least 2 Saiga-12 shotguns. If you have leads, let me know)
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To: Gumlegs; Right Wing Professor

do these barrows-full of rocks truly explain the incipient chaos which threatens and agitates the scanty flames of the lamps that struggle against the darkness of scientific ignorance...

sorry - can't do it. no more. it hurts.


379 posted on 09/27/2005 2:55:23 PM PDT by King Prout (19sep05 - I want at least 2 Saiga-12 shotguns. If you have leads, let me know)
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To: Gumlegs
There were just too many rocks. Rocks can be like that, even expensive marble rocks from the 
Italian Riviera. There were rocks there that day, the day she told me. Rocks on the hot, perfumed 
beach, where the Meditteranean beauties copulated with the sun. Rocks on the olive-covered hills. 
Rocks. Huh!  

380 posted on 09/27/2005 2:57:59 PM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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