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Holdouts to Be Removed From New Orleans
BREITBART ^

Posted on 09/09/2005 6:06:57 PM PDT by Happy2BMe

NEW ORLEANS

Authorities said their sweep of this deluged city for the last voluntary evacuees was nearly complete, with officers ready to carry out the mayor's order to forcibly remove the thousands who remain in their homes.

"The ones who wanted to leave, I would say most of them are out," said Detective Sgt. James Imbrogglio.

Between 5,000 and 10,000 residents are believed left in the city, where toxic floodwaters have started to slowly recede but the task of collecting rotting corpses and clearing debris will likely take months.

Coast Guard Chief Petty Officer Jason Rule said his crew pulled 18 people from their homes Thursday. He said some of the holdouts did not want to leave unless they could take their pets.

"It's getting to the point where they're delirious," Rule said. "A couple of them don't know who they were. They think the water will go down in a few days."

Police Chief Eddie Compass said officers would use the "minimum amount of force" necessary to persuade those who remain to evacuate. Although no one was forcibly removed Thursday, some residents said they left under extreme pressure.

"They were all insisting that I had to leave my home," said Shelia Dalferes, who said she had 15 minutes to pack before she and her husband were evacuated.

"The implication was there with their plastic handcuffs on their belt. Who wants to go out like that?"

As searches for the living continued, the grim task of retrieving corpses intensified under the broiling sun. Officials raised the death toll in Louisiana to 118 Thursday, though New Orleans Mayor C. Ray Nagin has said up to 10,000 could be dead in that city alone. State officials have ordered 25,000 body bags.

Authorities are now faced with the challenge of how to identify bodies that may be bloated and decayed beyond recognition. At two collection sites, federal mortuary teams were collecting information that may help identify the bodies, such as where they were found. Personal effects were also being logged.

At the temporary morgue set up in nearby St. Gabriel, where 67 bodies had been collected by Thursday, the remains were being photographed and forensic workers hope to use dental X-rays, fingerprints and DNA to identify them.

Dr. Bryan Patucci, coroner of St. Bernard Parish, said it may be impossible to identify all the victims until authorities compile a final list of missing people.

Decaying corpses in the floodwaters could pose problems for engineers who are desperately trying to pump the city dry. While 37 of the 174 pumps in the New Orleans area were working and 17 portable pumps were in place Thursday, officials said the mammoth undertaking could be complicated by corpses getting clogged in the pumps.

"It's got a huge focus of our attention right now," said John Rickey of the Army Corps of Engineers. "Those remains are people's loved ones."

Some 400,000 homes in the city were also still without power, with no immediate prospect of getting it back. And fires continued to be a problem. At least 11 blazes burned across the city Thursday, including at historically black Dillard University where three buildings were destroyed.

Also Thursday, Congress rushed through an additional $51.8 billion for relief and recovery efforts and President Bush pledged to make it "easy and simple as possible" for uprooted storm victims to collect food stamps and other government benefits.

In an attempt to stem the criticism of the slow federal response to the disaster, Vice President Dick Cheney also toured parts of the ravaged Gulf Coast, claiming significant progress but acknowledging immense obstacles remained to a full recovery.

Meanwhile, Democrats threatened to boycott the naming of a panel that Republican leaders are proposing to investigate the administration's readiness and response to the storm. Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid said it was like a baseball pitcher calling "his own balls and strikes."

Democrats have urged appointment of an independent panel like the Sept. 11 commission.

Confusion continued to be a problem in many areas:

_ Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Blanco said that radio equipment and portable generators she requested from the federal government a week ago had yet to arrive. Federal officials said they were tracking down the status of the items.

_ In Houston, hundreds of storm victims waited for hours to pick up debit cards for cash that had been promised by relief agencies. By noon Thursday, so many people had jammed the entrance to the sign-up area that some were overcome by the heat and police were summoned.

___


TOPICS: Extended News
KEYWORDS: katrina; neworleans; nola
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To: monkeywrench
"Yes, but tackling old ladies is easier than going after looting sniping thugs."

I live in Bush country. As a matter of fact, I live in the exact spot where hurricanes Charley, Frances and Jeanne crossed paths last year in central Florida. We had no looting. Of course, there were a couple of incidents where somebody got shot in the butt while trying to steal a generator, but otherwise, we had no problems.

The reason we had no looting is because we are all heavily armed. An armed society is a polite society. The criminal element does exist here. I know. You see, I own a small, independent jewelry store. I would be one of the first places looted.

When the wind would die down and I could travel, I made my way to my store. Anybody that came into our parking lot that didn't belong got a million candle power spotlight in the eyes and they left. When the local law enforcement came by, I let them know that the shopping center was secure and they could focus on other areas. The local law enforcement here appreciated the locals stepping up and taking responsibility.

Neighbors helped neighbors. I tarped several damaged roofs for my elderly neighbors. We had block party style cookouts. I use a Big Berky water filter and kept my friends hydrated. Most people I knew had plenty of food stored. There was no flooding, but we did live in the heat and dark with plenty of skeeters for a long time.

The decision to violate our Constitution for "the good of the people" cannot be tolerated. I cannot believe some of the responses I've read on FR today regarding this serious matter. There will be innocent blood shed before this is over.

Image a train derailment in your area and the local law enforcement coming into your house and ripping the gun from your hand and taking you away, "for your own good". This is the proverbial "slippery slope" and FReepers should make sure and put a stop to this.

Monkeywrench, I'm ranting in general and I'm sorry it was in response to your post, so don't take this personally.

FReegards,
DocRock
201 posted on 09/09/2005 7:48:00 PM PDT by DocRock (Osama said, "We love death, the U.S. loves life, that is the main difference between us.")
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To: texasbluebell

I'm sure some of them are. So, I suppose we could just means test this evacuation.
susie


202 posted on 09/09/2005 7:48:26 PM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: DocRock

Great post.


203 posted on 09/09/2005 7:49:36 PM PDT by texasbluebell
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To: MizSterious; brytlea
In some of these areas of town, they can actually drive out. Some grocery stores and drug stores are actually open. If they don't have what is needed, they can drive to a nearby town.

You forgot to add that some areas even have water, sewerage, and electricity services restored. I guess some utility workers didn't get the memo that the city was unsalvageable.

204 posted on 09/09/2005 7:49:59 PM PDT by Antonello
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To: When do we get liberated?
Any time you produce a gun by the handle in front of a cop, he takes it as a threat, on a calm peaceful day it is a threat. These guys have been getting shot at alot lately

Besides the two LEOs that shot and killed themselves, how many have been shot?

205 posted on 09/09/2005 7:51:01 PM PDT by Black Tooth
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To: MizSterious
Ok, let me use some small words so you can comprehend understand.

You know, you are so clever. Do you do standup for a living? I thought not.

This is a pointless discussion. Well, I take that back, some here have actually discussed. And I have learned a few things. Others just like to try to make fun of other people. But, such is FR.

susie
206 posted on 09/09/2005 7:51:42 PM PDT by brytlea (All you need as ID to vote in FL is your Costco card...)
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To: brytlea

Perhaps more common sense would be a good start.

How about those who own their own properties get to make an actual decision about whether to let the govt take their real estate?


207 posted on 09/09/2005 7:51:45 PM PDT by texasbluebell
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To: DocRock

Please, rant on. Free Republic obviously needs it.


208 posted on 09/09/2005 7:52:09 PM PDT by MizSterious (Now, if only we could convince them all to put on their bomb-vests and meet in Mecca...)
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To: eeriegeno
maybe they are a lot younger?

LOL! Ya, that could be it.

209 posted on 09/09/2005 7:53:27 PM PDT by Balding_Eagle (God has blessed Republicans with really stupid enemies.)
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To: Black Tooth; When do we get liberated?
"Besides the two LEOs that shot and killed themselves, how many have been shot?"

===============================

As of last Thursday to my knowledge only one NOLA PD had been shot during Katrina, but I don't know the circumstances of it.
210 posted on 09/09/2005 7:53:34 PM PDT by Happy2BMe (Viva La MIGRA - LONG LIVE THE BORDER PATROL!)
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To: Antonello

Yes, I did, but I feared "electrcity" might be too big of a word. ;)

Sadly, some of these people are hellbent on forcing these good people out of their perfectly intact and working homes. I wonder if that will change when it's their turn?


211 posted on 09/09/2005 7:53:51 PM PDT by MizSterious (Now, if only we could convince them all to put on their bomb-vests and meet in Mecca...)
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To: _Jim
ActionNewsBill denies the usefulness, appropriateness and need for sanitary sewer systems.

Looks like the folks in that video, and from other sources, have got those bases covered. They've got electricity, food and supplies and personal protection, i.e, guns.

I think that is what you object to most...the fact that these folks believe in the concept of property rights, and are willing to defend their beliefs against government lackeys such as you and the rest of your-boot-licking buddies here.

And that is what you truly fear, law-abiding citizens defending their homes against unconstitutional government intrusion.

Same reason you are the biggest FReeper cheerleader for the atrocities at Waco.

212 posted on 09/09/2005 7:54:12 PM PDT by ActionNewsBill ("In times of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act")
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To: brytlea
"And for that I'm told I'm urinating on the Constitution. It's sad that so often here at FR we cannot have an adult discussion about things we disagree on (and in fact, I may be convincable that you're right and I'm wrong since as I said, I can see both sides of this) without people resorting to calling others idiots etc. I don't always think that people who disagree with me are stupid or uninformed or even worse, democrats! Altho I have to admit that FR is the only place I have EVER been accused of being liberal. "

I am the first to complain about others being nasty. If I have a bad tone in my "voice" it could be cause I'm especially testy after having to de-virus my computer today. So for that I apologize.

However, I don't recall calling you an idiot, or accusing you of being a democrat either. I simply stated my point - perhaps rather (too?) bluntly.
213 posted on 09/09/2005 7:54:58 PM PDT by LibertyRocks
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To: brytlea
I know that TV has gotten very confusing with all the substitute hosts. You'd think that the regulars would want to weigh in on this important story. But I have no doubt it's legal to evict anyone for numerous reasons. Fair is another matter. But it's true that are health dangers here, mainly posed by seriously contaminated water. It's gotten very dangerous to remain in NOLA. I posted this article on another site, one of the more detailed I could find:

New Orleans Forced Evacuations Loom
Thursday, September 08, 2005

NEW ORLEANS — More stragglers seemed willing to flee the filthy water and stench of death Thursday as increasingly insistent rescuers made what may be their last peaceful pass through swamped New Orleans (search) before using force.

"Some are finally saying, 'I've had enough," said U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (search) spokesman Michael Keegan. "They're getting dehydrated. They are running out of food. There are human remains in different houses. The smells mess with your psyche."

Across a flooded city where as many as 10,000 holdouts were believed to be stubbornly staying put, police made it clear in orders barked from front porches and through closed doors that they would return — next time, getting tough.

Police said they were 80 percent done with their scan of the city for voluntary evacuees, after which they planned to begin carrying out Mayor Ray Nagin's (search) order to forcibly remove remaining residents from a city filled with disease-carrying water, broken gas lines and rotting corpses.

"The ones who wanted to leave, I would say most of them are out," said Detective Sgt. James Imbrogglio. "There may be a few left, so we're going to go check one of our last areas that's underwater today and then hopefully that will be it."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168857,00.html

I would leave my stuff, reluctantly, but not my dogs, ever. But, as I said, I heard last night that evacuees can now bring their pets with them and the government is now authorized to rescue pets. Too little, too late, IMHO, since many people would have evacuated earlier, if they could have brought their pets with him. I even sent an e-mail to FEMA director Michael Brown, on the subject.

And it's not cut and dried, but just very sad. I'm just grateful that I'm not in this terrible situation. The fact that so many have died is the most frightening of all. As for your dogs, I totally understand, as well. Goldens are not only beautiful dogs, but very smart. I have two terriers, though have previously had spaniels. And I would never leave them, even at gunpoint. They're my kids, too.


Barney
214 posted on 09/09/2005 7:55:27 PM PDT by Barney1995
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To: brytlea

Well, frankly, you appeared a little dense, so I was trying to make it understandable for you. Houses are fine. Power is on. Water is on. Streets are dry. They have cars, and can get supplies as needed. Diseases aren't a problem for the NG or NOPD (they're not wearing hazmat suits). So why do you want the government to take their guns and force them out?


215 posted on 09/09/2005 7:56:10 PM PDT by MizSterious (Now, if only we could convince them all to put on their bomb-vests and meet in Mecca...)
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To: brytlea
So, I suppose we could just means test this evacuation.

Sounds good to me, as long as that test consists entirely of the following question:
"You have the option of evacuating. If you choose not to evacuate, do you fully understand that you can expect no aid or supplies other than those you can acquire on your own, city services may not be reliably available for the foreseeable future, and you are responsible for your own security, health, and welfare?"

216 posted on 09/09/2005 7:57:36 PM PDT by Antonello
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To: eeriegeno
These idiots were warned beforehand that a hurricane was coming and that they must evacuate.

The hurricane is over.

Their presence has only served to endanger more lives, including their own, during the rescue phase of this disaster.

I have not seen the slightest evidence of that, and you and no one else on this thread has provided that. The evidence that has emerged since the hurricane departed is that it is the authorities that endangered lives, by allowing lawlessness and rampant looting, by the NOPD's abandonment of duty and even engaging in their own looting in the first critical days, by the city government's failure to use available resources, including city and school buses, to evacuate people who wanted refuge, by the city and state's refusal of aid by the Federal government and from private organizations and citizens, by shutting down hotels and driving people onto the streets, by keeping at gunpoint in the city people who were attempting to evacuate on foot, and now by keeping commercial suppliers out of areas that are in fact habitable, if only the authorities would get out of the way, and fulfill their minimal duty, which is to keep public order.

... and remembering that there is no electricity, water, or sewage that is working, exactly where does this fine old lady distribute her bowel droppings? Sanitary, isn't it???

I lived for weeks after the Ice Storm of '98 without power, water, heat, (in the coldest part of a Maine winter)with trees and heavy icicles falling for weeks, onto houses and roads. To travel one drove over downed power lines, which hopefully weren't energized. Flushing the toilet required hauling in water...so you didn't do that too often. You make do. It looks like a lot of people in New Orleans are willing to make do, if only the authorities would let them. As for sewerage, you have cited no information that their sewage systems aren't working...even if their toilets flush to a nonfunctional treatment center, at this point it will hardly make any difference, given the condition of the water. If they had to, and if the police and city administration would let them, they could bring in chemical toilets.

And even if their living conditions aren't ideal, where do you want to put them? Oh, the Astrodorm? Many New Orleaners no doubt feel much safer at home than with the Superdorm evacuees.

Realistically, once people abandon their houses in that city, they should expect to return and find it looted and destroyed, if they are even ever allowed to return.

217 posted on 09/09/2005 7:57:50 PM PDT by MRMEAN (Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of congress;but I repeat myself. Mark Twain)
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To: Happy2BMe

Outside of the two LEOs that shot and killed themselves, I think one was shot since this event started. However, that happens all the time, on good days, in cites where no disaster exists...


218 posted on 09/09/2005 7:58:29 PM PDT by Black Tooth
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To: Happy2BMe

Utah is what? 0.2% black? You gotta think that the blacks there are worrying about all them whites eyeing their every move. They prolly get the willies about how they stick out in the snow. They don't know how to ski or skate, and there's no decent barbeque there. I'd feel out of place there, too.


219 posted on 09/09/2005 7:59:54 PM PDT by ArtyFO
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To: MizSterious

>>>Mosquitos have always been in New Orleans. Always. It's surrounded by swamps, and there are bayous and canals within the city.>>>

No kidding.

Even though the smell can be misleading on some summer days, the bayou and canals are usually swimming with raw sewage and rotting bodies. What part of that difference aren't you getting?


220 posted on 09/09/2005 8:01:45 PM PDT by sandbar
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