Posted on 09/06/2005 5:35:09 AM PDT by pittsburgh gop guy
Exactly. That was their responsibility. Food and water and the SuperDome; FEMA clearly tells them don't count on us for 48 hours.
It wasn't the rules that didn't make sense, it was the decisions made by the Governor of Louisiana and the Mayor of New Orleans that didn't make sense. You choose to blame the "rules", not the "rulers" (i.e. Gov. of LA and Mayor of NO). I respectfully disagree with you. I would never want to allow the President of the United States to supercede the authority of our states' governments, unless they ask the President to do so.
It's easy to sit back now, after the fact, and say that in this particular situation it would have been better for the citizens of LA and NO if the President had taken the authority away from LA. Yet, how can one completely ignore the fact that once you go down this dangerous path, you are opening Pandora's Box?
DUH!!!
NOW---WHY were they so slow please???????
Again----because of the disastrous communication and performance at the state and local levels!
End of story.
mark for later
Let's do; we have laws and regulations for a reason; because we've done it over and over on the east coast. And the way it's done it works.
You don't see any East coast governors standing around waiting to hear from the White House or FEMA to decide what to do to save their state.
And you sure as hell don't catch East Coast governors not returning the president's phone calls for 24 hours.
If you would give us your phone number, we can call you later in the week and you can be in charge of the next storm that's coming.
I'm sure you'd do a perfect job.
You all need to lighten up.
They weren't. Blanco is lazy and imprecise in her speech. To her, "evacuation" includes evacuating people from their homes and into the SuperDome.
Might be useful to keep in mind what the head of USNORTSCOM said about US military preparations:
"USNORTHCOM was prepositioned for response to the hurricane, but as per the National Response Plan, we support the lead federal agency in disaster relief — in this case, FEMA. The simple description of the process is the state requests federal assistance from FEMA which in turn may request assistance from the military upon approval by the president or Secretary of Defense. Having worked the hurricanes from last year as well as Dennis this year, we knew that FEMA would make requests of the military — primarily in the areas of transportation, communications, logistics, and medicine. Thus we began staging such assets and waited for the storm to hit.
The biggest hurdles to responding to the storm were the storm itself — couldn't begin really helping until it passed — and damage assessment — figuring out which roads were passable, where communications and power were out, etc. Military helos began damage assessment and SAR on Tuesday. Thus we had permission to operate as soon as it was possible. We even brought in night SAR helos to continue the mission on Tuesday night.
The President and Secretary of Defense did authorize us to act right away and are not to blame on this end. Yes, we have to wait for authorization, but it was given in a timely manner."
Then we'll just agree to disagree. IMO, demanding absolute power by any grifter who manages to buy an election to the Oval Office is unacceptable due to the potential consequences, which can be easily and accurately projected by looking at recent history combined with human nature. I refuse to demand a future Hitler, Castro, Mussolini, Stalin, Mugabe, Saddam or Chaves running this country to save lives which may never be in danger to begin with....unless from that future Hitler, Castro, Mussolini, Stalin, Mugabe, Saddam or Chaves.
I refuse to subject my children and grandchildren to such probable atrocities just because I thought it might save their life because they were too dependent and brain dead to try saving themselves during some possible, POSSIBLE catastrophe.
Anyone who thinks the government can run your life better than you can should emigrate to DPRNK, Cuba, Venezuela or any of a few dozen other countries where the gubmint makes all the decisions for the citizens. We don't need to turn our own country into yet another one.
Some Reps would have to join with the Dems to impeach. Not going to happen.
The Feds were slow initially because they allowed bureaucratic red tape to hinder the relief effort. The story is far from over.
And round and round we go.
It's easy to sit back and say "Bush should have done more" or "the Feds should have moved faster" after the fact.
However, take a look at what Bush's record over the past five years and tell me that he isn't proactive or motivated to help people in a time of crisis.
Knee-jerk reactions aren't needed here. Take a look at all the factors that caused this and see that NO was a disaster waiting to happen and when the disaster hit, the state and local leaders did nothing to help their citizens. And to take this a step further, it's up to the people of LA and NO to take a little bit of PERSONAL responsibility for their own lives and the lives of their children.
If you live in a city that is built BELOW sea level, and there's a hurricane coming, and you don't have a car, and you can't get a ride out of town, and you can't get to a shelter, and you have half a brain.... go to the store, buy $20 worth of bottled water, some peanut butter, crackers, batteries, and whatever else you may need to make it through a few days without electricity or water.
Damn, I live in PA, at the top of a hill, nowhere near a flood zone but when there's a bad rainstorm or snowstorm coming, I make sure we have enough supplies in the house so that we don't starve if we can't get to the store.
Common-friggin'-sense. If you ignore the threat, you aren't a victim, you're an idiot.
I refuse to subject my children and grandchildren to such probable atrocities just because I thought it might save their life because they were too dependent and brain dead to try saving themselves during some possible, POSSIBLE catastrophe.
Get off your moral high horse. I don't want any of things either nor do they logically follow from what I said. I believe the federal government must act to save the lives of American citizens during a major crisis like Katrina. Bureaucratic fault finding doesn't save lives and is not an acceptable explanation.
Howlin, don't you know we're all wrong? It's Bush's fault because unlike Castro who stood on his little island empire, Bush did not yell at the hurricane to go somewhere else!
I am not prepared to concede, at this early point in the assessment of the local/state/federal response, that the feds were late or short at all. They may have been, and they may not have been. Most in this forum would prefer that no blame be ascribed to anyone at this stage, but that compassion and action go forward to bring as much relief as possible in this situation. It was not the right that started this blame scenario, but it having begun, we cannot retreat from it. I think there are enough unknowns for everyone to hold fire at this point.
It is more difficult to make those comments before the event happened. I did say the Sunday morning that Nagin declared a mandatory evacutation, that we should have sent in military aircraft to evacuate people.
However, take a look at what Bush's record over the past five years and tell me that he isn't proactive or motivated to help people in a time of crisis.
Never said that. We are talking about this crisis. I don't doubt his motivation to help people. He understood the nature of the threat by declaring the whole Gulf Coast a disaster area before the storm hit to facilitate assistance.
If you live in a city that is built BELOW sea level, and there's a hurricane coming, and you don't have a car, and you can't get a ride out of town, and you can't get to a shelter, and you have half a brain.... go to the store, buy $20 worth of bottled water, some peanut butter, crackers, batteries, and whatever else you may need to make it through a few days without electricity or water.
Sure people should be personally responsible. Kids, the infirm, aged, and sick should not be held to that standard. There was also a mindset that this was just another example of the government crying wolf. The last time NO had been hit by a major hurricane was 1969 with Camille. Whatever they did or did not do, they deserve assistance.
Damn, I live in PA, at the top of a hill, nowhere near a flood zone but when there's a bad rainstorm or snowstorm coming, I make sure we have enough supplies in the house so that we don't starve if we can't get to the store. Common-friggin'-sense. If you ignore the threat, you aren't a victim, you're an idiot.
Does that same rationale apply to folks who build there homes on fault lines, e.g., San Andrreas fault?
Agreed, but I do know that the Feds could have alleviated the situations at the Convention Center and the Superdome sooner. They could have also cracked down on the looters and armed thugs who were hampering relief efforts.
This was to be expected. It is unfortunate, but it is an egotistical proclivity of those who have passed the bar to believe that they are competent at all other things. Recent history suggests strongly that the general intelligence of the legal "community"(?) has passed its apogee and is proceeding down the right side of the Bell Curve.
Being aware that the Earl of Chesterfield advised his son to never malign an entire group of of people, lest one make the entire group their enemy, nevertheless lawyers have become so ubiquitous in US society that it is ludicrous to any longer consider them as respected professionals, but as pests. Any lay person would be well served to maintain a healthy mistrust of any lawyer beneath a feigned vernier of respect.
You said: Agreed, but I do know that the Feds could have alleviated the situations at the Convention Center and the Superdome sooner. They could have also cracked down on the looters and armed thugs who were hampering relief efforts.
***
Yes, they could have, just not legally. Once the threshold of requiring the law to be upheld is crossed, all bets are off. When a federal agency can override those in lawful control, the risks are more enormous than a CAT 5 hurricane ever could be.
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