Posted on 07/23/2005 9:39:48 AM PDT by neverdem
bttt
The polling results compiled there are hardly discouraging to those who hold conservative views on immigration.
Majorities,pluralities, or near-pluralities usually support reducing legal immigration, and putting the military on the border if necessary, while they oppose amnesty and feel a bit uneasy about the overall effects of immigration.
More polls are compiled here, but in the interest of full disclosure, I should point out that since it is a site in favor of lower levels of immigration it only lists those generally favorable to that view;
http://www.numbersusa.com/interests/publicop.html
As to your suggestion that we try to present our side in a non-emotional way, free of fringe-wacko spokesmen: Well, do you really think that is the problem? One can go out of their way to be as dispassionate about it as they possibly can, and cover their remarks with all sorts of feel-good platitudes about immigration, but if they put forth that mass immigration is not good for the country, that the costs outweigh the benefits, then they will be demonized. It is simply easier for the Left, and sadly its allies on this issue on the Right (WSJ), to attack and demonize and demagogue people who dare try to give public expression to the popular discontent over immigration than it is to defend mass immigration on its merits, which are few.
You exhibit some of this yourself with the expression, "Anti-immigration crowd." Most people who favor a reduction in legal immigration, and who favors stronger attempts to deal with illegal immigration, and who oppose amnesty, and who suspect that the costs of immigration outweigh the benefits, are in fact not anti-all immigration, as 'anti-immigration' suggests. They are anti-mass immigration and anti-illegal immigration. There is a big difference. So not only is that generally an untrue characterization, but it is often used in an attempt to taint the message by demonizing the messengers. I mean, sure most people who actually hear what Buchanan says about a specific aspect of immigration will probably find themselves agreeing with him, but then again, its Pat Buchanan! Yuck! Right?
As to how we should deal with illegal immigration. First of all, large-scale deportation should not be taken off the table if necessary, but it probably wouldn't be. Removing the incentives and rewards for illegal immigration would convince many to deport themselves and voluntarily return home. I'm not optimistic enough to think we'll every actually do this, but not trying is not the same as being impossible.
Or one of those proverbial "Flying Shiite Monkeys" alluded to earlier...
He forgot to add "and Ibrahiam Cooper can kiss my arse!"
That acetone peroxide (triacetone triperoxide – TATP) explosive is as common as house paint in the terrorists catalog of death and destruction.....it's easier to make than nazi meth and using that as a measure of availability I personally believe that there are lots of suspects. The nice thing about TATP is that most of the murding trash using it die in it's manufacturing and transportation process.
Stay safe !
If this was true, I would support the strategy.
I just can't see that 900 billion Muslims who are not pshysically fighting us, reading about and seeing pictures of their vaporized moon-rock, folding up their turbins, calling it quits and saying "oh nevermind".
I think the result would be 180 degress different.
900 billion --> 900 million
Yikes, correction;
I just can't see that 900 million Muslims who are not physically fighting us, would after reading and seeing pictures of their vaporized moon-rock, fold up their turbins, call it quits, and say "oh nevermind".
My theory about MnJohnnie is that he is a professional Republican and he knows that the immigration issue is bad for the party and wants it to go away. The party wants the hispanic vote and NOTHING is going to get in their way of getting it.
Gee.. did we touch a nerve? Did the poor (American) Muslim's get their collective panties in a wad, because something the average Muslim ACTUALLY CARES ABOUT might be threatened.
I mean, they absolutely could care less about 3000 dead Americans, or the tens of thousands other dead from Muslim terrorists around the world. These dead are simply the infidels .. just like dead pigs or dogs, not people.
(Oh, you say that YOUR Muslim friend isn't like that. Sorry to burst your bubble, if he or she is at all devout, if they read the Koran and worship faithfully, the ARE like that. They also have as much a duty to lie to the infidels - that's YOU - in defending their faith as the Jahaadists have to blow up the infidels churches, schools, men, women, and especially the children.)
They absolutely don't care about their own women and children. The Jahaadist in Iraq use 'em as shields, when not generally treating their women like animals.
No, all they care about is their precious faith, and their holy sites.
Mecca...Medina - Give 'em 24 hours warning (because we DO care about their women and children - more than they do), and nuke both cities until they glow. They'll have to postpone their next pilgrimage for at least 10,000 years, or use radiation suits for the trek. Yes, this is a legitmate threat if there is a NBC (nuc, bio, chem) event in the U.S.A. This is a legitmate threat if Iran does not destory it's nuc production facilities (memo: Add Tehran and a couple of Shiite holy sites to the target mix).
This is about the point some liberal, neo-liberal, or weak-minded if well meaning religious person returns comments on how outraged or sad they are that I'm such a naive or hateful person. So, I'll preempt that now.
The enemy is real, and persistent. They want to destroy Western civilization and particularly, any part that is Jewish, Christian, or American.
The enemy wants to kill you. Correction, they do not just want to kill you, they want to kill your wife and kids, or take them for household slaves. It's written in their holy book (Qur'an), and they live their faith to the fullest in the Middle East, the Sudan, and previously in Afghanistan.
Do not be deceived. Do not be confused. This war is not going away. This war will not end until Islam is vanquished, or the world capitulates becomes a Muslim Caliphate. You, your children, and your grandchildren will fight and win this war, or you will submit to Islam. There is now third choice, because Muslims do not want "peace" in the terms of Western Civilization, i.e. absense of hostilities and conflict. "Peace" to a Muslim is YOUR submission to Islam. They can be beaten, but they will neither surrender or make peace on Western terms.
I regret to inform you that Americans will not make "peace" with Islam. We will blow your ass to hell up, and make Medina and Mecca uninhabited cities of glass unless Islam accepts OUR peace terms. You surrender, you put your swords and guns and Iranian N-bombs in a deep hole in the ground, and you can worship Allah in peace. Otherwise, everything holy about Islam you care about will be gone.
SFS
15,000 Muslims in Denver ?
Are you a member of Norm Coleman's staff?
Those photos you posted are down right weird. It's like something out of a B Hollywood horror movie.
What is the thing they are worshiping? Looks like a cyclops eye.
1) Actively encourage all border patrol to work with the Minutemen; issue statements supporting the efforts of the MM and ANY other citizens who want to help.
2) Find ways to increase communication/liason with the MM, so that if someone spots and illegal, a BP agent can get there quickly.
3) REQUIRE all public entities---schools, hospitals, whoever, to report the presence of an illegal at the soonest possible opportunity. For a hospital, that means the minute you get done in the emergency room or whatever. For a teacher, it means that day.
4) Require all state drivers license bureaurs to deny licenses to ANYONE who cannot produce a valid birth certificate or social security card.
5) Triple the number of border patrol agents.
6) Make knowingly hiring an illegal a felony subject to prison time. Make any third offense of hiring an illegal, knowingly or not, prison time.
7) Increase federal aid to states based on their efficiency and performance in sending illegals back. States doing a good job should be rewarded.
That's just a start. Need more?
"How do you think the few million muslims here in the U.S. would react if we took such an action?"
If they're AMERICANS first, they'll understand... they'll get over it quickly. If they don't, screw 'em.
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