Don’t fall for old straw-man trick(we killed more Iraqis than Saddam, btw)

The Charleston Gazette ^

[hsalaw]

She writes like a second grader. That's probably the "thinking" level of her audience over at DU.

[Darkwolf377]

Ivins mistakes conviction for thought. She "thinks" so therefore, it's the truth.

I love how the woman who has made such hateful comments as others here have noted--holding people under water--gets all cranky about "Show me the offer for therapy!" when everyone knows what Rove was talking about--the "new age" touchy-feely approach of the leftists who wanted "butter not bombs" and "maybe we should battle this with understanding, starting with what we did to make them hate us."

She's displaying dry-drunk paranoia.

[popdonnelly]

Ms. Ivins, much as I hate to inform you of this, I reject your particular concept of patriotism.

[Darkwolf377]

I'm always hearing that we've killed 100,000 Iraqis

And over a million died as a result of the war that happened when Jimmuh Cartah let the shah fall. Ivins never seems to mention that.

[Americanexpat]

Our name has been sullied. I think having our military killed buy terrorists in Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Yemen and having Embassies blown up around the world and standing and doing nothing about it sullied or name a lot more. Having terrorists from Syria, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Yemen, and Palestine hit us relentlessly over the last forty years and then rubbing our faces in it sullied our name. Going after Al Queda, Taliban and other terrorists where they live may not make the rest of the world happy, but I feel pretty damn good about it.

[popdonnelly]

By the way, at what point in Rove's speech did he refer to the Democrats as "unpatriotic"? Ms. Ivins doesn't have to defend her patriotism, if Rove didn't attack it.

[popdonnelly]

"Most leftists believe that all people are kind, generous, gentle folk."

Except for the people who disagree with them, who they regard as Nazis, fascists, and morons.

[oldbrowser]

I think we have created more terrorists than we faced to start with and that our good name has been sullied all over the world.

The terrorists are created by the medrasas that teach them the radical fanaticism of Islam.

They are brainwashed robots that will kill themselves on orders from their religious leaders.

The suicide bombers are not the real enemy, the real enemy is the religious leaders that are creating these fanatics in order to conquer the world.

Freedom of religion is part of our constitution but we need to recognize that this one has become malignant and requires major surgery.

[Cecily]

Well, you know, who can be bothered with all these pesky details about what Saddam did. Certainly not Moolly. She knows that whatever Saddam's failings, George Bush, Dick Cheney, and Rummy are a million times worse.

You really have to marvel at the sheer idiocy of people like Moolly and MoDo. It is a wonder to behold.

[MikeHu]

"Please, I'm not like all the other liberals -- with their inflated sense of their own self-importance. I'm just one of the modest, self-effacing good guys -- just like you people. If you want me to, I'll name names. I'll betray all my liberal friends before they betray me. A person's got to eat, and I've got to eat well, off of all the Americans I've betrayed. Please, please, I'm not like all those other hypocritical liberals -- selling out all their friends, relatives, neighbors so I could be the Great American Idol telling all you little people the way it is. Please, just trust me this one last time and you won't regret it."

"What knife behind my back?"

[Frank_2001]

LOL!:)

[Zacs Mom]

Under Saddam's orders over 100,000 Kurdish civilians ''disappeared'' in 1988 alone, in a space of just three to four months "

You ought to direct this leftist person to read the Amnesty International Iraqi Human Rights Committee Briefing of 1997. It will give them a glimpse into what life (and death) was really like in Iraq under Saddam rule.

If this person takes the time to read this report, among a great many other atrocities, they will see that "Since the early 1980s hundreds of thousands of people have ''disappeared'' in Iraq, and their fate and whereabouts remain unknown to this date. The victims include a wide variety of people and groups: Kurds, Arabs, Turcomans, Assyrians; Sunni and Shi'a Muslims, Christians and others; men, women and children; members of prohibited political parties and their families; military personnel and deserters; disaffected members of the ruling elite; Iraqi nationals returning from abroad to benefit from officially-declared amnesties and others.

Since this person seems so intent on vilifing the US actions you might want to provide them with this opportunity to come grips with the grizzly reality of Saddam's Iraq ~ which included the use of chemical weapons on women and children

According to the Human Rights Watch/Middle East "at least fifty thousand rural Kurds ... died in Anfal alone, and very possibly the real figure was twice that number ... All told, the total number of Kurds killed over the decade since the Barzani men were taken from their homes is well into six figures." "On the basis of extensive interviews in Kurdistan and perusal of extant Iraqi documents, Shoresh Resoul, a meticulous Kurdish researcher ... conservatively estimated that 'between 60,000 and 110,000' died during [al-]Majid's Kurdish mandate," i.e., beginning shortly before Anfal and ending shortly afterwards. (Randal, After Such Knowledge ..., p. 214.) Other Kurdish estimates are even higher. "When Kurdish leaders met with Iraqi government officials in the wake of the spring 1991 uprising, they raised the question of the Anfal dead and mentioned a figure of 182,000 -- a rough extrapolation based on the number of destroyed villages. Ali Hassan al-Majid reportedly jumped to his feet in a rage when the discussion took this turn. 'What is this exaggerated figure of 182,000?' he is said to have asked. 'It couldn't have been more than 100,000' -- as if this somehow mitigated the catastrophe that he and his subordinates had visited on the Iraqi Kurds." (Iraq's Crime of Genocide, pp. 14, 230.)

[solo gringo]

Molly Irvin's is a low class idiot.Only some one with an I Q of a tortoise would believe her