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Joking Pilots in Commuter Jet Crash Wanted to 'have a Little Fun' by Climbing to 41,000 Feet
AP ^ | AP-ES-06-13-05 1117EDT

Posted on 06/13/2005 8:45:15 AM PDT by TheOtherOne

Joking Pilots in Commuter Jet Crash Wanted to 'have a Little Fun' by Climbing to 41,000 Feet

By Leslie Miller Associated Press Writer
Published: Jun 13, 2005 WASHINGTON (AP) - Two pilots, in a jovial mood as they flew an empty commuter jet, wanted to "have a little fun" by taking the plane to an unusually high altitude last October, only to realize as the engines failed that they were not going to make it, according to transcripts released Monday.

The plane, which the two were ferrying from Little Rock, Ark. to Minneapolis, crashed and both Capt. Jesse Rhodes and First Officer Peter Cesarz perished.

The cockpit voice recording, released by the National Transportation Safety Board at the start of a three-day hearing into the Oct. 14, 2004 accident, revealed how the pilots cracked jokes and decided to "have a little fun" and fly to 41,000 feet - the maximum altitude for their 50-seat plane. Most commuter jets fly at lower altitudes.

"Man, we can do it, 41-it," said Cesarz at 9:48 p.m. A minute later, Rhodes said, "40 thousand, baby."

Two minutes later, "There's 41-0, my man," Cesarz said. "Made it, man."

At 9:52 p.m., one of the pilots popped a can of Pepsi and they joked about drinking beer. A minute later, Cesarz said, "This is the greatest thing, no way."

But at 10:03 p.m., the pilots reported their engine had failed. Five minutes later, they said both engines had failed and they wanted a direct route to any airport.

The transcript recounts their increasingly desperate efforts to restart the engines and regain altitude. They tried to land at the Jefferson City, Mo., airport but by 10:14 p.m., it was obvious they wouldn't reach it.

"We're not going to make it, man. We're not going to make it," Cesarz said. The plane crashed in a residential neighborhood of Jefferson City. No one was injured on the ground.

Accident investigators are examining how well the pilots were trained - a key safety question as the number of regional jets keeps growing.

The crash involved a Bombardier regional jet plane operated by Pinnacle Airlines, an affiliate of Northwest Airlines. Like many regional carriers, Pinnacle is growing rapidly as it teams up with a traditional network airline looking to offer more seats to more places.

Memphis, Tenn.-based Pinnacle grew by 700 percent in the past five years, according to Phil Reed, its marketing vice president. During that time, it switched its fleet from propeller-driven planes to small turbojets, known as regional jets, or RJs.

The number of regional jets rose to 1,630 last year from 570 in 2000, the Federal Aviation Administration says. The question of whether government safety inspectors can keep up with such rapid changes in the airline industry was raised last week in a Transportation Department inspector general's report.

Jet engines work differently at higher altitudes, and it's unclear whether the relatively inexperienced Pinnacle pilots were aware that they had to be more careful in the thin air at 41,000 feet, the maximum altitude for their plane.

According to FAA transcripts of air-to-ground conversations, an air traffic controller in Kansas City told the two pilots it was rare to see the plane flying that high.

"Yeah, we're actually ... we don't have any passengers on board, so we decided to have a little fun and come up here," one of the pilots said. The transcripts don't identify whether Jesse Rhodes or Cesarz made the statement.

First one, then the other engine shut down. The last contact that controllers had with the crew was at 9,000 feet, when the pilot reported an airport beacon in sight.

At the hearing, NTSB investigators plan to delve into the plane's flight limits and the proper recovery techniques when engines fail. They also want to know if the pilots knew those procedures and to learn the engine's performance characteristics at high altitudes.

On June 2, the FAA issued a special bulletin clarifying what steps pilots need to take to restart an engine when there's a dual engine failure, agency spokeswoman Laura Brown said.

David Stempler, president of the Air Travelers Association, said the issue may be reckless pilots rather than inadequate training or improper recovery procedures.

"This is more a story of pilots having time on their hands and playing with things in the cockpit that they shouldn't," he said.

Flying, he said, is as boring as truck driving most of the time.

"This was boredom and experimentation, these guys experimenting with things they had no business doing," Stempler said.

---

On the Net:

National Transportation Safety Board: http://www.ntsb.gov

AP-ES-06-13-05 1117EDT


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: faa; holdmuhbeer; pilot; plane; planecrash
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To: Hildy

Its all good fun, Hildy.


161 posted on 06/13/2005 1:43:07 PM PDT by Pukin Dog (The only thing a man should moisturize is a woman.)
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To: Hildy
I can't believe there are people here that think this is funny. Shame on you.

Not funny. Just stupid and senseless.

162 posted on 06/13/2005 1:44:00 PM PDT by Maceman (The Qur'an is Qur'ap.)
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To: Tennessee_Bob

Hey TN Bob,
I was a mx officer on F-16s at Hahn AB from '87-'89. Where did you work on them?


163 posted on 06/13/2005 1:49:18 PM PDT by go-dubya-04
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To: go-dubya-04

Nellis AFB - 1984 - 1994. Pretty much home stationed there, ended up on prototypes which was pretty cool.


164 posted on 06/13/2005 1:55:45 PM PDT by Tennessee_Bob (The Crew Chief's Toolbox: A roll around cabinet full of specialists.)
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To: safisoft
They very easily could have panicked (AFTER even getting one engine restarted, or only started it - then lost it again as they tried to power it up/restart the second )....

Assume they were "trained" in double-engine failure/engine-restart procedures, would they have really seriously practiced all the steps any time recently?

Are those type of extreme emergency procedures "required drills" for an annual re-cert exam?

165 posted on 06/13/2005 2:04:52 PM PDT by Robert A Cook PE (-I contribute to FR monthly, but ABBCNNBCBS supports Hillary's Secular Sexual Socialism every day.)
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To: Maceman

Yes, extremely senseless and very sad.


166 posted on 06/13/2005 2:11:54 PM PDT by Hildy ( The reason a dog has so many friends is that he wags his tail instead of his tongue)
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To: Dead Dog
During a scheduled 07:45 departure from Little Rock to Minneapolis, an Indicating Crew Alerting System (ICAS) message stating "R 14th duct" occurred during take-off and the flight crew aborted the take-off and returned to the gate. Two mechanics replaced the 14th stage bleed air-sensing loop on the right engine and tested the system. At the end of the day the aircraft was to be repositioned to Minneapolis.

The RegionalJet departed Little Rock at 21:21 and started climbing to FL410. At approximately 21:52, the flight crew acknowledged to Kansas City Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC) that they were at FL410.

Then the stick shaker and stick pusher activated several times before the airplane entered an aerodynamic stall. Almost simultaneously, both engines shut down. The air-driven generator was automatically deployed and supplied the backup alternating current power to the airplane. At about 21:54, the flight crew asked for a lower altitude. and declared an emergency. At about 21:59 the flight crew requested an altitude of 13,000 feet. At 22:08, the flight crew stated that they had a double engine failure and that they wanted a direct route to any airport. Kansas City ARTCC directed the flight to Jefferson City Airport. At about 22:13, the flight crew stated that they had the runway approach end in sight. The airplane did not make it to the airport and crashed and broke up in a residential area. about two miles from the airport. A large fire erupted.

167 posted on 06/13/2005 2:17:35 PM PDT by raygun
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To: Dashing Dasher; Pukin Dog
Yeah - but is he cute?

Come on? He was a Swabbie! Cute like an old toad. I mean, how cute can a pukin dog be?

168 posted on 06/13/2005 2:31:01 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!; Pukin Dog

My buddy, Two Dogs F!@#$NG, is a hunk...

You can never tell by callsigns alone.


169 posted on 06/13/2005 2:33:55 PM PDT by Dashing Dasher (To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of FReepers...)
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To: Dashing Dasher
He must be an Indian, right? ;-)

I should clarify. Pukin Dog is an OLD Swabbie.

170 posted on 06/13/2005 2:36:46 PM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: Alas Babylon!

He was named by Indians.

Pukin can't be older than 60 - or he'd be riding side saddle or sitting out the next dance - right!?


171 posted on 06/13/2005 2:38:00 PM PDT by Dashing Dasher (To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of FReepers...)
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To: Alas Babylon!

Whoa! A Senior Master Sergeant - I better behave.


Although....it never stopped me before.... ;)


My dad was at the Mountain - but he was there a couple years before you were. That was a neat assignment - the Springs are still one of the prettiest places I've ever lived.


172 posted on 06/13/2005 2:39:39 PM PDT by Tennessee_Bob (The Crew Chief's Toolbox: A roll around cabinet full of specialists.)
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To: SkyPilot; Tijeras_Slim; FireTrack; Pukin Dog; citabria; B Knotts; kilowhskey; cyphergirl; ...

173 posted on 06/13/2005 2:53:11 PM PDT by Aeronaut (2 Chronicles 7:14.)
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To: raygun
Then the stick shaker and stick pusher activated several times before the airplane entered an aerodynamic stall.

Well now...that is interesting. Coffin Corner (or at least one edge of it) at Service Ceiling. High Altitude, high subsonic stuff is just theory to me...but this seems odd..still. Absolute ceiling, sure, Service Ceiling...I don't know.

174 posted on 06/13/2005 3:02:04 PM PDT by Dead Dog
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To: Alas Babylon!

Excuse me, but I am 47 years old.


175 posted on 06/13/2005 3:04:45 PM PDT by Pukin Dog (The only thing a man should moisturize is a woman.)
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To: raygun
At about 21:54, the flight crew asked for a lower altitude. and declared an emergency. At about 21:59 the flight crew requested an altitude of 13,000 feet. At 22:08, the flight crew stated that they had a double engine failure and that they wanted a direct route to any airport.

So it took them 14 minutes after having a total flameout and declaring an emergency for these bozos to start heading for an airport.

When I did my multi-engine training, it was a bit surprising that the assumption was that you could almost always get the airplane to fly somewhere, if you only performed the right checklist. Seems like these guys should have asked to be routed toward an airport right off, and if they got it fired up later, then continue on.

176 posted on 06/13/2005 3:15:36 PM PDT by narby (Ignorance is God’s gift to Kansas.)
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To: Pukin Dog

You look younger.

;-)


177 posted on 06/13/2005 3:35:38 PM PDT by Dashing Dasher (To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of FReepers...)
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To: narby

"Make before Break"


178 posted on 06/13/2005 4:02:52 PM PDT by Dead Dog
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To: SkyPilot

Perhaps they were too nervous to drop the nose to pick up enough airspeed?

Maybe they thought they should conserve altitude, etc. Who knows? I do find it telling that the last communication was at 9000 ft. It means they were probably panicking, and their brains were going around in circles.

I'm no pilot, but I have spent a lot of time around planes, and I know that In aviation, panic is a surer way to die than nearly anything else.


179 posted on 06/13/2005 4:25:17 PM PDT by rlmorel
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To: Cvengr
AGL or ASL?...Ooooops!

LOL! I always getting those mixed-up...not fer long. :D

180 posted on 06/13/2005 5:18:51 PM PDT by skinkinthegrass (Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you :^)
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