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Creationism: God's gift to the ignorant (Religion bashing alert)
Times Online UK ^ | May 21, 2005 | Richard Dawkins

Posted on 05/25/2005 3:41:22 AM PDT by billorites

Science feeds on mystery. As my colleague Matt Ridley has put it: “Most scientists are bored by what they have already discovered. It is ignorance that drives them on.” Science mines ignorance. Mystery — that which we don’t yet know; that which we don’t yet understand — is the mother lode that scientists seek out. Mystics exult in mystery and want it to stay mysterious. Scientists exult in mystery for a very different reason: it gives them something to do.

Admissions of ignorance and mystification are vital to good science. It is therefore galling, to say the least, when enemies of science turn those constructive admissions around and abuse them for political advantage. Worse, it threatens the enterprise of science itself. This is exactly the effect that creationism or “intelligent design theory” (ID) is having, especially because its propagandists are slick, superficially plausible and, above all, well financed. ID, by the way, is not a new form of creationism. It simply is creationism disguised, for political reasons, under a new name.

It isn’t even safe for a scientist to express temporary doubt as a rhetorical device before going on to dispel it.

“To suppose that the eye with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree.” You will find this sentence of Charles Darwin quoted again and again by creationists. They never quote what follows. Darwin immediately went on to confound his initial incredulity. Others have built on his foundation, and the eye is today a showpiece of the gradual, cumulative evolution of an almost perfect illusion of design. The relevant chapter of my Climbing Mount Improbable is called “The fortyfold Path to Enlightenment” in honour of the fact that, far from being difficult to evolve, the eye has evolved at least 40 times independently around the animal kingdom.

The distinguished Harvard geneticist Richard Lewontin is widely quoted as saying that organisms “appear to have been carefully and artfully designed”. Again, this was a rhetorical preliminary to explaining how the powerful illusion of design actually comes about by natural selection. The isolated quotation strips out the implied emphasis on “appear to”, leaving exactly what a simple-mindedly pious audience — in Kansas, for instance — wants to hear.

The deceitful misquoting of scientists to suit an anti-scientific agenda ranks among the many unchristian habits of fundamentalist authors. But such Telling Lies for God (the book title of the splendidly pugnacious Australian geologist Ian Plimer) is not the most serious problem. There is a more important point to be made, and it goes right to the philosophical heart of creationism.

The standard methodology of creationists is to find some phenomenon in nature which Darwinism cannot readily explain. Darwin said: “If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down.” Creationists mine ignorance and uncertainty in order to abuse his challenge. “Bet you can’t tell me how the elbow joint of the lesser spotted weasel frog evolved by slow gradual degrees?” If the scientist fails to give an immediate and comprehensive answer, a default conclusion is drawn: “Right, then, the alternative theory; ‘intelligent design’ wins by default.”

Notice the biased logic: if theory A fails in some particular, theory B must be right! Notice, too, how the creationist ploy undermines the scientist’s rejoicing in uncertainty. Today’s scientist in America dare not say: “Hm, interesting point. I wonder how the weasel frog’s ancestors did evolve their elbow joint. I’ll have to go to the university library and take a look.” No, the moment a scientist said something like that the default conclusion would become a headline in a creationist pamphlet: “Weasel frog could only have been designed by God.”

I once introduced a chapter on the so-called Cambrian Explosion with the words: “It is as though the fossils were planted there without any evolutionary history.” Again, this was a rhetorical overture, intended to whet the reader’s appetite for the explanation. Inevitably, my remark was gleefully quoted out of context. Creationists adore “gaps” in the fossil record.

Many evolutionary transitions are elegantly documented by more or less continuous series of changing intermediate fossils. Some are not, and these are the famous “gaps”. Michael Shermer has wittily pointed out that if a new fossil discovery neatly bisects a “gap”, the creationist will declare that there are now two gaps! Note yet again the use of a default. If there are no fossils to document a postulated evolutionary transition, the assumption is that there was no evolutionary transition: God must have intervened.

The creationists’ fondness for “gaps” in the fossil record is a metaphor for their love of gaps in knowledge generally. Gaps, by default, are filled by God. You don’t know how the nerve impulse works? Good! You don’t understand how memories are laid down in the brain? Excellent! Is photosynthesis a bafflingly complex process? Wonderful! Please don’t go to work on the problem, just give up, and appeal to God. Dear scientist, don’t work on your mysteries. Bring us your mysteries for we can use them. Don’t squander precious ignorance by researching it away. Ignorance is God’s gift to Kansas.

Richard Dawkins, FRS, is the Charles Simonyi Professor of the Public Understanding of Science, at Oxford University. His latest book is The Ancestor’s Tale


TOPICS: Culture/Society
KEYWORDS: biblethumpers; cary; creation; crevolist; dawkins; evolution; excellentessay; funnyresponses; hahahahahahaha; liberalgarbage; phenryjerkalert; smegheads
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To: Right Wing Professor

"Could you explain to me how Behe's research, which has largely been on the physical chemistry of DNA, shows that species did not evolve from each other?"

I wasn't saying that this is what Behe's research shows. As you are no doubt aware, his work is more related to the structure and operation of sub-cellular organelles.

However, if you are expert in this field, perhaps you can answer a question which I have wondered about for a long time?

Why does a group of 3 nucleotides, when read by a ribosome, encode for a particular amino acid?


221 posted on 05/25/2005 9:51:07 AM PDT by Tantumergo
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To: Sun Soldier

I'm kind of a Pariah on these threads, which is why I am not often on them. My crimes?

1) I make a distinction between "Origins" (of the universe) and "Evolution" (an observable phenomena arising from the interaction of genetics, reproduction and living things with their environment).
2) I am also comfortable with the many aspects of God's message to us. Some of the Bible is historical fact, some literature, some biographical, some poetry -- It is filled with declarations, symbols, and allegory.

The nature of what God shared first with the Jews, then later the rest of the world and the nature of God leads me to believe that any of it is possible. That is, the 18 billion year old universe and spontaneous generation of life is possible and so is the 6,000 year old world with a 6 day creation.

I am comfortable in admitting that I do not everything, which is the most terrible crime of all on these threads, where both sides have every answer and the individual adherents on both sides know everything. And are not shy about telling how much they know and how stupid everyone that disagrees with them is.


222 posted on 05/25/2005 9:52:23 AM PDT by L,TOWM (Liberals, The Other White Meat [Born in California, Texan by the Grace of God.])
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To: All
It's probably too late in the thread, but we have some newbies to these evolution debates, so here's some information (which most creationists will probably ignore):
The scientific method. Exhaustive discussion.
What's a Scientific Theory? Encyclopedia article.
How to argue against a scientific theory.
The Theory of Evolution. Excellent introductory encyclopedia article.
Introduction to Evolutionary Biology. Another good introduction.
Is Evolution Science? It certainly is. Here's why.

All of that, and loads more, is here
The List-O-Links. Direct link to the right part of my homepage.

Another service of
Darwin Central
The conspiracy that cares

223 posted on 05/25/2005 9:55:19 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas. The List-O-Links is at my homepage.)
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To: donh
They were not tortured by hiding some great secret. Just the opposite, they saw history, spread what they saw and were punished for it.

Were they insane and tortured for a lie or did they believe what they saw with their own two eyes and communicated loudly in fear of death?

Also that "conspiracy" sure did spread. First 300 years of persecution and the "conspiracy" still survived? Must have been a lot of insane people be willingly tortured to death for a lie then.
224 posted on 05/25/2005 9:56:41 AM PDT by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians)
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To: Bluchers Elephant

You're right. It illustrates how the swipe at Kansans detracts from the message of the article.


225 posted on 05/25/2005 9:57:09 AM PDT by LiberationIT
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To: ArGee
Here is the only thing I found in post #63 that even approximates a suggestion for a fruitful research project:

The first task of ID is to define the characteristics of something that was designed vs. something that wasn't. This would provide the basis for discussion.

But, I am afraid that the specifics of my research project are not quite delineated yet. As far as I can tell, everything in the living world was, in some sense or another "designed" to serve some purpose. I'm afraid you will have to be more specific, or I will be unable to write my grant proposal.

226 posted on 05/25/2005 9:57:54 AM PDT by donh
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To: ArGee
Considering that it was faith that gave us science and technology as we know them today I would have to disagree.

Oooookay... I guess that's why they forced Galileo to recant the scientific theory that the Earth revolves around the Sun instead of vice versa, under pain of torture.

Furthermore, your claim flies in the face of the actual history of science, but keep believing it if you want to.

227 posted on 05/25/2005 10:00:00 AM PDT by Ichneumon
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To: gibonski

My most liberal college professor was a priest.


228 posted on 05/25/2005 10:00:05 AM PDT by LiberationIT
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To: Tantumergo
s you are no doubt aware, his work is more related to the structure and operation of sub-cellular organelles.

No, I'm not aware of that. Back when Behe was actually doing science, he was looking at the p. chem of DNA. I don't count his popular press and un-peer-reviewed meanderings about flagella.

Why does a group of 3 nucleotides, when read by a ribosome, encode for a particular amino acid?

The recognition anticodon of tRNA is three nucleotides. Each tRNA is specific for one amino acid, and it's what recognizes the codon. Two would be an insufficient number to account for 20 amino acids.

229 posted on 05/25/2005 10:01:22 AM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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To: donh; ArGee
Really? Like what? Suggest a fruitful research project to me.

You're in luck!

ID Research

Additionally, there are ID clubs forming at universities all over the country and more and more scientists are embracing it. Stay tuned for more ID-related research.

Lurkers can go to ARN.org for more info.

230 posted on 05/25/2005 10:02:53 AM PDT by Michael_Michaelangelo (The best theory is not ipso facto a good theory. Lots of links on my homepage...)
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To: L,TOWM
I'm kind of a Pariah on these threads, which is why I am not often on them. My crimes?

1) I make a distinction between "Origins" (of the universe) and "Evolution" (an observable phenomena arising from the interaction of genetics, reproduction and living things with their environment).

2) I am also comfortable with the many aspects of God's message to us. Some of the Bible is historical fact, some literature, some biographical, some poetry -- It is filled with declarations, symbols, and allegory.

Don't delude yourself. Those are not the reasons that you are (allegedly) a "pariah" on these threads. Those two points are true of many of the evolutionists who participate in these threads on a regular basis. (Quick, does the phrase "evolution is not abiogenesis" ring a bell? It's your point #1, a point commonly made by the evolutionists on these threads.)

I am comfortable in admitting that I do not everything, which is the most terrible crime of all on these threads, where both sides have every answer and the individual adherents on both sides know everything.

Now *THIS* is why you may not be welcome on these threads -- we really don't appreciate you telling slanderous lies about us like this. Go find somewhere else to insult the participants with falsehoods.

231 posted on 05/25/2005 10:05:08 AM PDT by Ichneumon
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To: Ichneumon
Oooookay... I guess that's why they forced Galileo to recant the scientific theory that the Earth revolves around the Sun instead of vice versa, under pain of torture.

Point 1, I said "as we know it today" and you bring up Galileo? A lot has happened since then. Additionally, to say that Galileo was forced to recant because of his science is a gross oversimplification.

Point 2, who is the founder of modern taxonomy and what was his faith? Who is the founder of the modern scientific method and what was his faith? Who is the "inventor" of Calculus and what was his faith?

Shalom.

232 posted on 05/25/2005 10:07:57 AM PDT by ArGee (Why do we let the abnormal tell us what's normal?)
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To: Right Wing Professor

"Each tRNA is specific for one amino acid, and it's what recognizes the codon."

Yes, but WHY does a tRNA code for an amino acid? What is there about it that says that this group of nucleotides "means" this amino acid?


233 posted on 05/25/2005 10:13:47 AM PDT by Tantumergo
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To: Michael_Michaelangelo; donh; ArGee
[Really? Like what? Suggest a fruitful research project to me.]

You're in luck! ID Research

Okay, I'll bite -- exactly how (in your own words, please) is that actually "ID research" in any way? That is, how in the hell would the results of that research actually support/disprove any particular ID hypothesis, and/or distinguish it from possible alternative hypotheses? We'll wait. This should be highly amusing -- it's always fun to watch you ID folks play at science without actually understanding the first thing about how it's (properly) done.

Additionally, there are ID clubs forming at universities all over the country

Oh, well then, it *must* be science. And so must those "Lord of the Rings" clubs forming at universities all over the country, I guess.

and more and more scientists are embracing it.

ROFL! You're so cute when you're posting your false presumptions as if they were facts.

Stay tuned for more ID-related research.

What do you mean, "more"?

234 posted on 05/25/2005 10:13:56 AM PDT by Ichneumon
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To: Ichneumon

Did you read just the article or the linked article there?

If you didn't read the linked article, do.

It's bad enough to be funny, and, as I posted on that thread, a serious case of conclusions preceding facts.


235 posted on 05/25/2005 10:18:22 AM PDT by From many - one.
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To: rollo tomasi; donh
Over 500 people observed Christ Resurrection after He died on the cross.

Please support this amazing statement.

Many people who saw and relayed it back were killed.

And this one.

Not quick deaths mind you, but tortured under extreme measures to shut people up.

And this one.

You would think if this was just sacred fiction they would be subdued about the subject or even keep it a secret.

No, I wouldn't think that.

Either they were telling the truth by using the observation and their experience of empirical evidence by their 5 senses or they were just insane, thus implying every Christian is insane.

Class, this is a marvelous example of the "fallacy of the false dichotomy". The number of alternative explanations which the author has overlooked is left as an excercise for the reader.

236 posted on 05/25/2005 10:18:51 AM PDT by Ichneumon
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To: Ichneumon
insult the participants with falsehoods

Most of the regular participants do fine on each other.

How many bannings from arrogant know it alls screaming at each other have taken place as a result of these threads? Way too many. Or perhaps not enough in some people's opinion.

It would'nt break my heart to see these threads get killed instantly.

237 posted on 05/25/2005 10:18:56 AM PDT by L,TOWM (Liberals, The Other White Meat [Born in California, Texan by the Grace of God.])
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To: Ichneumon
Just keep your hands over your ears and continue to chant "la-la-la-la-la" as if nothing is happening and there is no paradigm shift afoot. As you and your ilk get too old to punch the keys on your PC anymore and this debate is turned over to the next generation, let's all hope they aren't as bullheaded and rude as the current group of Evo's here at FR. Oh - by the way - did you see the Discovery Institute opened a new field office in DC?

Discovery Institute Opens Office in DC

238 posted on 05/25/2005 10:27:02 AM PDT by Michael_Michaelangelo (The best theory is not ipso facto a good theory. Lots of links on my homepage...)
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To: billorites
The deceitful misquoting of scientists to suit an anti-scientific agenda ranks among the many unchristian habits of fundamentalist authors.

This should say, "...un-Christian..."

239 posted on 05/25/2005 10:27:37 AM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: L,TOWM

Huh? Historical accuracy does not correlate to evidence for the Word of God. It simply means that someone accurately recorded historical events. If he embellishes said events with references to the Almighty, one cannot infer that the Almighty exists. For example, the Greeks and Egyptians were pretty good about making records of just about everything under the Sun. Simply because they peppered their works with references to their gods does not, in any way, corroborate the exitence of those gods.


240 posted on 05/25/2005 10:29:25 AM PDT by Junior (“Even if you are one-in-a-million, there are still 6,000 others just like you.”)
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