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Mother who killed infant son speaks about the tragedy
Morning Sentinel ^ | 11APR05 | GARY REMAL

Posted on 04/16/2005 3:16:48 PM PDT by familyop

Quiet and thoughtful, tall,Êarticulate and neatly dressed, 31-year-old Natachia Ramsey smiles easily and inspires confidence.

But nearly six years ago, overwhelmed with physical and family problems after the birth of her son, distraught and alone in the midst of undiagnosed postpartum depression, Ramsey smothered her 4-week-old baby in his bassinet before attempting to take her own life.

Now, after years of difficult therapy, most while confined at the Augusta Mental Health Institute, Ramsey has been reunited with her older child who was taken into state custody at age 8 shortly after the infant brother's horrific death.

Rescue crews were able to stop Ramsey from bleeding to death in the bathtub of her Searsport mobile home on April 11, 1999, after she made a confused call to a mental-health crisis line.

But they were unable to revive the infant, Hunter. Her older child had been left with Ramsey's estranged husband earlier in the day.

In 2001, a jury ruled that she was insane at the time of the killing and acquitted her of manslaughter. Ramsey was committed to the Augusta state psychiatric hospital.

But in March 2004, a Superior Court judge gave Ramsey permission to live in her own apartment. And last December, District Court Judge John C. Nivison ruled that her elder child, now 12 years old, can live with her.

A statement from court Guardian ad Litem Maureen E. Dillane, approved by Nivison, indicated that officials of the Maine Department of Health and Human Services and Dillane agreed to return the surviving child to Ramsey's home for "trial placement."

"If I had any concerns about what would happen, then my child wouldn't be in my house right now, because I would refuse," Ramsey said in an interview with the Kennebec Journal.

A TROUBLED PAST

In 1999, Ramsey experienced a difficult pregnancy and childbirth. She contracted pneumonia while in the hospital and had to stay longer than expected. She left the hospital sooner than doctors recommended because she felt she was needed at home.

"There's nothing I'm going to be able to tell you about that day that is going to make a lot of sense, because it doesn't make sense to me now," Ramsey said.

On the day Hunter was killed, Ramsey and her husband were living apart. Her husband suspected he was not the boy's father, though paternity tests later proved he was, Ramsey said.

He picked up the couple's older child, then left, leaving her alone with the baby she believed he did not accept.

"When he left, I wanted to die," she said. "Everything was very unclear. I just remember thinking that I couldn't leave Hunter, because I wanted to die and I couldn't leave Hunter because no one was going to care for him. In my mind, that day, there wasn't anyone else that could or would care for him. That he would be alone. And I know that doesn't make sense now. That day it made sense to me. Things made sense that day that do not make sense to me now."

Planning to take her own life, Ramsey said she believed no one would care for her son. And she wanted to be with him.

So, in her confused state, she suffocated the baby while he lay in his bassinet in the bedroom of her Mount Ephraim Road mobile home.

After her son's death, Ramsey was diagnosed with major depression; she takes anti-depressant and anti-anxiety medications to prevent flareups.

Given a family history that includes the suicides of both her mother and maternal grandfather, she believes she probably suffered from depression long before she killed her baby.

"My family is very old Maine, so even after the death of my mother and grandfather there was never any counseling or anything," she said.

"It's taken me many years of therapy and, essentially, permission from therapists in order to feel as though it's OK to miss him.

"Your job as a parent is to protect your children and to keep them safe. In my skewed thinking that day I thought that's what I was doing, keeping him with me and protecting him. For me, anyway, it was a disbelief. How could I do that? Just the feelings of guilt around knowing one of your children is dead.

"One of the things that bothers me always the most is anyone thinking that he wasn't wanted, or I thought he was bad, or anything like that. And I wasn't hearing voices and no one was telling me that he was evil. It was about that moment, it was irrational. It was irrational because I was contemplating suicide."

QUESTIONS FOR STATE

A brief statement issued by Nivison's court indicates that Department of Health and Human Services officials approved plans to return her older child to Ramsey's home.

"Trial placement with the mother was recommended to the court based on the unanimous agreement of all the parties," wrote Maureen E. Dillane, who represented the child in the child-protective proceedings.

Jim LaBrecque -- an advocate for families that have had children removed by state officials and a longtime critic of Maine's child-protective system -- said Nivison's decision raises troubling questions about the equity of treatment of all parents in similar court actions.

LaBrecque said he knows of other cases in which children have been removed permanently from their families for far less serious abuses than the death of a child.

"Just about every case is less heinous than (Ramsey's)," LaBrecque said. "There are many cases where parents' rights are terminated from ever seeing their children again for the simplest things, like one slap across the face. This all boils down to the department's position and whether or not they like the parent."

Department spokesman Michael Norton declined to explain the agency's position in Ramsey's case, citing confidentiality laws.

Since Hunter's death, Ramsey has received intensive psychological treatment. She still takes medication for recurrent major depression. Ramsey also decided to avoid a recurrence of postpartum depression by voluntarily undergoing sterilization.

"Not knowing before about postpartum depression or that I could get sick, I had no way of really knowing what could happen," she said.

"But then you become aware and you become educated and you have choices to make, and my choice was to have a tubal ligation to prevent the possibility of ever becoming severely postpartum. Weighing all the options and knowing how important my child is to me, I made the choice of being the best parent I could be, and that was to not allow the possibility of having more kids."

RAMSEY'S LEGAL PROCESS

Ramsey was indicted on a charge of murder, but a plea bargain reduced the charge to manslaughter while allowing her to use an insanity defense before a jury that subsequently acquitted her because of her mental condition.

Between 2001 -- when a jury found her not guilty by reason of insanity -- and early 2004, courts granted Ramsey incremental increases in her freedom. Although acknowledging her progress, judges have yet to fully release Ramsey from state custody.

In December, Superior Court Justice S. Kirk Studstrup further reduced her restrictions, giving her virtually unlimited use of her car and unsupervised time in the community. But he also continued to ban nonprescribed drugs or alcohol and required Ramsey to return to Riverview Psychiatric Center at least once every 14 days.

Assistant Attorney General Fernand R. LaRochelle, who prosecuted Ramsey and followed her case through the courts, said prosecutors have watched her progress closely.

LaRochelle said Ramsey has responded well to treatment.

"I'm not aware of any situation in which she has caused (her treatment team) any reason for serous concern," LaRochelle said. "Some people progress at a much faster rate than others."

POSTPARTUM DISCORD

While Ramsey's use of the insanity defense in the death of her baby, and the return of her elder child, may raise questions in Maine, the laws in a number of other countries regularly treat women with postpartum depression who kill infant children more leniently than women in similar circumstances in the United States.

Increasingly, women who kill their children in severe bouts of postpartum depression or psychosis are being given treatment rather than jail time. But, in some states, women are still serving long prison sentences or may even face the death penalty for killing their young children.

Michelle Oberman, a Santa Clara University School of Law professor and author with Cheryl L. Meyer of "Mothers Who Kill Their Children: Understanding the Acts of Moms from Susan Smith to the 'Prom Mom,' " said many countries put postpartum killings in a special category of crime, requiring a guilty plea but then mandating treatment, probation or short prison sentences.

"About 17 or 18 countries around the world follow the British common law, which began in 1922, in cases where a mother kills a child under the age of 1," Oberman said.

The greatest threat posed by these women comes if they become pregnant or once again give birth, Oberman said.

"Assuming (Ramsey) has an appropriately set-up team monitoring her, it's hard to believe she would be at risk and certainly not to her 12-year-old. The only exception would be if she got pregnant again," Oberman said.

Psychiatrist Deborah Sichel, a former Harvard Medical School instructor and author of "Women's Moods: What Every Woman Must Know About Hormones, the Brain and Emotional Health," said Ramsey's apparent history of depression is typical of women who suffer the most severe cases of postpartum depression or psychosis.

Research on the small minority of women who behave violently toward their children after pregnancy often reveals past problems, she said.

Accurate diagnosis and treatment by specially trained professionals is necessary for successful recovery and to prevent future harm.

But Sichel cautioned that other forms of anxiety or stress can bring on further problems.

"Having a 12-year-old child calls for very close followup," she said. "It doesn't preclude her from having her child back, but it does need careful supervision."

Maine has experienced few cases such as Ramsey's, in which a mother kills her children after giving birth.

Her case recalls that of another Maine mother, Constance M. Fisher, who drowned her three young children in the family's bathtub in Waterville in 1954.

A Kennebec County grand jury refused to indict her. She was treated and bore three more children, drowning them in her Fairfield home in 1966 when they were almost exactly the same ages. She later took her own life while at AMHI.

High-profile cases in other states include that of Andrea Yates, a Texas woman accused of drowning her five children in a bathtub in 2001.

Yates was sentenced to life in prison, although her conviction was overturned in January by a Texas appeals court because a state witness may have presented false testimony.

In 2000, Texas mother Christina Riggs was granted her request to be executed by lethal injection for drugging and smothering her 2-year-old daughter and 5-year-old son in 1997 before attempting her own suicide. She was the fifth woman to be executed in the United States since the 1976 reinstatement of the death penalty.

In Fisher's time, doctors knew less about identifying postpartum depression or its treatment, Ramsey said. Today, professional help and new medications can reduce symptoms earlier if identified.

Ramsey encouraged women who suffer depression after childbirth to reach out for that help.

"This doesn't mean you're an ogre or a monster, which I think regardless is how" women in her position may be perceived by the public, Ramsey said.

LONG ACQUITTAL PROCESS

Judges worried about the safety of the Maine public are slow to relinquish court control over anyone acquitted of a crime because of insanity.

Ramsey hopes that will change.

"There are some people who will never come out from under the commissioner because there's always a sense that they want to continue monitoring. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be living out in the community and having the best life they're able to have, it just means that they want to be able keep an eye on them and bring them back into the hospital if need be," Ramsey said.

"I had a wonderful psychiatrist. But at the same time, I think that there are examples of people who have been within the system for 15 years for stealing a six-pack of beer that really have been institutionalized and should have been out a long time ago."

Although Ramsey has yet to be fully released from state oversight, Ramsey's attorney, John D. Pelletier, said both Studstrup and Nivison were aware of each other's actions and the return of Ramsey's child.

Ramsey is convinced that today she would be able to recognize the onset of psychological problems in time to reach out for help.

"I have a very large support system. Six years ago, when I became very sick, I didn't know I was becoming sick," Ramsey said.

"The person I was a decade ago is not the same person I am today. I wanted to be a better parent. I wanted to be a better person. And I wanted to lead a better life.

"So I've spent six years working really hard in therapy to do all those things.

"The average person reading this article isn't going to know me and isn't going to know this, they're not going to understand and I'm sure there's a majority of people who are going to say I'm a monster," she said.

"There were many parties involved and (the child returned only) after careful consideration. This was not a willy-nilly decision," Ramsey said.

"The only thing I can tell you is that I love my child."


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Maine
KEYWORDS: domestic; feminism; feminist; filicide; postpartum; propaganda; violence
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The poor mother is a victim or maybe even a heroine (sarcasm, irony). Oh...so sorry--hero.
1 posted on 04/16/2005 3:16:48 PM PDT by familyop
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To: familyop

Well she dresses neat and at 12 the girl has a better chance of survival by fighting her mother off when she comes in with her pillow..


2 posted on 04/16/2005 3:20:54 PM PDT by sgtbono2002
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To: familyop

Whether or not a person is mentally ill, mentally handicapped or whatever, they should still be held accountable for their actions. Life in a highly secure mental health facility could be an alternative to prison.


3 posted on 04/16/2005 3:29:29 PM PDT by MisterRepublican
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To: familyop

Why is this woman still speaking ?


4 posted on 04/16/2005 3:31:19 PM PDT by festus (The constitution may be flawed but its a whole lot better than what we have now.)
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To: familyop
Let's see ... PMS allows them to be total biatches. Post-partum depression allows them to murder their BORN children, while "choice" allows them to murder the unborn ones. Multiple-personality disorder, repressed memory syndrome, and battered wife complex allows them to murder their husbands.

It's good to be the queen.

5 posted on 04/16/2005 3:47:00 PM PDT by IronJack
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To: IronJack

Years ago 20/20 with Hugh Downs ran a story from the UK that said exactly that. Women in the UK cannot be prosecuted for murder of their less than one year old children citing post-parum depression. And of course 20/20 spun that as a good thing.

6 posted on 04/16/2005 3:54:59 PM PDT by StACase
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To: IronJack
"It's good to be the queen."

Now. Leftists understand that in order to divide the family against itself it is necessary not to have equal rights, but rather to treat women as a moral proletarians.

You see, women are much like any of a number of groups the Left claims to speak for. And always the rationale is the same: They aren't responsible because culture or biology or capitalist exploitation is. Meanwhile, when it comes to whitey he's the only one who gets the blame.

7 posted on 04/16/2005 4:04:24 PM PDT by Reactionary
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To: familyop

babycide ping


8 posted on 04/16/2005 4:13:34 PM PDT by silverleaf (Fasten your seat belts- it's going to be a BUMPY ride.)
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To: familyop

Perversely, when I read of these murder-suicides (attempted, in this case), I always find myself wishing the perp had reversed the order.

Not my first wish, you understand.

Dan


9 posted on 04/16/2005 4:15:27 PM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
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To: familyop
The first thing I'd like to know is if this story happened in any particular state, country or hemisphere. Why FReepers can't post at least a general location somewhere in the title or article is a mystery.

Secondly...

distraught and alone in the midst of undiagnosed postpartum depression,

Almost 99.99 percent of mothers experience post partum depression without killing our infants. That's how 99.99 percent of us lived, despite our mothers who just had a baby and feel alone.

10 posted on 04/16/2005 4:25:16 PM PDT by PistolPaknMama (Will work for cool tag line.)
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To: BibChr

Anybody who believes that taking psychotropics makes mental cases normal is just wrong.


11 posted on 04/16/2005 4:31:04 PM PDT by ClaireSolt (.)
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To: PistolPaknMama
"The first thing I'd like to know is if this story happened in any particular state, country or hemisphere. Why FReepers can't post at least a general location somewhere in the title or article is a mystery."

See under "topics," above.
12 posted on 04/16/2005 4:31:05 PM PDT by familyop ("Let us try" sounds better, don't you think? "Essayons" is so...Roman.)
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To: Reactionary

"All struggles are class struggles," according to Marx. Women are a useful gender "class" which can be pitted against the male bourgeoisie. The family, after all, is just a relic of the bourgeois power structure, an economic construct designed to serve the capitalist overlords.


13 posted on 04/16/2005 4:40:36 PM PDT by IronJack
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To: IronJack
"All struggles are class struggles," according to Marx. Women are a useful gender "class" which can be pitted against the male bourgeoisie. The family, after all, is just a relic of the bourgeois power structure, an economic construct designed to serve the capitalist overlords.

Indeed. And the clever Leftists always play the game of dialetic. They expand the notion of rights to undermine them, just as they expand the notion of family to destroy it as an institution.

14 posted on 04/16/2005 4:50:29 PM PDT by Reactionary
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To: familyop

I believe what was stated in the article was that nobody was expected to actually understand unless you had experienced it yourself. She sat through a jury of her peers who found her NCR and she hasn't asked for your sympathy and if you had actually read the side bar in the newspaper article instead of just the "blog" posted here you would have read she was essentially forced into the interview by the reporter(s) involved. If she hadn't interviewed the newspaper wouldn't have agreed not to use the location, gender or childs name.
May none of you have to ever walk a mile in her shoes. I don't think you'd make it ten steps.


15 posted on 04/29/2005 9:11:56 AM PDT by Sedulous (Been there)
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To: Sedulous

Rather interesting that you felt the need to basically come in to FR and chastise people for saying that murdering your own child is wrong.


And please, don't give me any excuses about the 'you don't know' crap.
Life is precious, and murder is wrong, she knew the difference.


16 posted on 04/29/2005 9:28:59 AM PDT by Darksheare (You too can own your very own Bad Idea by Darksheare! Inquire within!)
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To: familyop
Ramsey has been reunited with her older child who was taken into state custody at age 8 shortly after the infant brother's horrific death.

And they gave this child murderer her other kid back? Poor kid had better sleep with his eyes open.
17 posted on 04/29/2005 9:33:17 AM PDT by reagan_fanatic (It takes all kinds of critters...to make Farmer Vincents fritters)
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To: Darksheare

without knowing your gender I would suspect you are male and that you are ignorant to mental illness. Having a mental Illness/disease is no different than having cancer or diabetes. It's not something you ask for or want to happen. It's something that robs you of the life you thought you would have/lead.
The world is full of people who are ignorant but like to run their mouths as though they themselves know more than anybody else.
It must be nice to sit so high above all the sh** the rest of us (who at least make an effort to educate ourselves) have to wade through.
Mostly I hope and pray that you and people like you don't have to fall so hard to the bottom and have people kick you while you try and get back up.
So, no I wasn't chastising... just offering another side. After all, isn't that what this site is about? Or is it just for those who believe their opinions are so much more superior that perhaps if you were running things most of us would end up banished as the "undesired" kind???


18 posted on 04/29/2005 12:47:36 PM PDT by Sedulous (Been there)
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To: familyop

I had "postpartum depression" nine times and yet somehow I avoided smothering and drowning my babies.

How did that happen?


19 posted on 04/29/2005 12:50:13 PM PDT by Alouette (In each and every generation they rise up to destroy us, but the Holy One, saves us from their hands)
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To: Sedulous
So, no I wasn't chastising... just offering another side. After all, isn't that what this site is about? Or is it just for those who believe their opinions are so much more superior that perhaps if you were running things most of us would end up banished as the "undesired" kind???

This site is very specifically stated as Pro-life Conservative so no, we don't cater to people coming here saying good is bad and bad is good or there's no such thing as truth.

She killed her child. I have no pity for her at all. I'm female by the way since you think that is a prerequsite on having an opinion in the matter.

20 posted on 04/29/2005 12:55:45 PM PDT by katnip
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