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Public School Is Too Strict; Socialization Muted
The Lakeland Ledger ^ | Thursday, April 14, 2005 | Letter to editor

Posted on 04/14/2005 5:58:52 AM PDT by Sam's Army

Public School Is Too Strict; Socialization Muted

My home-schooled granddaughter and I went to have lunch with my public schooled granddaughter at her school recently. She wanted us to come have lunch with her. It cost $2.50 for me and $1.50 for granddaughter.

It sure wasn't like when we went to school. None of the kids were allowed to talk at all to each other during their lunch hour.

After they finished eating, they had to read a book that they brought with them.

There were monitors with eyes roving to and fro. If they order milk, they are forced to drink it all. It seemed to me more like I was in a prison cafeteria.

They had to get in no-talking lines to arrive and to leave, all in the same uniforms, and no talking of course, even in the rest rooms.

If they talk in lines, they have to go to the principal's office.

I sure didn't see much socialization going on there.

My home-schooled granddaughter and I were glad to get out of there, and step back into freedom.

FRAN GRINER

Lakeland


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events; US: Florida
KEYWORDS: homeschool; publicschooling; silentlunch
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To: Military family member

That was a good project educationally. Yet, socially I am skeptical of its merit. I have yet to be in a situation where I have to teach a class of people who are commanded to look at me as I stand in front of the blackboard. If you are a corporate trainer or other educator, this is good training. Yet outside of that, there is no applicability of this sort of school exercise to the real world. It is good that the students interact with each other, I guess, but even that is in such a controlled manner, ie, 10 year olds interact only with 10 year olds. They are in teh groups that the teacher assigns, ie, they can't recruit an optimal team (that would be unfair). They can't just work with their friends (unfair). This sort of exercise, then, has little relation to the real world, at least to the real world where people to choose with whom they want to associate and do business, ie, not determined by The Teacher.

My only point being this: school is not the place to become socialized....unless the meaning of "socialized" is closely tied to "socialist". Then what happens in school seems to me to be headed in the right direction. I, however, don't want that at all and wish I had never partaken of it, at all.


61 posted on 04/14/2005 7:44:10 AM PDT by ConservativeDude
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To: Sam's Army
I understand what you mean. I homeschool my children. The "poor socialization" argument is what many people use to degrade homeschooling.

BUT the point is that public school children are no better "socialized", nor do public school children have any greater opportunities to socialize than homeschool children do.

Since the school restricts interactions between children, they are not really socializing except for stolen moments at lockers or in the hallways and riding the bus to and fro.

I understand why the school must try to control the population, and I do not have an argument with parents for thinking that is best for their child.

I have chosen otherwise for my family.

62 posted on 04/14/2005 7:45:18 AM PDT by Diva Betsy Ross (Code pink stinks!)
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To: HIDEK6

You left out:

4) They learn what it is like to be in a totalitarian prison camp.


63 posted on 04/14/2005 7:46:28 AM PDT by green iguana
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To: Sam's Army
Uniforms are standard for that county up to high school.

Wow! It's a lot different up here in Massachusetts.

64 posted on 04/14/2005 7:48:18 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Sam's Army

The whole "socialization" argument and accompanying studies were developed out of the need to have women feel good about dumping their children at daycare for someone else to raise while pursuing a career. (motherhood by proxie etc.)

That was later exended to public schools after the homeschooling children started outperforming the public school students in a public way.

Socialization in not "socialization" it is indoctrinated to be pro-leftist.


65 posted on 04/14/2005 7:49:33 AM PDT by longtermmemmory (VOTE!)
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To: the invisib1e hand

"i've yet to meet a homeschooled child who isn't a perfect lady or gentleman and very poised and confident around peers and adults alike."

this seems to me to be a very important goal of true socializatin...and one that the schools are utterly incapable of producing, by design.

of course, if people were to come out of the system poised and confident and with ability to communicate to people outside of their peer group, they would not make very good members of The System....the don't become cogs in the great socialist machine....they are too "independent"....can't have that!!!!


66 posted on 04/14/2005 7:50:34 AM PDT by ConservativeDude
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To: Sam's Army
Recess isn't around anymore at this county in question. Too risky for insurance coverage reasons, among other things.

That's a terrible shame.

My daughter gets 2 recesses a day, and they are allowed to talk quietly at lunch - but there is no talking in the halls or in line and that is strictly enforced.....I know, because my daughter is a chatter box and it is reflected in the "numbers" (we called them demerits)she receives each week.

67 posted on 04/14/2005 7:50:34 AM PDT by Gabz (John Paul II, pray for us.)
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To: ConservativeDude
Exactly what aspect of social life does that correspond to?

Prison or worker drones?

The Prussian mind, which carried the day, held a clear idea of what centralized schooling should deliver: 1) Obedient soldiers to the army; 2) Obedient workers for mines, factories, and farms; 3) Well-subordinated civil servants, trained in their function; 4) Well-subordinated clerks for industry; 5) Citizens who thought alike on most issues; 6) National uniformity in thought, word, and deed.

The Underground History of American Education


68 posted on 04/14/2005 7:53:43 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Beaker

That's a good question. I do not know for sure, but I did work with some students of a very young age that were put on meds in that area. The attending Psychiatrist for a crisis center was shocked to see some files and showed me that some children were put on adult-size dosages of medication. The side-effects of some of these meds included massive weight gain, among other things.


69 posted on 04/14/2005 7:54:16 AM PDT by Sam's Army (Fight them)
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To: MindBender26
All to often Conservatives throw up our hands and say "nothing can be done."

Nothing can be done. < throwing up hands>

70 posted on 04/14/2005 7:55:11 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: ladyjane
I'm surprised that they would be that strick in elementary school. GOOD for them! We couldn't talk during lunch time and we stood in line without talking.It didn't hurt us.

That is almost the way it is in my daughter's elementary school. They are permitted to talk softly at lunch - and usually a short command from the teacher or principal, who is usually in the cafeteria at lunch, brings it under control if they get too loud.

71 posted on 04/14/2005 7:55:47 AM PDT by Gabz (John Paul II, pray for us.)
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To: green iguana; HIDEK6

I believe my #55 has precedence. (you can have 5.)


72 posted on 04/14/2005 7:56:03 AM PDT by Oztrich Boy (Laws are for the guidence of wise men and the blind obedience of fools - Solon, Lawmaker of Athens)
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To: Gabz

Hehe! Gabz. My children would get 100 demerits a day.( I just know it!) "Chatterbox" is putting it mildly for my two. See why I homeschool! ;]


73 posted on 04/14/2005 7:56:15 AM PDT by Diva Betsy Ross (Code pink stinks!)
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To: All

I like school uniforms. I always feel sorry for the little kids with torn t-shirts and worn out jeans. Others kids walk around in shoes that can cost over a hundred dollars, and designer labels on their clothes. The poor kids were always picked on, can you guess by whom? Uniforms are an equalizer between the poor kids and the rich kids.


74 posted on 04/14/2005 7:57:49 AM PDT by processing please hold (Islam and Christianity do not mix ----9-11 taught us that)
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To: Military family member
My 10-year-old's class was assigned a project for a social studies project on ancient Egypt. My daughter and her two little partners researched the game Senet, created a board and pieces, a set of rules, and taught the class how to play. They also learned why the game was important to the Egyptians, and they gave a presentation to the class.

And for twelve years these children won't receive any explicit religious instruction.

This strikes me as insane. Profoundly insane.

75 posted on 04/14/2005 7:58:58 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Sam's Army

Come on, it was the late 1980s Hong Kong. ;-) For the very few who were aware of this concern then, they all viewed it as "kooky Amercian fad".

And speaking of excellence, after I came to New Zealand I attended a very traditional state school and our headmaster was uncompromising on the school's encouragement for us to strive for excellence. Imagine you went to a public school and everything is run like a private prep school. You can read this by his prizegiving speech given last year:

http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_434786.html?menu=news.latestheadlines


76 posted on 04/14/2005 7:59:29 AM PDT by NZerFromHK ("US libs...hypocritical, naive, pompous...if US falls it will be because of these" - Tao Kit (HK))
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To: Sam's Army

Come on, it was the late 1980s Hong Kong. ;-) For the very few who were aware of this concern then, they all viewed it as "kooky Amercian fad".

And speaking of excellence, after I came to New Zealand I attended a very traditional state school and our headmaster was uncompromising on the school's encouragement for us to strive for excellence. Imagine you went to a public school and everything is run like a private prep school. You can read this by his prizegiving speech given last year:

http://www.ags.school.nz/prizegiving_speech_04.htm


77 posted on 04/14/2005 8:01:07 AM PDT by NZerFromHK ("US libs...hypocritical, naive, pompous...if US falls it will be because of these" - Tao Kit (HK))
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To: Diva Betsy Ross
"I have chosen otherwise for my family."

We will as well.

78 posted on 04/14/2005 8:02:35 AM PDT by Sam's Army (Fight them)
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To: Diva Betsy Ross

LOL!!!!! The most she has ever gotten in one day was 2 and that was quite a while ago. Even the teachers have told us that her self control of her chattering is getting better.


79 posted on 04/14/2005 8:05:39 AM PDT by Gabz (John Paul II, pray for us.)
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To: ConservativeDude
I don't believe school time is time for socialization anyway.

I think the parents who have their children in public schools AND offer opportunities, after school and on weekends to interact with peers and society, are doing the same thing I am doing when I homeschool my children and then set up opportunities for them to interact with peers and society.

I sincerely believe that my children are well socialized AND that there are great kids, who are well socialized- who attend public school.

Again the real issue is parental involvement.

80 posted on 04/14/2005 8:06:34 AM PDT by Diva Betsy Ross (Code pink stinks!)
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