Posted on 04/02/2005 4:39:18 PM PST by BCrago66
Pope John Paul II died this afternoon. The New York Times reports on his papacy in an article that inadvertently tells us more than the Times really wanted us to know. The Times had its criticisms of John Paul's papacy ready to go, but apparently went looking for something good to say about the Pope at the last minute:
Even as his own voice faded away, his views on the sanctity of all human life echoed unambiguously among Catholics and Christian evangelicals in the United States on issues from abortion to the end of life.
need some quote from supporter
John Paul II's admirers were as passionate as his detractors, for whom his long illness served as a symbol for what they said was a decrepit, tradition-bound papacy in need of rejuvenation and a bolder connection with modern life.
"The situation in the Catholic church is serious," Hans Kung, the eminent Swiss theologian, who was barred by from teaching in Catholic schools because of his liberal views, wrote last week. "The pope is gravely ill and deserves every compassion. But the Church has to live. ...
In my opinion, he is not the greatest pope but the most contradictory of the 20th century. A pope of many, great gifts, and of many bad decisions!"
Among liberal Catholics, he was criticized for his strong opposition to abortion, homosexuality and contraception, as well as the ordination of women and married men. Though he was never known as a strong administrator of the dense Vatican bureaucracy, he kept a centralizing hand on the selection of bishops around the world and enforced a rigid adherence to many basic church teachings among the clergy and Catholic theologians.
There you have it. The Times' criticisms are ready to go, a few good words for the Pope are an afterthought.
UPDATE: I got a screen grab of the second page of the Times article, just before they changed it to delete the "need some quote from supporter:"
You're hurting, I understand. And it seemed like disrespect by me. No worries. It's been a very emotional time lately. May the Pope feel eternal joy. [I'm sure he will.]
And we will never see another Pope like him in our lifetimes. I don't think there's a single man in this world who can fill his shoes.
FReegards....
Busted.
He said it best to those who felt he was holding back social enlightenment "The church cannot be an association of freethinkers".
No problem. After posting I realized your statement could have read that way also. Oh well, this way we are certainly clear.
Actually they could have gone uptown 1/2 mile to Saint Patrick's Cathedral.
Plenty of supporters there.....
Condolences for the loss of your beloved Pope and fellow countryman.
I appreciate his life.
Thank you America good friend!!!!Be strong!!!Thank you:{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{
Inyeresting that liberal protestants feel the Catholic Church should move with the culture. It was that giant Protestant theologian, Richard Niebuhr, who wrote in Christ and Culture, that the Christian Church was at its strongest when its values had to stand against the Culture of the times. And he did preach in Riverside Church. I suppose he might be more welcome in John Paul's Church than in the remains of the mainline Protestant Church he brought so much honor to.
Thank you
I wish you could have seen it also---
If you have seen the way that Fred Barnes and Mort Kondrake have been "going at" each other the last few weeks over the Terri Schiavo story, then you can imagine how it went last night---
They are friends and can joke around regarding the economy and even the war to a certain extent, BUT I see a really big split when it comes to these subjects.
I know that Mort is a hugh believer in embryonic stem cell research which Fred and the Pope and President are against--I know it has a lot to do with his wife's battle with Parkinson's disease, so I usually cut him some slack, BUT
for him to try to tell the Catholics what kind of Pope they SHOULD have is just ridiculous. I suppose he is a supporter of the Episcopalians for having a gay Priest---ugh!
In a million years you would not find a member of the the NY Times staff at St. Patricks, or any other Christian church.
True----but it also show's how ignorant and lazy (not to mention dishonest) they are.....
[Insert some quote from a Times supporter here.]
Time passes - it's been 27 years since he was elected to the papacy in the middle of the ferment preceding the fall of the Soviet empire. There are people too young to remember how the world was then who are asking what it was all about and why a Pope should have played such a crucial role in the great fall, and why Protestants and atheists and agnostics are mourning him as well as Catholics. I don't think that is likely to happen again in our lifetime. RIP for a great man.
Well, the Times doesn't have a dog in that hunt. Screw 'em.
How dare he...
Thank you!!!!!:{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{
I'm as conservative and Catholic as they come, and only voted Democrat once (local election in the primary), and I had a good deal of moral problem with his oppositon to the Iraq war in light of the struggle for freedom in POland and Eastern Europe as a whole. It wasn't duplicitous in opposing armed intervention in Iraq, as much as he made the mistake in assuming that it could collapse the same by slowly opening the doors. Iraq was an absolutely repressive society, OTOH. He believed nonviolence in eastern europe was the only way to achieve freedom, because armed uprising would result in soviet crackdown/invasion, resulting in a hot war really fast and doing more damage than even the status quo would do. Iraq was no such threat, yet he made the mistake. Moral positon--consistent with his past positions on social justice and standing up to tyranny yes, but poor strategy. In any case it was not his positon to support us in Iraq, it was his position to be above everything. Remember there are five million Catholics in Iraq.
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