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Terri Schiavo's 2002 CT scan
MSNBC ^ | 3 29 05 | msnbc dan abrams interview

Posted on 03/29/2005 9:45:05 PM PST by flixxx

TRANSCRIPT Updated: 4:04 p.m. ET March 29, 2005 The overwhelming majority in the medical community say Terri Schiavo has close to no brain activity and has no chance of regaining awareness. Dr. Ronald Cranford, who actually examined Terri Schiavo in 2002 and testified to her condition, joined "The Abrams Report" on Monday. Cranford is the assistant chief of neurology at the Hennepin County Medical Center in Minneapolis as well as a faculty member at the University of Minnesota's Center for Bioethics. Below is the transcript of their conversation.

DAN ABRAMS, HOST: You're one of the few people who has actually examined Terri Schiavo and you're hearing all of these people who are coming on from the sidelines saying, "She's has been misdiagnosed," et cetera. How confident are you in your diagnosis and why?

DR. RONALD CRANFORD, UNIV. OF MN NEUROLOGIST: I'm extremely confident. I think at the time of the trial in 2002 there had been eight neurologists who examined her. And of those eight neurologists total, seven of them said beyond any doubt whatsoever Terri is in a vegetative state. Her CT scan shows severe atrophy or shrinkage of the brain. Her EEG is flat and there's absolutely no doubt that she's been in a permanent vegetative state ever since 1990. There's no doubt whatsoever, Dan.

(Excerpt) Read more at msnbc.msn.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
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To: Nightshift

I made no attempt to determine her capabilities.

How many times am I going to have to say that to you people?

It's truly no wonder you guys aren't getting this.


321 posted on 03/30/2005 4:23:54 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: concerned about politics
Dr. Jon Thogmartin, the medical examiner chosen by Felos/Schiavo to perform the autopsy, was appointed to his current position by Gov. Jeb Bush in 2000 for a three year term and reappointed in 2003. He reports to the Pinellas County Board of Commissioners, the same commission of which Greer was a commissioner prior to assuming judicial office.

LOL! The excuses are already starting in order to provide justification for dismissing the autopsy results and the autopsy hasn't even been performed yet!

322 posted on 03/30/2005 4:33:23 PM PST by ContraryMary (WPPFF Member)
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To: texasflower
I made no attempt to determine her capabilities.

If you made no attempts to determine her capabilities, please explain what you meant by this?

The scans posted are very clear. What do you all have to say about that?

That statements gives the impression you already have by what you saw in the CT.

323 posted on 03/30/2005 4:41:43 PM PST by Nightshift (judge greer: legally blind and blind legally)
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To: beaversmom

That is truly a profound article. It's one flaw, however, is that the author assumes that the decision about Terri's wishes was based on conversations with Michael, and we know that is not true. I also think it's a little weak on the fact that people can make their wishes known verbally; I'm not sure the author would ever accept verbal statements concerning one's wishes; he even seems to be advocating ignoring living wills. But he raises many thoughtful questions.


324 posted on 03/30/2005 4:47:09 PM PST by ContraryMary (WPPFF Member)
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To: Nightshift

Let me try this again.

The scan very clearly shows that there is significant atrophy.

What exactly are you trying to get out of me?

I sure seem to be consuming a lot of your time.

Here's a tip.... you will not get me to tell you what I really think.


325 posted on 03/30/2005 4:49:12 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: Ethrane
Whether you accept it as 'killing' her or not does not alter the fact that she was 'killed' by the active removal of nutrition

There is a difference between killing someone and allowing them to die. When you remove life support, you're not killing anyone.

326 posted on 03/30/2005 5:01:58 PM PST by jess35
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To: Keith in Iowa
You and the rest of your euthanasia cheerleaders....

Look up the definition of euthanasia.

Mr Dictionary is your friend.

327 posted on 03/30/2005 5:03:22 PM PST by jess35
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To: texasflower

"I noticed you all ignored them and decided to try and bash the doctor instead"


Okay, you're right. Everyone needs to report immediately for a CT scan. If it resembles these, they are to starved to death as quickly as possible.


328 posted on 03/30/2005 5:20:32 PM PST by Figment (Ich bin ein Jesuslander)
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To: texasflower
>> Honestly if you are so hardheaded or dense as to not see that scan shows severe atrophy then you are beyond any ability to reason.

You admit that you can't interpret CTs, then you go right ahead and interpret the CT and say that this CT shows atrophy. Is that what you refer to as "reason"?

You got it wrong anyway. The CT does not show atrophy. It cannot possibly show atrophy. Atrophy means deterioration from the prior state. You can't show the condition has worsened without knowing the prior condition.

In everyday words, you must compare a Before and After photo to show the change of condition. All you gave us was "After."

Let's let the docs do the interpreting.

329 posted on 03/30/2005 5:28:19 PM PST by T'wit (Liberalism reduces America from a Shining City on a Hill to a festering slum in a fever swamp)
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To: T'wit

Are you aware of the fact that your post is incorrect?


330 posted on 03/30/2005 5:30:11 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: Figment

Don't be foolish. You are letting your emotions control you.


331 posted on 03/30/2005 5:31:02 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: texasflower
>> Are you aware of the fact that your post is incorrect?

Not yet.

332 posted on 03/30/2005 5:36:36 PM PST by T'wit (Liberalism reduces America from a Shining City on a Hill to a festering slum in a fever swamp)
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To: texasflower
Your post of the CT is neither here nor there. While interesting, the lack of "brain" matter is no determinate of person-hood.

Have you seen the brain scans of Michelle Mack?

She is missing almost the entire left side of her brain.... and yet she lives a lively and productive life.

http://www.pbs.org/saf/1101/resources/transcript.htm#7
333 posted on 03/30/2005 5:47:58 PM PST by CyberCowboy777 (You may remember me from such threads as "Christmas in Cambodia" & "Crying Game: The Gore Story")
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To: CyberCowboy777

How many times must I say this? I will give you a break because you are obviously you are at the beginning of the thread but check the last half of it.

Over and over again, I have said the exact same thing.

The scan shows significant atrophy. I made no attempt to diagnose Terri or make any sort of determination as to her capabilities.


334 posted on 03/30/2005 5:50:51 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: texasflower
Just as I said, your post of her CT is neither here nor there.

You posted for what purpose? It provides no information to the situation nor can it be used as evidence of ability or inability.

My only guess is that you, thinking that the CT proved some point contested, were unaware of the complete lack of information it provided to the discussion.
335 posted on 03/30/2005 5:54:58 PM PST by CyberCowboy777 (You may remember me from such threads as "Christmas in Cambodia" & "Crying Game: The Gore Story")
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To: texasflower

"Don't be foolish. You are letting your emotions control you"

Emotion played no part in the comment at all. If you believe that a CT scan justifies starvation, you should be consistent in justifying it for all with the same type scan. I personally don't believe any test available justifies euthanasia, but that's just me.


336 posted on 03/30/2005 5:56:25 PM PST by Figment (Ich bin ein Jesuslander)
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To: CyberCowboy777

As I also said, the pictures were the ones accompanying the article.

I did not chose them.


337 posted on 03/30/2005 5:57:18 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: Figment

I did not make any comment whatsoever about what should be done.

I did not make any comment about her capabilities.


338 posted on 03/30/2005 5:58:13 PM PST by texasflower ("America's vital interests and our deepest beliefs are now one." President George W. Bush 01/20/05)
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To: texasflower
Did you choose to post them?

I can understand the lack of knowledge from some MSM report, I can understand the pictures added to such a story (without the relevant caveats, such as mine) in an effort to sway the uninformed.

But I feel certain (from your profile) that you are aware of the plasticity of the brain and the fact that the CT scan proves only one thing - part of her brain is unavailable.

That fact is a given, it is not in debate.

So why show it unless you want to misinform the public into thinking that the fact leads to the additional fact that a person without a large portion of brain cannot function, or feel, or really be alive.

339 posted on 03/30/2005 6:05:07 PM PST by CyberCowboy777 (You may remember me from such threads as "Christmas in Cambodia" & "Crying Game: The Gore Story")
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To: texasflower
What is your point?

Are we Captain obvious today? Part of her brain is missing!
340 posted on 03/30/2005 6:07:25 PM PST by CyberCowboy777 (You may remember me from such threads as "Christmas in Cambodia" & "Crying Game: The Gore Story")
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