Posted on 03/26/2005 1:34:45 AM PST by Destro
March 25, 2005
COMMENTARY
Why Schiavo's Parents Didn't Have a Case
By Andrew Cohen, Andrew Cohen is CBS News' legal analyst.
Terri Schiavo's parents did not lose their federal case because they didn't try hard enough. They didn't lose their case because everyone conspired against them. They didn't lose it because Congress ticked off the judiciary over the weekend with its over-the-top custom-made legislation. They didn't lose it for lack of money or because they failed to file a court paper on time. They didn't lose it because the laws are unfair or because bureaucrats sometimes can be arbitrary and capricious.
The Schindlers lost their case and their cause — and soon probably their daughter — because in the end they were making claims the legal system has never been able or willing to recognize. They lost because they long ago ran out of good arguments to make — those arguments having been reasonably rejected by state judge after judge — and thus were left with only lame ones. And they lost because in every case someone has to win and someone has to lose. That's the way it works in our system of government. It isn't pretty, and sometimes it's unfair. But it's reality.
Especially during this final round of review, orchestrated by Congress' extraordinary attempt at a "do-over" for the couple, Schiavo's parents lost appeal after appeal specifically because they were asking the federal courts to declare that their constitutional rights had been violated by the Florida state court rulings in the case. They were arguing, in other words, thanks in part to their custom-made congressional legislation, that the federal Constitution gave them the right as losers in state court to get a new, full-blown trial in federal court.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
If you don't know what that means, then you are deliberately pretending to be obtuse.
What Greer is doing and all the courts have ignored is denying her the opportunity to have food or water by mouth. That is euthanasia and is not permitted under Florida law. Whether she could take water or not is immaterial and in any case we don't know what would happen, at least it would give her a chance and she has none right now. On this order at least the Shindler's have the law on their side -- giving water by mouth is not in any shape, fashion or form artificial lilfe support as mentioned in the Florida statute. Any outcome of a trial of drinking, even death by choking, is preferable to what is going on now.
What I cannot figure out is why Jeb Bush and her parents are so focused on getting the feeding tube back in when it is clear that this will not happen when this other clearly illegal order by Greer is alpparently going unchallenged.
Agreed. Again I am pointing out that this court followed Florida Law and the courts are not so much the villain in this.
No you are discussing this with cold snobbery. You tend to take a high and might tone in here and act disgusted with anyone that would dare argue with your perfect logic in the issue.
"It's your side that throws the Hitler/Nazi bombs and as you can scroll up"
Don't put me on any "side" in this. If I debate you on a certain point of fact or opinion in here IMHO it's between you and me not "my side".
I have NOT personally acused you of being a Nazi or Hitler. I happen to think that the analogy...no matter who it's used against in this debate...is disingenuious and un called for.
So your you to lump me in with the people who have said that then claim its "my side" is dishonest on your part.
Queen's English???
Are you a citizen of the United States?
Instead of having her try and speak or follow a balloon - "here Terri chew on this cookie - swallow this juice" didn't happen - sadly can't happen.
Damn Straight and proud of it.
You seem to think that a court should be simply an adding machine, rather than resisting obvious evil. There were several routes in law for the court to have taken. It consistently took the murderous one.
"If she could sip or chew all her parents had to do was feed her and offer her a drink on camera"
That would be nice except that her "husband" has banned her parents from taking video camera's into her room when they are allowed to visit.
That is wrong! There are over 4 hours of tape made by the parents to show to the court when this went to trail - there is new tape as we speak that is serving as teh basis for the appeal - the one where the parents claim she says "I want to live".
She swallows her own saliva now (or did until she got so dried up she didn't secrete any more), so any comparable flow of liquified food would go down just as well.
Even more importantly, there are therapies available NOW which can teach a non swallower to swallow again. It involves stimulation of the swallowing muscles.
IIRC, she could eat a few years ago, her nurses used to sneak food to her. But, the husband found out and put a stop to it and may have had a nurse fired over it.
I could be wrong though.
If you are proud of your citizenship then why does your profile page start out with the Scottish stuff?
They snuck the tape camera in. The tape they show is old.
The ban on canreas in her room IS a fact.
I am unaware of the tape about her trying to speak. What I heard reported on CNN today was that it was wittnessed by one of the lawers for the Schindlers and one of the nurses.
But the ban on her family taking a camcorder in the room is a fact and I had not heard about any video recording of her trying to speak.
Maybe it has to do with Scottish law? (Not Proven)
The nurses are also under the threat of being fired if they do anything Mr. Schiavo construes to be rehabilitative in nature.
I have seen that as well.
But the courts have found based on testimony not only from the husband's doctor but that of court appointed medical teams (sadly many think that Greer only relied on the husband's doctor - he did not) that she is indeed in a PVS which can not be reversed.
What I object to is people saying that she can as of right now (just before the tube was pulled) swallow and chew food. That is a falsehood.
This excerpt is from a blog I found at:
http://amatha.blogspot.com/2005_02_01_amatha_archive.html
"If it is [the feeding tube is removed], she will begin a long, slow, painful process of death by starvation and dehydration. In fact, not long ago, Nurse Cheryl Ford–who took care of Terri at Woodside Hospice in Tampa, Florida—found an “Exit Protocol” in Terri’s file. This “Exit Protocol” is a recipe for how to kill someone by starvation and dehydration, and then manage their symptoms while they slowly die. For instance, the nurses will put lip balm on Terri because her lips will crack, peel, and bleed from the dehydration. They’ll use body lotion because Terri’s skin will begin to break down and show signs of flaking, drying, cracking, or being parched. They’ll put a “scopolamine patch” behind her ear to enhance the drying up of saliva and other secretions. “Chux pads” will need to be used—and changed quite often because of incontinence of Terri’s bowels and bladder. When Terri begins to writhe in pain (multifocal myoclonus) and she becomes agitated from metabolic changes and electrolyte imbalances due to no fluids or nutrition, the attending staff will have to give her 5 to 10 mg of Valium (diazepam)—rectally—every 4 hours. If Terri experiences a Grand Mal seizure, they’ll give her 15 mg of Valium immediately, and then as needed thereafter. When her body shows signs of an inability to breathe by gasping for air (dyspnea), they will immediately give Terri 2 to 4 mg of morphine every 4 hours. And all of this will go on for 7 to 10 days… Until Terri’s DEAD!" --dated Tuesday 22 February
From an October 2003 CNSNews report on the case:
"If the Schindlers wish to visit their daughter before she dies, Bushnell explained that they and any other visitors pre-approved by the court must abide by all of the conditions of a March 24, 2000, court order that, among other things, forbade them from photographing or videotaping Terri. Terri's family is also forbidden to have her examined by any physician without pre-approval from the court. Pamela Hennessy, spokeswoman for the Terri Schindler Schiavo Foundation, called the move "entirely senseless" and described it as the Schiavo legal team's "last attempt at cruelty."
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