Jews and Jesus

Townhall ^ | March 24, 2005 | Marvin Olasky

[Crackingham]

Passover and Easter are upon us, and so is a book with a fascinating title and audacious subtitle: David Klinghoffer's "Why the Jews Rejected Jesus: The Turning Point in Western History" (Doubleday, 2005).

On the title's crucial theological point: Klinghoffer, an orthodox Jew, rightly takes to task the "well-meaning Christian" seeking to improve Jewish-Christian relations by saying that Jesus' teaching was very close to that of the rabbis of the time. He also jumps past "New Perspective on Paul" theologians who do not find "substantial points of disagreement between Jesus and his contemporaries."

Both groups err, the author notes, by not taking into full account the doctrine of the "oral Torah" that was sweeping through Judaism 2,000 years ago: "What Jesus rejected was the oral Torah that explains the written Torah. Essential to rabbinic Judaism, this concept of an oral Torah recognizes the Pentateuch as a cryptic document, a coded text. It posits that the Bible's first five books were revealed to Moses along with a key to unlock the code." That key was purportedly passed on orally throughout the generations.

Christians today learn that the New Testament explains certain previously mysterious Old Testament passages; proponents of the "oral Torah" (written down as the Talmud) claimed the same for their teaching. Jesus said, in essence, sola scriptura, the Bible alone: He allowed his followers to pluck grain on the Sabbath, which was perfectly fine according to the Bible but wrong according to the code. The code said that Jews should not wash their faces on fast days, but Jesus taught the opposite.

As Klinghoffer notes, "For Jesus, oral Torah was a manmade accretion without transcendent authority. He tells a group of Pharisees, 'So for the sake of your tradition, you have made void the word of God.' ... This explains why he felt it was appropriate to teach solely on his own authority, rather than by citing previous sages." Some Christians today believe they have figured out the Bible's secret code. Some Jews 2,000 years ago felt the same way, but Jesus flatly told them that there was no code: Just read and pray.

The author has many other valuable insights. For example, he writes: "The oral Torah values sociability and thus calls upon the individual to pray in company with a minimum of 10 men (a minyan, or quorum). Jesus advised his followers, 'When you pray,' to pray by yourself, 'in secret.'" Christianity values community worship but emphasizes the role of the individual, and much of Western culture emerges from that emphasis.

Klinghoffer thus explains well "why the Jews rejected Jesus." But what about his subtitle, "the turning point in Western history"? He argues that if more Jews had embraced Jesus, believers would have stayed within Judaism and continued to emphasize circumcision and kosher food rules. They would have required abstaining from sex for a week after menstruation, and so on: "The Jesus movement might have remained a Jewish sect. ... Christianity would not have spread wildly across the Roman Empire and later across Europe, as it did."

[familyop]

But other historical descriptions of Pontius Pilate and why he was recalled to Rome tell quite a contrasting story from what we've read in the New Testament. Try Philo and Josephus. It is also noticeable as to how Catherine Emmerich (much later) added to the story of Pontius regarding his wife. ...another keyword to add to Philo, Josephus and Pontius Pilate would be Sejanus.

[onedoug]

If you mean the Gospel, 'twas another, later John. More knowledgeable of Judaism, though yet a Hellenist. And if you mean I, II or III John, 'twere others still.

[Thinkin' Gal]

Now you Judaizers think to drag us all back under slavery (the bondwoman, Hagar, in the allegory), the Old Covenant.

Torah does tend to offend the lawless.

[goldstategop]

David Klinghoffer is a conservative. No, not a Conservative Jew, but a political conservative. I think his book offers fresh insight into why the Jews and Christians split early in their history. Quite simply put, a Jewish sect would have had no chance of gaining support among the gentile pagans of the Roman Empire. The Roman world would have remained pagan. Or it could have easily turned Muslim in the absence of Christianity. The way it turned it turned out was fortuitous for Western civilization. Christians don't have to apologize for being different from Jews. Judaism makes hard demands on its adherents and its philosophy of pure monotheism and a belief in the importance of works as the key to salvation then as now, would have attracted idealistic individuals. Not enough to create a mass movement. The Christian solution of diluting monotheism enough to let gentiles feel like they didn't have to give up all of their old beliefs and emphasizing the central place of faith enabled the new faith to make major inroads in the Roman world. In other words, the Christians had to leave Judaism behind in order to survive in a larger world that at the time was terra hostilis. The Jews didn't need to or want to since for them, keeping their identity intact was more important than winning the world over to their beliefs.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[goldstategop]

Jesus' teaching was the same as the later Karaites: the written Torah is complete and understandable in its own terms. Mainstream Judaism rejected this view by observing that much of the Torah's rules are phrased in very general terms. For example, it speaks of the need to obey the Sabbath. How does one know how to do that? If you say common sense, well different people have different ideas for what passes for common sense. So that's no help. The Jewish solution posited that Moses was taught by God how to fulfill what was written in the Torah but God did not put it down on paper. Which is indeed exactly what happened. And one can speak therefore of two complementary Torahs, both invested with equal divine authority.

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[goldstategop]

Yes, Passover falls next month. The Hebrew calendar is lunisolar. It follows the phases of the moon, but inserts a leap month several times in a 19 year cycle so the festivals always occur at the appointed times. And for Jews, that means one gets to celebrate two birthdays since the Hebrew date will seldom fall on the same day as the English one!

(Denny Crane: "Sometimes you can only look for answers from God and failing that... and Fox News".)

[dervish]

btt

[dervish]

You make an excellent point.

I believe there were periods of time when reading the OT/OC was forbidden to Catholics as apostasy.

IMO, Christians who connect well to Jews know and revere the OT/OC.

[Conservative til I die]

Zzzzzzzz...I'm not really sure if our Jewish Freeper friends are aware we really don't care about their admonitions to us on how to celebrate our faith. We're almost all well aware that Christmas is on the same date as the old Saturnalia festivals and that Easter is at a similar time to the old pagan Spring festivals. None of it matters since we're not celebrating some pagan Spring festival or Saturnalia. We commemorate Christ's death and birth, respectively.

We also have no reason to abstain from eating shellfish or pork either. Christ created a New Covenant, and we're moving forward with that New Covenant. Not the old ways. It's such an irrelevant discussion I'm not even sure why we're having it. I mean, it's like been a moot point for about 1,950 years.

[Conservative til I die]

Jesus left us a Church, to teach, preach, spread the Gospel, set the rules, and watch over His followers. He didn't just say, "Go to the Temple as usual." He left His Church in charge, and this Church over the last 2,000 years has formulated Christian thought and practice. And the Church has clearly decided that we're not just a Jewish sect and that we don't need to celebrate Hannukah, Passover, Yom Kippur, or Purim, nor do we need to abstain from pork and shellfish and be in our houses from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday.

For me, that is the end of argument, case closed.

I'm not even sure why Jewish Freepers care what Christians do, since they aren't Christian, don't believe in Christ as Messiah, and probably have a mild distaste for Christianity in general. I can only guess their intent is to sow discord and do their best to get the Church to destroy itself from within.

[Conservative til I die]

Learning about Christ is fine, but people should keep it in the proper perspective. They aren't going to gain some special secret knowledge or some super special form of salvation if they decide to Judaize themselves. Learning about His Judaism is one thing, but letting it obscure the larger Truth is another.

[Conservative til I die]

Please explain what exactly, sticking to the Jewish heritage of Christianity adds to our faith.

[Conservative til I die]

This is the fundamental difference between evangelicals and more "traditional" denominations - they can make their own mind about these topics

And they've shown themselves to be the 27,000 Stooges, since they all seem to have made their own minds up dirfferently.

[Conservative til I die]

I believe gospels were written some time after the events they describe and not by a single eyewitness.

And? Most historical books were not written by eyewitnesses. However, the Gospels, or at least the source documents were written within a generation of Christ's death. They would have been taken from the teachings of St. Peter and other APostles, who were eyewitnesses.

[chukcha]

Some Jews - as well as non-Jews - have a nasty habit of trying to get to the bottom of what appears to be obvious and well-known.

On the other hand, there is nothing wrong in looking at a religion as a set of dietary laws. Some people do this "til they they die".

[Conservative til I die]

On the other hand, there is nothing wrong in looking at a religion as a set of dietary laws. Some people do this "til they they die".

Nothing wrong at all. But Christianity is not that religion.

[chukcha]

And?

They contain inconsistencies and contradictions.

Gospels were written at the time of Jewish revolt. Being Jewish at that time was very unpopular and Jews were an easy scapegoat.

People who study history of that period can understand Yeshua story better, than the ones that do not.

[chukcha]

Christianity is not that religion

I know. I was writing about how some people may view a religion, Christianity included.

Why did you write about pork and shellfish earlier?

[ladyL]

After the civil war when the Kingdom of Israel was divided in two about 900 BC the House of Israel or the ten northern tribes set up a religion that mixed the practices of the gentiles aka pagans and the Hebrew faith that they were instructed to follow by Moses. The House of Judah on the other hand, continued in the Hebrew Faith. YHVH aka God sent prophet after prophet to the house of Israel and told them their practices were an abomination and dung. They also replied zzzzzz, who cares, this is how we choose to worship, what's the big deal.

God then sent judgement and utter destruction in the form of the Assyrian army in 722 BC. The house of Israel and her golden calf worship were destroyed. The House of Judah is still intact and was brought back into the land in 1948 and made into a nation. We know them as the Jews but the Asherites, Danites, Ephraimites etc. are non existant. God's judgement on those tribes practicing a form of religion that was part pagan and part Biblical was to make them non existant.

Is God the same today, as He was yesterday, and is tomorrow? Do you really think God's grace covers zzzzz. That His wonderful truths are mixed with Ishtar and Mithra worship. His letter to the Laodiceans in Revelations basically says because you are neither hot nor cold but zzzzz I will VOMIT you out of my mouth. That means they WERE IN HIS BODY. I don't know about you but I fear God to much not to study to show myself approved and show utmost respect for His Truths.

[Sender]

Well all I can say is that I feel a need to learn more about Judaism and the times around 2000 years ago. If you don't feel a need to know, don't know. I'm not trying to turn back the clock.