Posted on 03/05/2005 6:21:41 PM PST by Lessismore
I feel bad for the guy who negotiated this Commie nut's release and was killed, but why must the Italians go and make it worse by LYING about what happened and trying to punish good American soldiers doing the right thing?! They better fire at oncoming vehicles that don't have clearance and FIRE EVERY TIME. Just ask the IDF what happens when you don't.
I couldn't agree with you more. What was your take on that Sky-Lift cable situation? (BTW, thanks for your service to our country)
Clearly negligent. Grossly negligent.
The current situation was in a war zone. The one you speak of was not.
I'd be interested in your take on the Pantano case.
Then you might agree that's what the Italians are really up in arms about. They've never forgotten about that, and I can't say that I blame them. It was a really bad call on our part, and now, six years later, it's coming back to haunt us, as these things do.
No kidding. *Maybe* the 5.56mm rounds might not have penetrated the agent's body, but the 7.62 vehicle-mount general-purpose machine gun certainly will. And from what I've seen, most of those (at least on the HMMWV's) have been replaced with the .50 (12.7mm) which will quite happily go through a brick wall, two people, another brick wall, and someone behind it. Sorry, but if they were firing a .50 with the aim to kill the occupants, that car would have been ripped to shreds. Sounds like they wre aiming for the engine compartment to stop the car short of lethal bomb range.
I think the only thing they did wrong was to use small arms instead of a tank main gun round to deliver the warning shots and followups. 120mm High Explosive rounds wouldn't leave Commieb****® around to complain, and nobody would have ever known anything more about her. Or cared. Stupidity of this order should be fatal.
The "journalist" and the Italian press have discernable motives.
The President does need to have an investigation and he's promised one. I have no doubt our soldiers are innocent, the issue is the circumstance of the kidnapping and circumstances of her release.
A person terrorized doesn't react all sweetness and light about her captives unless they've either been brainwashed or were in a form of collusion with the captors. I don't think the first instance holds true in her case.
And why did the Italian government do this clandestinely? Why not inform of of her release? Why run a road block? I think we can safely assume the government may not wish the ransom to be publically acknowledged, but it doesn't explain why the driver committed a suicide run. It doesn't explain her questionable actions thoughout this whole affair.
I do appreciate the alliance we share with Italy. I do appreciate Silvio is under pressure for his support of this war and understand a few rhetorical moments of outrage. I'm sorry for the agent's loss. It doesn't mean I'm going to allow our troops to be sacrificial lambs for the Italian press nor this communist journalist. It doesn't justify paying a ransom that will keep the terrorists' armed.
"Maybe these were not high powered rifle bullets?"
Bwahahahahahaha.................................
(In a war, at a checkpoint, only load nerf rounds)
Bwahahahahaha................
The point is, it's not the military situation that's the problem: it's the political situation. What happened at this checkpoint took place in a DMZ under combat conditions. Those pilots were flying in friendly times and in a friendly country, when they deicided to go hotdogging (highway to the danger zone, right?) and ended up killing a lot of innocent people in a particularly gruesome fashion. They did it, they had taken a video of it, destroyed the video after the fact, and got off. What happened then was a lot worse than this situation. When somebody does swing for this, it's going to be more about the event of 1999 than some journalist getting shot at at some checkpoint in Iraq.
I am a former enlisted man as well. I spent 2 years in a security detachment. I was amazed at the amount of evidence gathering that occured when a SeaBee ran his semi truck into a ditch in the jungles of Guam. That was peanuts compared to this. Nobody is going to get railroaded over this.
Now, it could be that they felt it was necessary to take it to an Article 32 but are privately confident that the IO will not recommend prosecution. I was involved in such cases in the Air Force. In fact, I was appointed IO in a few high-visibility cases precisely because the convening authority knew I would call it like I saw it without regard to whether it was a politically correct recommendation (some JAGs who are appointed IOs think it is their job to find a way to prosecute).
Although it was the convening authority, not me, who really made the disposition decision, the convening authority liked having a carefully-written painstakingly analyzed legal investigative report to back up the decision not to prosecute.
Again, I hope you're right, but bear with me for a moment. Berlisconi (sp?) made a point that somebody would have to bear responsibilty.
Politcally (not militarily) he had to make that statement, because of pubic pressure. This pressure was already present, due in large part to the astonishingly easy treatment handed out to an Air Force pilot who killed a cable-car load of people because he was 'topgunning' it below a ridgeline and severed the car's cable. Not only that, but it was proven that he and his navigator conspired to destroy evidence. Clear cut, but the two got off.
Fast forward to the present, six years later, when this happens.
Berlosconi is not Bush's poodle. He has his own problems in a notoriously fractious political system. He needs his good friend George Bush to come up with a name or names and they have to make it stick, for political reasons.
BTW, how many officers did you apprehend and help convict?
"...Serbs and Greeks also were very brave..."
Yep!
Oh, really.
Maybe you should enlighten some of us who saw examples of officers being hand-slapped while a noncom was left holding the bag first hand.
I'm not saying you're uniformed, I'm saying you've led a sheltered life and miltary career.
Pray for W and Our Troops
Pray for W and Our Freedom Fighting Troops
Listen to JC.
You ARE uninformed.
Have a nice day.
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