Pastor says BTK suspect remains part of church

cnn ^ | 3-3-05

[LouAvul]

WICHITA, Kan. - On the same day he was fired from his job, the suspect in the BTK serial killings got assurances he will continue to be a member of the church where he is a leader.

Dennis Rader, charged with 10 killings over the past three decades, was let go from his job as a compliance supervisor in the Wichita suburb of Park City. The City Council took the action on an unanimous vote Wednesday evening, giving failure to report to work or call in as the reason for Rader’s dismissal.

Earlier in the day, Rader was visited in jail by his pastor, the Rev. Michael Clark of Christ Lutheran Church in Wichita.

“We are not going to cut him off. I could tell that he was relieved,” Clark told The Associated Press. “He is still a part of the body of Christ — and that is something some people will have a hard time hearing.”

In an interview, Clark declined to disclose more details of his 45-minute conversation with Rader, citing confidentiality as his pastor. They spoke a day after Rader was formally charged with 10 counts of first-degree murder.

“His demeanor seemed to be OK,” Clark said. “He seems to be handling things as well as he can.”

For now, Rader remains president of Christ Lutheran Church Council, although he will eventually have to relinquish some church leadership positions, Clark said.

[vpintheak]

I am all for forgiveness, but "He will have to relenquish SOME Church duties?" Proof positive there are many Lutherans and Churches that do not follow scripture any longer.

[TXBubba]

Keeping him as a member is one thing. Keeping him in a leadership position is disgusting.

[zlala]

My hubby asked: if torture and murder doesn't get you kicked out of this church, what will?

[maestro]

For now, Rader remains president of the... 'ELCA'diversity'... Christ Lutheran Church Council, although he will eventually have to relinquish some church leadership positions ?????

Rader to get his very own 'ELCA' diversity T.V. show?

/sarcasm?

[sandbar]

>My hubby asked: if torture and murder doesn't get you >kicked out of this church, what will?

According to Jesus, nothing.

Didn't he command his followers to visit those in prison?

I'm not saying he should be a leader in the church or anything, but he shouldn't be kicked out and the pastor shouldn't turn his back on him either.

[TXBubba]

Jesus also says that if you think about murder in your mind you are as guilty of it as if you did the physical act. Makes me guilty I know. The church can still minister to him but they should boot him out of every church office asap.

[YankeeGirl]

"For now, Rader remains president of Christ Lutheran Church Council, although he will eventually have to relinquish some church leadership positions, Clark said."

Ya think?

[OldFriend]

Oh yes, John List's pastor tried to withhold his confession letter and spoke as a character witness at the trial of this person who murdered his own mother, wife, and three children.

Moved on to a new life in Colorado.

For shame.

The most this pastor should have said was NO COMMENT.

[Luke21]

There are requirements for church leadership found in First Timothy. This fellow if found guilty, has violated them. It's one thing to be welcomed into the congregation for we are all sinners, but if proven guilty, this man has no business anywhere near leading the flock of Christ.

Ministers are routinely dismissed for simple adultery. This man has very likely shed much innocent blood. If so, he is Satan's servant, not the Lord's, and the Church should act accordingly.

[sandbar]

>The church can still minister to him but they should boot >him out of every church office asap.

I agree, he should not hold church office.

[trebb]

I tend to agree with you, but I am also reminded of how Saul, who persecuted Christians, became Paul, who was chosen by the risen Christ to do good works. I know the parallels aren't there, but who are we to make the call?

That said, I can't conceive his church leaving him in any official positions. There are too many religions/churches tending to the apostate position today and they need to try to maintain credibility. I also remember God's instant judgement on Ananias and Sapphira (Acts 5) when they lied to the Holy Spirit. He needed to keep the early Church pure to give it a chance to grow, so they died upon the telling of the lie about how they had sold their property and were donating all the proceeds to the Church. Today's church could use some purification, but I'm not the one to decide...

God Bless

[pageonetoo]

1 Corinthians 5 1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. 2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. 6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? 7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: 8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: 10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

He should be tossed...

[OldFriend]

Richard List left a detailed confession. And yet the minister seemed to think he ought to go free......

[Mount Athos]

He should be allowed to belong to the church, but should be dumped from all leadership positions.

[vpintheak]

I agree with you, it is very frustrating to me though that so many people call themselves Christian, while outright disobeying and ignoring the Law and Gospel to fit their purposes. It makes us all look bad. I know we do the best we can, but who says I can't be frustrated?

[aimhigh]

He should be tossed...

This is a clear case where the church is able to distinguish between a wheat and a tare.

[pageonetoo]

I don't think Paul would distinguish much, between an adulterer, and a murderer. He has no place in the church. Not even in the pew!

Paul was clear that his little bit of evil could poison the whole of the body!

[hope]

The man needs to repent if not scripture is clear on how to handle him..Frankly, I think he's nuts or worse yet. demon possessed. The Pastor needs to have his head examined if he leaves this man in church leadership. Forgiveness is a command but, this guy will have to pay to society for his sin also.

[BlackVeil]

If this person has not confessed nor had a trial yet, the Church might wait for a proper official judgement.