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ROMAN OMEN IS POSITIVE
New York Post ^ | February 26, 2005

Posted on 02/26/2005 10:55:20 AM PST by nickcarraway

February 26, 2005 -- ROME — Does a stone carving in one of Rome's biggest cathedrals know whether Pope John Paul II will survive his latest health crisis? The monument to Pope Sylvester II, who ruled the Catholic Church 1,000 years ago, is said to moisten when the death of a pontiff is imminent.

But yesterday, a priest touched the carving in Rome's Basilica of St. John Lateran and confirmed it was dry — good news for the pope, who had windpipe surgery Thursday after being rushed to the hospital with breathing problems.

In the sacristy of St. John Lateran, the pope's "second cathedral" for his role as bishop of Rome, two elderly Italian nuns in gray habits said the monument's prophesying power was well documented.

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: catholic; johnpaulii; omen; pope; rome
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To: bondserv
I am of the opinion that the believers in heaven are similarly still subject to time constraints.

How can the Saints be face to face with our Lord and be constrained?

I will say, that just as one asks his brothers and sisters on earth to pray and intercede, one can also ask his bothers and sisters who have gone on.

41 posted on 02/26/2005 6:04:41 PM PST by don-o (Stop Freeploading. Do the right thing and become a Monthly Donor.)
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To: thoughtomator

You come in here and trash the Catholic Church as a bunch of idol worshippers.

Catholics believe in three types of prayer. Latria is the only form of prayer that is worship, and that belongs to God alone. The other two forms of prayer are to the Blessed Virgin Mary and the saints, but we do not worship them, as that would be blasphemy.


42 posted on 02/26/2005 6:21:40 PM PST by ndkos
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To: ndkos

Nonsense. Now you've borne false witness against me - no wonder there are so few real Christians left. Where have I labeled anyone, except those who believe that a graven image possesses supernatural abilities, as an idolater?


43 posted on 02/26/2005 6:32:19 PM PST by thoughtomator (Unafraid to be unpopular)
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To: nickcarraway

Are Catholics Christians?


44 posted on 02/26/2005 6:33:37 PM PST by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (Rush agrees with me 98.5% of the time!)
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To: thoughtomator

Well since almost all Catholics pray before icons (not TO icons) then we are all idolaters.

The icons don't posess any inate supernatural ability. They just remind us of a saint and help us sinners to imitate them in leading holy lives ourselves.


45 posted on 02/26/2005 6:42:44 PM PST by ndkos
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To: don-o
How can the Saints be face to face with our Lord and be constrained?

Would you say a believer in heaven is omnipotent, omniscient or omnipresent?

46 posted on 02/26/2005 6:48:29 PM PST by bondserv (Sincerity with God is the most powerful instigator for change! † [Check out my profile page])
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To: ndkos

In this case, the carving is alleged to have supernatural ability - specifically, the ability to fortell the health of the Pope. Do you agree that this is an accurate statement?


47 posted on 02/26/2005 6:52:37 PM PST by thoughtomator (Unafraid to be unpopular)
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To: thoughtomator

I doubt that what is said is true. Even if the carving did moisten before a Pope's death, God could be working through the carving. But like I said, I am very doubtful as most "supernatural" occurances turn out not to be supernatural after all.

If you ever are in Western Europe, check out some displays of incorrupt saints. God has shown His approval of these saints by preserving their bodies from decay. Most of them were buried in simple wooden caskets and with little to no embalming (but not all of them as Pope John XXIII was buried in a triple sealed air tight container). Even if you are not Catholic, it is something I hope you will check out.


48 posted on 02/26/2005 7:53:44 PM PST by ndkos
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To: ndkos

I saw some bodies on display in the Vatican... I was repulsed, for obvious reasons. I fail to see how faith is supported by the display of human corpses.


49 posted on 02/26/2005 8:43:56 PM PST by thoughtomator (Unafraid to be unpopular)
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To: thoughtomator

It's not required for you (or for Catholics even) to believe that incorruptibility is a miracle. What's more important is for us to reflect on their lives.


50 posted on 02/26/2005 8:54:11 PM PST by ndkos
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To: ndkos

Well, that's back into indifferent territory for me. I'll stand on my point that listening to carvings for clues on the Pope's future health is a superstition and constitutes idolatry.


51 posted on 02/26/2005 8:57:27 PM PST by thoughtomator (Unafraid to be unpopular)
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To: bondserv

Wow! My husband who is Catholic (I am not) and I debate this all the time. I think that's a great explanation.


52 posted on 02/26/2005 9:01:39 PM PST by TightyRighty
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To: nickcarraway
What is all this nonsense about idolatry thats just silly, the only statue I consult is that statue of Baal out in my garage. I am glad to report that after two consecutive chicken sacrifices it agrees with the Catholic statue. Thumbs up!....err.. Or was it hooves up? :)
53 posted on 02/26/2005 9:09:31 PM PST by dog breath
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To: TightyRighty
Wow! My husband who is Catholic (I am not) and I debate this all the time. I think that's a great explanation.

I have always regarded the problems the five of seven early churches in Chapter 3 & 4 of the Book of Revelation were indicative of how quickly the traditions of men can run amok.

The lesson we can take from Jesus' rebuke of these churches is that men are imperfect right out of the gate. Being so close to the resurrection as they were, one would think it would insulate them from those types of errors.

Any organization that devises traditions of men is going to steer off track and gradually be so far off that they become ineffectual. The Word of God is our anchor, not the leadership of men. The Sanhedrin in Christ's time had devised traditions that were extra-Biblical, and this angered Jesus as much as anything. "Have ye not read!"

The Biblical method that is prescribed is to check our leaders with scripture as the Bereans did with Paul. Paul commended their diligence, and he was an Apostle!

Act 17:10-11
11 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming [thither] went into the synagogue of the Jews.
11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Thank you for your encouragement.

54 posted on 02/26/2005 9:38:22 PM PST by bondserv (Sincerity with God is the most powerful instigator for change! † [Check out my profile page])
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